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Old 06-22-2012, 05:36 PM   #61
Eddieb
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I have ruled out buying a 350 Ducati as the one on TM has hit 8k and not met reserve....
Thanks, I hadn't seen that. Hopefully that's good news for the value of my 250 narrow case then. Nice race bike but very unoriginal.

Bidding is now at $8500 and within 15% of reserve, so ~9500ish.
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Old 06-22-2012, 06:33 PM   #62
Voltaire
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Originally Posted by Box'a'bits View Post
My understanding was that the R45 was just a sleeved down R65 engine. The R45 was for German licencing & insurance purposes, & had a limited power output (27ps?). They were sssslooooow.

The test would be looking at the part nos however.
True....but look at the size of the R65 valves in comparison, 40 mm inlets and 32 mm carbs hmmmmm. I had an r50/5 and it was slow, the r65 would probably keep up with an R75/5......
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Old 06-22-2012, 06:49 PM   #63
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Hmmmm. I've got to pick up my van now with the heads in it. I got some valve lapping compenents so will have a little look at them.
I've been to 2 of my mech mates & neither of them have proper bore measuring things - they say they don't ever use them anymore. I think I'll have to take them to a specialist engine builder to get an accurate measurement.
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Old 06-22-2012, 06:50 PM   #64
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True....but look at the size of the R65 valves in comparison, 40 mm inlets and 32 mm carbs hmmmmm. I had an r50/5 and it was slow, the r65 would probably keep up with an R75/5......
What kind of top speed have you got or reckon you'd get out of the 65?
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Old 06-22-2012, 07:10 PM   #65
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I briefly ran it to 140, I'd say 160 would be top....motor sounds busy...but I'm used to the 900...different animal due to stroke.
If an R65 could be sleeved to 72mm ...may have to pocket out the top of the bore slightly for valve clearance, I'd day with the 40 mm inlets and some 36mm carbs it could be a screamer.....all hypothetical of course.
Then it could be dressed up in /5 or /6 clothes and raced in the pre 76 500 class.....just typing out loud here
Weight is the problem with BMW's and transmission losses.....you can't get past that easily.

Also like the idea of GS ifying the R65......
4 rib hub...split it ( as they are made in two halfs) and machine it into a 3 rib and bung a 21" rim on it.... that way the spokes clear the brembos.....
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Old 06-22-2012, 07:36 PM   #66
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Also like the idea of GS ifying the R65......
4 rib hub...split it ( as they are made in two halfs) and machine it into a 3 rib and bung a 21" rim on it.... that way the spokes clear the brembos.....
I was just looking into that... Except I want a 19” wheel. Currently pondering whether it’s more cost effective to buy a whole (R80ST) wheel or have one built around a 3 rib hub. Doesn’t help that all of these parts would probably come from overseas. That or jealously guarded here.
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Old 06-22-2012, 08:19 PM   #67
innathyzit
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Originally Posted by Voltaire View Post
I briefly ran it to 140, I'd say 160 would be top....motor sounds busy...but I'm used to the 900...different animal due to stroke.
If an R65 could be sleeved to 72mm ...may have to pocket out the top of the bore slightly for valve clearance, I'd day with the 40 mm inlets and some 36mm carbs it could be a screamer.....all hypothetical of course.
Then it could be dressed up in /5 or /6 clothes and raced in the pre 76 500 class.....just typing out loud here
Weight is the problem with BMW's and transmission losses.....you can't get past that easily.

Also like the idea of GS ifying the R65......
4 rib hub...split it ( as they are made in two halfs) and machine it into a 3 rib and bung a 21" rim on it.... that way the spokes clear the brembos.....
Yes you can make scallops in the bore to accomodate the valves. In terms of flow it will be less than with the bigger bore because the bore will 'shroud" the flow on the inlet especially. i.e. will cause a high pressure area in the side of the port nearest the bore as the air comes out of the valve slowing down the flow. Will probly still fill the cylinder quicker than standard though, maybe.
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Old 06-23-2012, 03:10 AM   #68
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Very good vid of measuring cylinder bores

http://www.motocrossparts.co.nz/moto...rts.php?id=128

Very good explanation of piston wear & measurement

http://smallengineinformation.com/?page_id=500

I kept wondering what they were going on about talking about outside micrometers - the only ones I had seen were small ones measuring shims for bucket & shim valves. I had to ggole them to realise they made big ones too - facepalm....

