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Old 06-18-2012, 06:40 PM   #91
Snowy
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I have it on good authority the Triumph is no contest to the F8 off road. The Triumph has the goods on the F8 on road. For the average punter it's probably a close call. But for someone with a dirt background the BumW takes the crown.

Sad really. If the Brits could up the game just a tad...give Jerry something to aim for...eh wot?

Get rid of the one piece frame for a start. That'll bring down the insurance costs.

For the life of me I can't see why BumW went away from the smaller boxer engines. The pic I posted above is of effectively a baby HP2. It felt lighter than my DR 650 to ride (apparently it weights approx170kg), made around 100hp, and had 300mm front and rear travel.

Not an enduro, not a "dirt bike", but a serious "Safari/Rally Raid" machine.

The 450s in this event all weight around the same or at least comparable with their full load out of fuel and nav gear. But the BMW handles so much better than an over loaded, overstressed 450.

I know I was spewing after buying the F8, and finding it not to my liking, that the HP2 had been discontinued here, and that anyone selling one 2nd hand wanted new price (or more in one case I've seen) for them.

So that leaves me with the option of buying a repairable write off R1200gs and building my own.

Which is an idea that just keeps haunting me. Teasing me....lingering in my sub conscious....mmmm...1200 goodness.....dirt bike suspension......aarrgghhlllll....

Maybe soon...
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Old 06-23-2012, 12:45 AM   #92
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dirt...

Great thread, I have been riding dirt bikes since I was a little kid. I'm 51 now still riding hard on my DRZ 400, I remember hitting the dirt first time on my 1150GS thinking how will this tank handle the dirt. Many thousands of dirt km's later the bike loves it and I love it.

I sadly moved the 1150 on and am now on an 800GS (goes to even more places). The point is because I ride dirt on dirt bikes I know and understand the limitations of bike like the GS's. Saying that I am constantly surprised of their capabilities.

My challenge these days is that my wife is on a 658 (coming off a CRF 230) having limited off-road experience, so I can appreciate the challenges that non-dirt riders have when going off road.

We live in Australia and next month we are off on a 5,500km trip (3,500 mile) and most of that will be on dirt and carrying fuel. We have done our homework, so we will be fine. Like every thing in life there is a balance, a trade-off if you like, BMW GS's and riding skills included.
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Old 06-23-2012, 03:35 AM   #93
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Take pictures, video and write it up. Please?
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Old 06-23-2012, 09:55 AM   #94
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Originally Posted by oruro View Post
Great thread, I have been riding dirt bikes since I was a little kid. I'm 51 now still riding hard on my DRZ 400, I remember hitting the dirt first time on my 1150GS thinking how will this tank handle the dirt. Many thousands of dirt km's later the bike loves it and I love it.

I sadly moved the 1150 on and am now on an 800GS (goes to even more places). The point is because I ride dirt on dirt bikes I know and understand the limitations of bike like the GS's. Saying that I am constantly surprised of their capabilities.

My challenge these days is that my wife is on a 658 (coming off a CRF 230) having limited off-road experience, so I can appreciate the challenges that non-dirt riders have when going off road.

We live in Australia and next month we are off on a 5,500km trip (3,500 mile) and most of that will be on dirt and carrying fuel. We have done our homework, so we will be fine. Like every thing in life there is a balance, a trade-off if you like, BMW GS's and riding skills included.

I am in a similar prediciment with my wife with her 658, but is is her first "off road" bike. Looking back, I really should have steered her toward a DRZ or something smaller. But to my amazement, over the last year, with a little re-gearing, she has come leaps and bounds and is getting much more confident off road.

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Old 06-25-2012, 01:43 AM   #95
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Since BMW already has got real enduro bikes (or maybe we should say Husqvarna = bmw dropped their own enduros since husqvarna became part of BMW), I hope they don't try to make a 800cc enduro. I hope they continue their path of making great adventure / dual sport bikes. Bikes you can ride on most enduro trials if needs be (allthough much slower than an enduro bike).

