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Old 06-17-2012, 12:36 PM   #76
CafeRacer99 OP
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Idle View Post
Good post!

Wondering if you had a chance to air down your tyres yet? If not, you wont know what kind of slopes you and your bike are capable of. Best to practice acents and decents on your terms. If you find yourself in a pickle one day you can proceed with confidence knowing that you can easily make it down that hill, and back up if need be.

I assume you are carrying a pump. I use a roadbike frame pump, a small one about 18" long.
I did get a chance to try that. I posted this link earlier: http://advrider.com/forums/showthread.php?t=798470

Before I let the air out it was like riding on marbles. I really noticed the difference.
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Old 06-17-2012, 12:42 PM   #77
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Originally Posted by tedder View Post
This is completely missing the point. The bikes recommended aren't necessarily what "we" own, they are what "we" recommend for learning how to ride on dirt.

If you want to get into a size-of-my-dick contest I'm sure many people here have fantastic stories about how they've ridden and/or destroyed big pigs on gnarly offroad. That's missing the point.

Wish you the best.
No, your point was clear. Ride the bike you suggest or fail. I got it.

The dick-size reference says more about how you view this subject than me.
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Old 06-17-2012, 01:17 PM   #78
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Originally Posted by Kommando View Post
Noob technique: Whenever practical, come to a complete stop at the top of the hill, before starting down. A "California roll" doesn't cut it.
Disagree. No reason to stop, the goal is to RIDE down the hill not STOP down the hill. Noobs who stop before a descent may never make the descent.

Quote:
Select the lowest gear that will not lock the rear wheel.
Many of the big adventure twins have road-oriented gearing that is too stiff to idle down something really gnarly and slow. The rider will need to clutch or else be fighting forward thrust, or stall. But hey if ya stall then ya have to clutch to keep rolling. (I don't advise neutral as if the bikes gets away from you, it could gain speed and crash hard before it stops.)
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Old 06-17-2012, 01:46 PM   #79
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Originally Posted by viverrid View Post
Disagree. No reason to stop, the goal is to RIDE down the hill not STOP down the hill. Noobs who stop before a descent may never make the descent.
'Several reasons to stop...Take in the view for a few seconds, survey the best route down, survey the best bail points if things get out of hand, and make sure that noob judgement isn't making one think they're going slower than they really are. Speed estimates can be off, but stopped is STOPPED. 'Better they never make the descent than to approach something over their head too quickly without a good survey and lose it over a cliff.

Quote:
Many of the big adventure twins have road-oriented gearing that is too stiff to idle down something really gnarly and slow. The rider will need to clutch or else be fighting forward thrust, or stall. But hey if ya stall then ya have to clutch to keep rolling. (I don't advise neutral as if the bikes gets away from you, it could gain speed and crash hard before it stops.)
I don't advise neutral either, and the big GS in the video, freight-training down the hill, was likely moving way faster than it would have in 1st gear at idle. I've never seen a bike idle at 15-20MPH. Brake and then clutch if you have to, but if you're moving faster than idle you can utilize engine braking to slow the bike without completely locking the rear wheel. Engine braking also works whether the rotors/pads are covered in slime, overheated, or whatever.
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Old 06-17-2012, 02:04 PM   #80
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Originally Posted by tedder View Post
This is completely missing the point. The bikes recommended aren't necessarily what "we" own, they are what "we" recommend for learning how to ride on dirt.
Yup.

To the OP...I ride a DR650SE, and it's a great do-it-all bike that is lighter than most streetbikes and can be ridden like a dirtbike, but I don't recommend learning to ride dirt on something this heavy or geared this tall. It's not as forgiving if it starts leaning badly, or if it gets "out of sorts" with a wheel or two in the air or sliding. Most people also don't seem to like picking up a bike this heavy, repeatedly, as they make noob mistakes in the dirt...if they can even pick it up by themselves at all. It helps to know technique and to be bull-strong. It also helps to wear good gear, drink a lot of milk, and be durable as all hell. A bike this heavy, or heavier, can easily hurt you or others nearby.