Going down to lap the valves. There is some interesting things giong on with them which I'll post up later. 'They may force the decision on whether I go ahead with this project' says semi-logical Padmei.
Spending-too-much-time-looking-at-the-internet Padmei will be along later to sort him out.

Padmei screwed with this post 06-23-2012 at 06:27 PM
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Old 06-23-2012, 10:29 PM   #69
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Had another look at the heads this avo. i began measuring the valves yesterday just for something to write down & found out that the valves sizes don't match.

Anyway heres what the heads looked like before I started anything.



Exhaust side looked pretty hot.




Comparing the 2 exhaust valves. They weren't in too bad shape as the carbon buildup softens the landing of the valve. There was a bit of cupping on the inlet. I have read that airheads between 81-84 had very hard valve seat material that the valves couldn't handle apparently so they changed it. I would have thought the valves would have been a reasonably better sacrificial item than the seat so I could see why they did it.



A bit of cupping on one exhaust valve





I gave the valves bit of a lap dance & bit of a clean. if you check out the LHS exhaust (bottom left of the pic) you can see the lapping marks where the valve seals really deep into the seat compared to the RHS lapping marks which sit pretty much the middle of the seat. This is an interesting point when you look at the leak test at the end.



Then I measured the valves again to confirm my suspicions.

Inlet valves should be 40mm however on my one the LHS 37.8mm & RHS 39.28mm

Exhaust valves should be 36mm but once again the LHS 33.85mm & RHS35.88mm

Heres some comparison pics.





Totally different valves


Anyway after wrestling with my welding vice/spring compressor I got them back together & poured some fuel into the inlet then outlet ports to see if they would leak.

The LHS inlet leaked a very small amount after about 30-40secs & the exhaust was minimal.
The RHS inlet was pissing fuel out whereas the exhaust was minimal.

RHS


I'll be back after I get my calculator out

Padmei screwed with this post 06-23-2012 at 10:36 PM
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Old 06-23-2012, 10:58 PM   #70
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Good fun aye?

That valve on the lhs looks like it has not been closing proper going by the colour of the seating area. Probly tight tappet.
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Old 06-24-2012, 03:49 AM   #71
Voltaire
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A Google search tells me that your valves are from different years....
How much sideways slop in the guides?
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Old 06-24-2012, 01:04 PM   #72
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Not sure on sideways slop. i didn't measure the dia. Some were firmish sliding into the guides where others weren't.
I'm at crossroads with what to do with the bike at the mo. i'll rescue the block, barrels & pistons & take them to an engine shop to have them properly measured.
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Old 06-24-2012, 07:56 PM   #73
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Crossroads are good with Eric Clapton on guitar.....less so on projects....
Once you get professionals to look at stuff they have to err on the side of caution....I bet many a serviceable part has ended up in the bin to avoid " you did the for me last year and....."
On the R90 the original 1973 pistons were borderline and there was a bit of pitting on the bore....the piston even needed a ring gap machined out a packer fitted...common practice in the old days I'm told.
Sometimes it smokes a bit on start up but no rattles and runs a treat.
I saw a quote on the Old Skool forum I liked...." Free bikes end up costing lots" or words to that effect.....
But hey I was told recently I was a glass half empty sort of guy....
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Old 07-02-2012, 11:41 PM   #74
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Brrrrm brrrm brrm brrm


BRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRMMMMMMMM MMMMMMMMMM........................................ ...BRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRM


Great acceleration but the bloody 1st to 2nd change needs some work.





Frick me i'm bored. But I'm NOT going to do all the paperwork that's piled up.
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Old 07-03-2012, 01:06 AM   #75
Voltaire
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Frick me i'm bored. But I'm NOT going to do all the paperwork that's piled up.

Oh no.....your not self employed are you?
I was for a few years and its taken ages to get IRD of my case...
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