For a new model they just need to make a minor facelift and upgrade some of the designs and components. I think the engine will stay (apart from maybe some minor modifications).

Now that Öhlins are releasing their own f800gs specific cartridge (plug and play for real - not the twalcom thingie) I suspect (hope) they won't make any major modifications to the suspension. They can make the stock one better by adding adjustments but the size and tubing could remain. The new REAL f800gs Öhlins cartridge will be on the market autumn 2012.

They had the 650 x-challange and it didn't sell like the f800gs. If you want more pure off road capabilities you can buy the KTM690 or the Husqvarna TE630 http://www.motorcyclingmag.com/2010_...TE_630_Preview Both are great bikes and they can keep higher speed where the f800gs starts to slow down. But as you can see by the design and weight and (lack of) features of the Husqvarna and KTM - those bikes lack some of the DUAL aspects of the f800gs. Dual, imho, does not simply mean a street legal enduro - it means a bike that can provide equal amount of fund on- and off the pavement.

So let's hope that BMW continue to provide great dual sport adventure bikes. If anyone want to make it more off road capable there are many vendors that provide accessories. But if you are venturing for the more extreme off road it might be better to make a lighter more enduro-like bike an adventure bike.
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Old 06-25-2012, 04:19 AM   #96
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Now that Öhlins are releasing their own f800gs specific cartridge (plug and play for real - not the twalcom thingie)
They are?

When?



Thanks....
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Old 06-25-2012, 06:00 AM   #97
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Now that Öhlins are releasing their own f800gs specific cartridge (plug and play for real - not the twalcom thingie) I suspect (hope) they won't make any major modifications to the suspension. They can make the stock one better by adding adjustments but the size and tubing could remain. The new REAL f800gs Öhlins cartridge will be on the market autumn 2012.

Is there any info on these

I have started to investigate suspension upgrades and for the forks have found 2 Ohlins setups,
1 is the Twalcom TTX cartidge kit, which is possibly a self install $1800US
2 is from Ohlins North America, the NIX cartidge, $1650US, $350US Labor

the TTX looks like it has preload, compression and rebound adjustments on both legs, the NIX has preload on both, compression on one and rebound on the other.

is what you are hinting at one of these or something else?

I havn't found much info on a racetech offering (I'm waiting on a reply from them), Traxxion has 2 setups (street or dirt), the Bitubo seem to have a short life (and are not very serviceable).

At this point I will probably go with Traxxion because they seem to be a good choice with price etc.
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Old 06-25-2012, 06:15 AM   #98
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I've held off on a front end rebuild. I want to do it so bad, but I don't really want to completely change the front set up doing it.

I have 2 front ends waiting for the attempt. A Showa and an Ohlins. I'm hoping someone comes up with something for the standard forks and it's reasonable in price.

Because once I start down the transplant road, there aint no turning back.
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Old 06-25-2012, 07:53 AM   #99
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[QUOTE=Snowy;18986960
Because once I start down the transplant road, there aint no turning back.[/QUOTE]


Other than the Bitubo, I don't think there is any cartridge kit that is reversible.

so no going back there either.

I don't have the time (or knowledge) to engineer in a replacement fork.
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Old 06-25-2012, 10:20 AM   #100
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My biggest complaint is the forks. You cannot make a 1 size fits all suspension, but that is what BMW did. I do not mind changing out springs, but when you do, you have to address the valving to accommodate the spring. By saving a few bucks, BMW made something that probably could be done rather cheaply, into an expensive after market fix.

Another issue I "fixed" was the abrupt throttle and tall first gear. A combo fuel module and G2 throttle tube dealt with the slow speed throttle problem. In the process I found that this bike will lug at low rpms. I took off my 15 tooth sprocket. For what I do, I have enough power at low rpm to go where I used it previously. Still not a dirt bike.

