Saga 250cc- Keeps Stalling!

[lastmanout]

Wow, this is a classic case of customer 'NO SERVICE" so common these days. I have fixed a few lawn mowers, dirt bikes, cars scooters etc. over the years. If I didn't do my own maintenance, doubt I could afford having a bike or two. Sorry for your troubles. MAYBE you can find a local basement mechanic who knows how to fix scooters. They are pretty basic machines. Between a shop manual and the internet, I get a LOT of info and my repairs have worked out well. You should avoid these dealers, sounds like they know even less that I do... Poor service WITH attitude, boy that stinks

[Scooterchick]

I've answered an ad to sell it for a person who was lookimg for one "working or not" the ad said......HEY! THAT WOULD BE MINE! So, we will see if he is still interested. I'm sick of the whole mess, but am not willing to walk away giving them my almost 3700.00.

If I can sell on full disclosure, then I will. I don't need the headaches.

[bbishoppcm]

I personally know two Reflex owners and they've never had any issues with them. The Reflex has a few improvements over the now 26 year old Helix design, mainly higher top speed due to larger rear wheel (and better tire life), lower emissions due to increased exhaust temperatures, better instrumentation, optional ABS front brake, rear disc brake, and a few other things.

However, the Reflex can suffer from top-end failures if the head gasket fails due to the smaller exhaust valve (the very design change that allows higher exhaust temperatures to reduce emissions also causes extreme temperature stressing in the head, causing premature gasket failure. This can be prevented by re-torquing the head periodically, so I've read).

[fullmetalscooter]

Originally Posted by Scooterchick

it was the distributor that we called ourselves this morning. He refused to let us speak to the mechanic that worked on the bike there in Langely. The first thing he said to us after we identified ourselves was that he didn't ever want to see that bike back in his shop again. Then he went on to tell us that bad gas had been run through the bike. We told him about the gauge reading empty and when we went to fill it up it only took a gallon. We don't know what they had in it before we bought it. But it only had 19 k's on it when we purchased it. We went on to tell him that we have only filled it twice and both times we used 91 just as we were instructed.

He said it was almost ready and that when they got the bike and started it, that it started right up; which is the same thing the other guy said in Squamish. Then he told us that they had put 10 hours into servicing the bike. We asked exactly what was done to it?? He said he didn't have time to speak to us because he had customers that were walking out of the store. He also said that there were things that "should have been done" to the bike that were not done. My husband asked him what were they and who should have done them....he said "Jamie should know"...I don't know the guy, but I hear he is a pretty decent mechanic." So, the buck got passed once again to the dealer we purchased it from in Squamish.

We asked him about the "never wanting to see the bike in his shop again" comment and mentioned the 2 year warranty to him. He went on to tell us that the bike doesn't have a warranty! That one cannot be added now, and that it has to be purchased at the time the bike is registered. WE WERE SHOCKED! Seeing as the website clearly says that ALL their bikes come with a 2 year limited warranty. He said you have to "purchase" the warranty and that there was nothing in the records showing where we did. We told him there was nothing on the website that even "implied" we had to purchase it and that we had printed it out. Keep in mind that when we purchased the bike, the dealer in Squamish (Jamie) signed and dated the warranty paper and added the affective date of the warranty. So, to be told that we do not have one is .....well..suspect.

So, we asked again, about speaking to the mechanic who actually did the work. "he's too busy to speak to you and we don't speak to customers!" You need to speak to "Jamie" He should know all of this.! So, we are not wondering if the bike "started right up" then what was the 10 hours spent doing?? We could not get an answer from them. Everybody is passing the buck to the guy in Squamish, and he is blaming them for not telling him everything he needs to know.

I don't care what the outcome of this is at this point. We WILL file a complaint with the Better Business Bureau. This is the absolute worst customer service I have ever experienced. Nobody wants to take responsibility for selling us a peice of crap. The bike has spent more time "getting adjustments" then I have been able to acutally ride it. I have taken it out three times since I had it and had to take it back each time because it stalled either when I was in traffic (rolling on the highway) or when decelerating to a stop.

I told this to the guy in Langley and said..."I could have been killed! This is dangerous!"...His response..."well, I know it is. Sure it is, but I really have to go now. I have already had two customer walk out."

