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Old 05-20-2012, 07:44 PM   #46
high dangler
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nothing all that bad about air cooled.
Its simple and low tech.
Usually does not come with a lot of performance
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Old 05-21-2012, 06:07 AM   #47
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Originally Posted by 100mpg View Post
really? not an opinion, its a fact. I'm surprised you didn't know that.
you can look for it here about 4/5th down the page.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Motorcycle_engine

its not shitty engineering, its just cheaper.
I'm very well aware of what you're referring to but, as an example, some are worse than others.
My 97 DR when it was totaled out at around 50,000 miles, I tore it down and looked at Specs inside the engine/transmission and everything was still in spec. = no real wear that would warrant any replacement of parts if I decided to use the engine in something else.
On the other hand, the 78 CB400 Honda I had, was running like shit by 20,000 miles and it used more oil than gas.

My point and expectations on this thread, were to see if there was any real correlation between old tech iron-lined jug type engines, being more prone to excessive wear than those with modern NikaSil coated alloy cylinders and no iron liners.

My little TU250 is strictly air cooled (but does have EFI) and has seen hours of Interstate cruising while being held W.O.T (she's NiksSil plated)
and is currently at 11,000 miles. She burns no oil at all! (I change it every 3,000 miles)
I'll also mention that she's my commuter and has seen winter use, starting her up at 4:30 am when it's 15 degrees outside and I've pulled away as soon as she's running and no more than 5 minutes later...I'm zooming down the highway WOT at 70 mph.
What I've found with the newer style engines that lack the old iron liner systems, is that they shed heat very well and don't suffer from temperature variations as much.

What you point out 100mpg, might be true for the old tech engines but, I'm not so sure that with the advances in metallurgy, NikaSil plating and EFI ...that what you point out, remains as "true" today as it was 20 yrs ago.

Someone else brought up a model on this thread that does have liquid cooling that's remained virtually unchanged for quite some time that, still uses an iron liner in its jug.
Coincidentally, its been known to be an oil burner in some cases so, I'd have to argue that perhaps some modern purely air cooled designs ARE better AND suffer less temperature fluctuations than older tech liquid cooling.
please note: I state the last paragraph as hypothetical, not factual

....is what I'm trying to point out making sense as a counter argument to what you've stated?

Ps. No hostility implied here at all.....just a quest for some stories.




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Old 05-21-2012, 08:03 AM   #48
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CB125S, piston seized on a highway while riding during a quite warm day.

DT250, didn't like to run properly when it got hot.

CB350F, when it got super hot I'd get a slight oil spray on my right hand side, making my sock oily.

XR500, was a bitch to hot start after having dumped it.

Hyper 1100S, didn't like slow traffic on hot days. Power delivery would diminish as cylinder head temperatures shot up.
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Old 05-21-2012, 12:26 PM   #49
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Hell, I don't like slow traffic on hot days for the same reason.
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Old 05-21-2012, 06:52 PM   #50
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I prefer to deal with whatever could come up on an air cooled engine and there isnt much if properly cared than to risk a water pump failure.

If a water cooled bike was ever treated with regular water you are in trouble and its more common than one would think.

Of course im talking when buying a used bike because thats what i buy, i just dont like modern bikes.
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Old 05-21-2012, 06:56 PM   #51
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Originally Posted by Yossarian™ View Post
CB125S, piston seized on a highway while riding during a quite warm day.

DT250, didn't like to run properly when it got hot.

CB350F, when it got super hot I'd get a slight oil spray on my right hand side, making my sock oily.

XR500, was a bitch to hot start after having dumped it.

Hyper 1100S, didn't like slow traffic on hot days. Power delivery would diminish as cylinder head temperatures shot up.
Poor maintenance will fuck up any bike.
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Old 05-21-2012, 08:06 PM   #52
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Nothing. Love just about anything air cooled.

Though, I must say, my XR6 gets hot on dual sport rides, which worries me. Working on an oil cooler setup for the upcoming summer. I actually melted the tab on the heat shield last summer (flat black pipe keeps quite a bit of heat).
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Old 05-21-2012, 08:07 PM   #53
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These people seem like bottom-feeders. I got a chuckle out of one of their background images....
Of course they are. Here is another image of Glen Owen Esq., a motorcycle racer.

I figure, once he crashes, he is going to sue the T-shirt maker. Or, if he sticks his head into an opposing vehicle (notice how close he is to center line in a left lean), he'll sue the helmet manufacturer. Someone's gotta pay.

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Old 05-21-2012, 08:15 PM   #54
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Had a 2006 Ducati S2R Monster that was such a fine bike. At 4500 miles I had a compression test done, and the rear cylinder was about 20lbs lower.

If it's related to the cooling system, that sucks.
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Old 05-21-2012, 08:21 PM   #55
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Don't hate air cooled bikes, but I've learned to appreciate water cooled fuel injected ones.

Nice having approximately the same performance with changes in altitude and temperature and season.

Certainly some manufacturers havn't been able to solve the reliability issues with water cooling - (BMW & KTM ) but current generation Japanese bikes seem fine.

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Old 05-22-2012, 02:12 AM   #56
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Originally Posted by rivercreep View Post


Ps. No hostility implied here at all.....just a quest for some stories.

.
ah ha...ok I thought you were being sarcastic.

I don't hate air cooled, there are definite advantages. Its hard to poke a hole in a radiator if you don't have one and if you did in a few locations I have been in, its over. Good thing I didn't have one!
But water cooled and fuel injected, run like a swiss watch. And Air cooled, no rad, no water pump, no hoses...KISS.
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Old 05-22-2012, 05:18 AM   #57
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November of 2005, '97 Bandit 600, stopped traffic in LA area, 2 up with the pillion not keen on me filtering, started pinging so bad I could not get the bike to move with both of us on it. I had to push it across 4 or 5 lanes of traffic to get to the shoulder. 45 mins later it was 'just ride-able' still pinging and having no power. Made my appointment with the British Consulate for my wife's Visa by 8 minutes. If we had missed it it would have taken another 4 weeks to get a new appointment and cost us several hundred if not thousand to get back to LA from the PNW. Last time I rode a Air/Oil cooled bike 2 up.

Might be fine for solo but for the 2 of us, me 6'1" 210lbs in my skin, her 5'10" and a bit more than 150lbs, this was almost catastrophic.

My £0.02

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Old 05-22-2012, 05:59 AM   #58
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Originally Posted by 100mpg View Post
Also, the engine (internally) is much quieter with a wall of sound deadening water around it.
Have you heard my Conncours?


I think the number one reason people hate it, has to be that Harleys are air cooled, so it must be bad.
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Old 05-22-2012, 07:06 AM   #59
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Quote:
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I think the number one reason people hate it, has to be that Harleys are air cooled, so it must be bad.
I've never thought of that point. Might have some merit to it in some people's minds. Espically anyone that has seen or heard a rear cylinder overheating, although I don't believe that's as common as people think. I've personally heard of it once, I talked to a guy whose dyna overheated the rear and burned a valve.
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Old 05-22-2012, 08:47 AM   #60
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visa versa

I've had more instances making me hate liquid cooled than air cooled. My 81 cb650 air cooled has NEVER over heated even in slow traffic on a hot day. My liquid cooled KLX has overheated on me twice as a result of sitting at a stop light (both times my fault for not changing my coolant ratio soon enough in the summer time ) Well, take that forum topic!
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