I think at some point BMW will intro the 900 motor into the existing frame and body style. HP sells. I suspect some cam and valve mods to keep its current character. I hope they are listening about the suspension, a bike of this cost, should not have throwaway suspension.

The biggest issue is weight. You could go the Touratect rte. Carbon exhaust, Lithium battery, replace the catalytic converter with headers, single disc front brakes, narrower/lighter rims. You can probably shave some ounces off the hubs. BMW won't do that, but the owner could if money was no object.

I fear that they will turn the bike into a more street orientated bike. That seems to be what normally happens. From a sales context that is really who buys these bikes. Just look at the farkle list.
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Old 06-25-2012, 01:15 PM   #101
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Here is a link to the Touratech video what F800 will do with a proper rider. Not all of us have the skills of a Johan Street.
http://www.touratech-usa.com/Adventu...ire-BMW-F800GS
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Old 06-25-2012, 02:36 PM   #102
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No, this guy has built these for years. He has this one that is raced in the Australian Safari each year for about the last 10 I think. My mate was trying to tee me up as the rider this year, but I talked myself out of it. I took it for a spin early last year as part of the audition for the part. It helps if your friend that has talked you up shares this with you before you talk to the bloke supplying the ride. I thought we were just shooting the breeze and kicking tyres.

I, for one, sir, am damn glad you decided not to
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Old 06-25-2012, 03:44 PM   #103
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This is the version I had in mind: http://www.touratech-usa.com/Adventu...GS-Enduro-Bike

Your statement of not having the skills is my point. Most of us are like that. That is the market the Adventure bikes are aimed at, average riders.

BMW is not giving up market share to cater to a smaller group who really want a big dirt bike with street pretensions. My gripe is they made it more expensive for some of us tweeners to accomplish.

I read of the old cliche of a good rider being able to ride any bike fast. The reverse of that, is an average rider can ride a bike designed for dirt easier.
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Old 06-25-2012, 04:05 PM   #104
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Pretty much, yeah. The whole reason I redesigned the DR I have from the ground up was that I could then use it for something it wasn't designed to do...trail ride.

Yes, it has limitations, but it does the task just like a 450 once you get your head around making a big bike work in the dirt. It is actually, at trail weight, the same weight as a 450 Safari bike. So it actually makes a good practice bike given the level of maintenance and the fact it has a 450s suspension and geometry.

The thing that gets me with the F800 is that I can see the potential. It rides very much like a standard DR in the dirt, if not better.

So having taken one of those and made it a contender, and knowing how little it takes, it frustrates me beyond description that BMW wont ultimately realise the potential of the F800.

If that makes sense.

I can see it, I can almost touch it...just..out...of..reach....
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Old 06-26-2012, 09:40 AM   #105
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The world premiere for the öhlins plug and play cartridges for f800gs was during adventure days (BMW and Touratech main sponsors) in säfsen sweden around the 17th of june where 700 adventure bikes meet up for guided tours, good food and company.

They had a tripple black f800gs equiped with the new cartridges as well as the already existing rear shock from öhlins. It was available for free test drives until 1600 every day but I was so overbooked on all the great tours that I never had the time to test it ://
(although I had the time to let Öhlins main mechanic setup my stock rear suspension)

I did however talk with the Öhlins people during the evenings and they confirmed that this is a plug and play specific cartridge for f800gs that wont require any permanent changes or machining on the bike as the others do.

It will apparently be available in stores during fall 2012.

I beleive the cost will be around 1200 euros but I cannot confirm that. You can swap them your self if you follow the instructions already available on youtube (not from öhlins though).

It will be an official Öhlins product and as such the first from öhlins for this bike. They also let us know that they are going to release a similar cartridge for the triumph 800. Since that whole bike is a carbon copy of the BMW I suspect it wont require that much changes for öhlins...

Another world premiere during Adventure Days was the new garmin zumo.



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