The bike is supposed to be back in Squamish Monday afternoon. We we asked by "Jamie" to call first Tuesday morning to make sure that it was in fact there before we came to pick it up.

what a mess. Chinese bike or not. Nobody should do business like this with their customers. My husband and I happen to be business owners in the lower mainland. We pride ourselves in good customer service as we know that your customers are the people who keep food on your table! Maybe Saga in Langely and Squamish don't need to pay their bills. So, they aren't concerned about customer service. The guys (both Jamie and this other "person") were only concerned about how much "time" THEY had put into repairs; which from our perspective have been substandard at best.

THAT FUCKING Bullshit HE is TELLING YOU> sorry for bad language but There is also a standard warranty with every bike by eveny company. I ve been to that shop twice and just though the front end staff was bad to. All I ask was to see if they have a Muffler exhaust clamp liek the one I had in my hand. Couldn't be bothered . I would post on Vancouver scooter Forum for all to see here http://www.vancouverscootering.com/Forum/. THe only people running bad gas through it would the dam dealers whom let it sit and turned over to demo it. If your really pissed off and want to post your story for the world to see . They ve don't own these 2 domain names. sagacanada.net and this one saga-canada.ca. As long as you don't say anything but the truth they can't sue.

[Scooterchick]

Well, you know we thought the same thing. The bike was sold to us NEW at the price the dealer charged us. We didn't haggle. He quoted the price with our trade in and that's what we gave him. So, I know that if nothing else in regard to the warranty, that it has to have at least ONE YEAR. We have only had it for just over a month now. So, that comment about not wanting to see it back in his shop is something he needs to take up with his mechanic that he "certified" in Squamish who after 4 tries of making his "adjustments" didn't know that the electric choke was not working! Not to mention all of the "other things" that he says the dealer should have known.

He was very rude to my husband; screaming at him over the phone and acting as if he had actually done us a favor by honoring a warranty that is posted on their website.

I'm glad that someone else has seen first hand for themselves how rude and unprofessional these people can be.

[fullmetalscooter]

Sorry but I stuck my nose into this by email them and asking the same question. Heres there answer which is yes one year. They guy beine an ass and thinking he ll get away with it. they email to me below. I really don't think the guys going to stay in business or in the long run it's going to hurt his sales. It's kind of like the guy whom sells used parts at super port motorcycle works in langely . Tried to buy bent bike and got turned down. ( great shop for bike parts from 1970 to Now. ) He Open up a shop in the same complex out of spite. No one whom deals with him once does it again. Don't dare to ask him to look up a part because he ll tell you to do it yourself at home.
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ ++++++++++++++++++++++++
Hi.

One year parts warranty on the engine and most electrical components.

Moving parts are not covered unless outright faulty.

Where are you located?

Thanks
Dan
Saga

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Date: Sat, 26 May 2012 20:49:46 -0700
From: davkennett
Subject: scooters
To: sales@sagacanada.ca

What is the standard warranty with all new scooters including old new stock if you don't buy the 2 year add on warranty?

[Scooterchick]

Well, like I said...he told us that our bike didn't have one. When we challenged him about his website, he said it is "available, but you have to buy it and you can't do it now. It has to be done when the bike is registered and bought at "full pop" . We took that to mean at full price; which as far as we were concerned, we bought the bike at the price they demanded, plus our trade in. Full price to us! I don't know what it was "supposed" to cost. It was 3 years old with 19k's on it that the dealer said was intended to be for 2010 even though he had it in 2009.

So, we asked how much for the 250cc. Did they have any more in stock other than that one because I preferred it in red or blue. He didn't, searched and couldn't fine one. So, we bought that one. The dealer in Squamish told us what the price was. We bought it at that price. They should have Paid "US" to take the bike off of their hands with all of that trouble we had with it.

Thanks for checking.

[BoscosHarley]

Originally Posted by Scooterchick

ok, So here is the latest.

Hubby and I took the bike out today. Started up just fine, but sounded a bit slow to me on the idle. Nevertheless, we went, topped if off with gas and went for a ride setting the trip meter before leaving. 21 k's later, the bike just quits on me. We got it started, but it sounded really low in idle again. We went about 5 or yards and boom.....just quit on me again while riding through a very crowed parking lot with lots of cars and people. Chris was ahead of me both times since I didn't know my way through the park.

We finally had to have it towed. The dealer refused to give us a refund and return our trade-in. He said they needed to send it back to the distributor who we got on the phone and complained to and we said that the bike has never run properly. He told the mechanic to bring it back to him and they would do the work on it. He says he has gone as far as he can go with what they trained him to do.

He rode it around a few times and it went just fine; even though we had just had it towed in. THEN, I said..." you need to ride it at about 20-30-k's and then let it idle for a minute. He did. It stalled. He tried to start it and it wouldn't until the 4th try. then he says "well, it seems to be fine now"....What a joke! And by the way, he refused to pay the tow on it as well. Good thing the towing company said they owed my husband a favor, so they waived the cost. (privately). I asked for a loaner bike; they refused. I told him they need to give me another bike or they need to give me my money back. They said they could not refund the money. Then went on to tell me that they didn't make any money on the sale. AND that they didn't get paid from their higher ups for the service and time that they put into working on it. Now, from where I'm sitting....the bike is under warranty. NOT MY PROBLEM IF THEY AGREED TO WORK FOR FREE!
I asked my husband if he signed something that waived a refund. He had not. I said again, clearly something is wrong. The mechanic(s) agreed, but said there was nothing else they could do. Now, remember...we gave him the bike this past Tuesday and it wasn't ready umtil yesterday. He told us it was fine. He drove it for 10 k's. I told him the problem is when you are starting or slowing down. It just abruptly shuts off.
Now, we had to leave it with them again. It's a holiday weekend here in Canada. So, it's sitting until next Wednesday to go to another city where the distributor is to be tested by THEIR mechanic. Who knows when it will come back. They have my money and my bike. I did take a video of us trying to start it, where we were, us trying to start it several more times before the tow truck guy started putting it up on the rack.

I'm thinking small claims court. I'm digusted. I'm soooo done.

There are two sides to every story, so you should get the facts before making any judjements and false acusations. WE have done everything we can to be accomodating to this customer and the scooter was working fine the last time we adjusted it. It seems to me that the problem this time was caused by bad gas, as it was riding ok, untill new gas was put in at the gas station,And 21kms later it has problems. Also we as a dealer dont have to pay for the towing of the scooter, it is the owners responsability to pay for that and the scooter started just fine as it came out of the tow truck, and it did not take 4 trys to start it did stall at low idle and it started at the second try,. There was no request for a loaner bike as the customer knows that there are no other 250 cc bikes available, We reserve the right to try to fix the scooter and that is the way it is. As for the time it takes to get it donne , we have other customers that have made appointments for theyr bikes to be serviced and we can not drop everything to work on a scooter that just came in at a moments notice.We have taken just about enough abuse from this customer , she even lied about the price , but we have our records and we can show that in court ,if she so wishes. At any rate we have and are doing all that we can to solve the problem and it is solved now. I have been in business for six years and never had a problem with this scooters untill now, and I have worked on motorcycles and cars for the last tirthy years with a clear reputation, we care about our work and reputation and also about our customers, but please insults dont get you anywhere.

[deezildennis]

Dun dun dun!

[BoscosHarley]

Originally Posted by Scooterchick

Well, like I said...he told us that our bike didn't have one. When we challenged him about his website, he said it is "available, but you have to buy it and you can't do it now. It has to be done when the bike is registered and bought at "full pop" . We took that to mean at full price; which as far as we were concerned, we bought the bike at the price they demanded, plus our trade in. Full price to us! I don't know what it was "supposed" to cost. It was 3 years old with 19k's on it that the dealer said was intended to be for 2010 even though he had it in 2009.

So, we asked how much for the 250cc. Did they have any more in stock other than that one because I preferred it in red or blue. He didn't, searched and couldn't fine one. So, we bought that one. The dealer in Squamish told us what the price was. We bought it at that price. They should have Paid "US" to take the bike off of their hands with all of that trouble we had with it.

Thanks for checking.

The warranty is available at the time of purchase. The full price is regular $ 3999.00 plus Shipping and PDI. and all aplicable taxes and documentation and eviromental fees. The price that you got it for was $2999.00 minus $1000.00 for you trade and then we only charged for the shipping fee, plus all the taxes and documentation and enviromental fees . And we dont pay people to take our scooters. WE sell them . we are a business with a good reputation ,so please dont make false acusations or damage our reputation, it is A crime in canada.

[hexnut]

[Scooterchick]

We paid the price we were quote and told we had a warranty on a paper that was signed by the dealer. Period. Then told by the distributor that we didn't. Go figure.We never, ever put bad gas in this scooter.Certainly not intentionally! It sat in the shop for 2 years plus. Who knows what was put in it before we got it? We Always used high test as we are not interested in wasting money on self inflicted repairs. But it appears we may have wasted money anway...:-(.

Be it as it may... we will not allow ourselves to be treated this way again. We purchased the product in good faith, paid what we were told to pay, with a warranty and have had problems from the very first day of it shutting off before we even got it out of the lot. It has been returned several times. We have tried to be reasonable and patient to no avail.

As as we are concerned... This is over.

[BoscosHarley]

Originally Posted by fullmetalscooter

since i m in bc I ll call bullshit on the dealer. Ether he fixes it or under BC law they ve sold you a bike , car etc that is unfit for use which means you can take to small claims if they refuse to give back your money. it's to bad the seven day grace time is gone by because in BC you can return any car or bike and cancel the deal. See the car book Lemon aid for more info. They have to fix it or end up paying you for the work to fix it . the warranty is valid is the Canada and the USA . Here the link for all the saga shops in Bc http://www.sagacanada.ca/dealers2.asp?prov=bri the warany link say it valid at any shop. http://www.sagacanada.ca/warranty.asp . Hopefully you ve got a another shop with in an 1 hours or so . In Vancouver / Surrey your got http://www.daytonamotorsports.ca/cus...p?pg=vancouver . At least they are a true motorcycle shop . They sell other brands Like Yamaha etc. ( I Hope it's not them) As to the helix i ride one and they are great. it's 400 bucks to import one from the USA. You ll find them in Seattle for 700 to 3 grand. What shop are we talking about so people in bc can avoid it? I can't thinking the dumb asses at the shop you bought it didn't bother with a real through going over before they tried to sell it to you. There s only so many small thing i feel that this could be. Carb needs cleaning and maybe a rejetting. As other have said fuel filter , fuel pump. Bystarter , small chance of a bad CDI. A real shop would have this fixed in less then a day. I i would tell the shop ether fix the bike or refund you . if they don't you ll be pursuing legal action against them. it's 50 bucks for small claims.

Well since I am in BC. I think that you should know both sides of the story. If you would like you could call me. just look up jandrmotorsports ltd. 604-892-1522. before you call BULLSHIT ON THE DEALER. I dont have to take the abuse from any customer,.

[Scooterchick]

ok, Well maybe not over as of yet. There is a glimmer of hope yet. We just had a good conversation with the dealer who has assured us that he has our best interest at heart and will do everything he can to get the bike running. Yes, it stalled again before we even took it off the lift...TWICE and he had trouble getting it restarted. He told us that the last thing he wants to see is one of his customers getting injured.

So, failing anyone being able to get this figured out, He has agreed to give us our trade in back and our money. All we want is the bike fixed. I think that is all EVERYONE wants at this point. It is a mystery why this thing is so temperamental. Nevertheless it is unsafe and if it cannot be repaired, we are just happy that he has in fact agreed to refund us our trade in and money back and that there hasn't been any loss of life or limb.

[BoscosHarley]

Originally Posted by fullmetalscooter

THAT FUCKING Bullshit HE is TELLING YOU> sorry for bad language but There is also a standard warranty with every bike by eveny company. I ve been to that shop twice and just though the front end staff was bad to. All I ask was to see if they have a Muffler exhaust clamp liek the one I had in my hand. Couldn't be bothered . I would post on Vancouver scooter Forum for all to see here http://www.vancouverscootering.com/Forum/. THe only people running bad gas through it would the dam dealers whom let it sit and turned over to demo it. If your really pissed off and want to post your story for the world to see . They ve don't own these 2 domain names. sagacanada.net and this one saga-canada.ca. As long as you don't say anything but the truth they can't sue.

Please tell me wich shop you have been to, and we dont BULLSHIT OUR CUSTOMERS. we take pride in our work and in our name,. AGAIN you should know the full story from both sides to make a fair coment.