Besides, I don't recall ANYBODY saying to get rid of the big bike, or that there was no place for them in dirt. Keep the big bike if you like. Just don't expect to develop the offroad skill of, or develop it as quickly as, somebody who starts off on a more-appropriate bike for the task at hand...learning technical/advanced dirt skills.
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Old 06-17-2012, 04:05 PM   #81
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Originally Posted by CafeRacer99 View Post
No, your point was clear. Ride the bike you suggest or fail. I got it.

The dick-size reference says more about how you view this subject than me.
You're continuing to miss the point. At least you are consistent.
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Old 06-17-2012, 07:27 PM   #82
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Originally Posted by tedder View Post
Yup. In fact it's basically impossible to experiement with a big heavy bike. I bet 99% of riders never learn how to slide a bike if they start on a porker.

But, the OP said he wasn't going get another bike, so.. good times! Enjoy repairing plastic or never learning how to actually ride on gravel.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pantah View Post


You will never become a competent off-road motorcyclist trying to learn by riding any big twin or triple on dirt roads. ...
On the other hand, you are not really looking to acquire competence. You just want to enjoy your motorcycle.
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Originally Posted by tedder View Post
You're continuing to miss the point. At least you are consistent.
No, I think I got it.
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Old 06-17-2012, 07:48 PM   #83
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Originally Posted by Kommando View Post
Yup.

To the OP...I ride a DR650SE, and it's a great do-it-all bike that is lighter than most streetbikes and can be ridden like a dirtbike, but I don't recommend learning to ride dirt on something this heavy or geared this tall. It's not as forgiving if it starts leaning badly, or if it gets "out of sorts" with a wheel or two in the air or sliding. Most people also don't seem to like picking up a bike this heavy, repeatedly, as they make noob mistakes in the dirt...if they can even pick it up by themselves at all. It helps to know technique and to be bull-strong. It also helps to wear good gear, drink a lot of milk, and be durable as all hell. A bike this heavy, or heavier, can easily hurt you or others nearby.

Besides, I don't recall ANYBODY saying to get rid of the big bike, or that there was no place for them in dirt. Keep the big bike if you like. Just don't expect to develop the offroad skill of, or develop it as quickly as, somebody who starts off on a more-appropriate bike for the task at hand...learning technical/advanced dirt skills.
See, I get this. I have no problem agreeing with your entire post. I think what's gotten lost in this discussion is that I'm not planning on tackling terrain that would require a high degree of skill and a full-on dirt bike. I've seen plenty of video of people falling their way up and down trails, and that's not my idea of fun, on any bike really.

Most of the folks responding to this thread get this and are posting good advice for making my way up and down dirt and gravel campground roads. Some are assuming that I will be crashing my way down the same gnarly trail they are on with their 400's. I won't be. Unless I'm horribly lost, lol.

If you want to chime in and say it's easier to learn how to go downhill on a smaller bike, I'll agree with you. If you want to chime in and say you'll never learn how to do this competently on your bike, that's not helpful. I tried to make it pretty clear in the first post that I'm not planning on hitting difficult terrain, just roads. That's the task at hand and I don't consider it to be very technical or advanced. That's all I'm saying.
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Old 06-17-2012, 07:56 PM   #84
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Originally Posted by CafeRacer99 View Post
I tried to make it pretty clear in the first post that I'm not planning on hitting difficult terrain, just roads. That's the task at hand and I don't consider it to be very technical or advanced. That's all I'm saying.
It's all fun and games until you decide you can make it to Cocos on a big bike

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Old 06-17-2012, 08:18 PM   #85
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It's all fun and games until you decide you can make it to Cocos on a big bike

I'd say the ride to Coco's is one of the easier big bike routes (even on street tires).
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Old 06-17-2012, 08:21 PM   #86
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Big bike comfort on dirt/gravel

Try to narrow the gap between your skills and the capability of the bike by developing slowspeed skills on pavement first. Your bike is your bike. People don't have a perfect match between skills and their bike without practice, boo-boos and more practice. Get up on the pegs. Practice manuverability at slow speed to learn balance. Riding standing on the pegs on painted lines in a parking lot, weave a pattern between objects, then ride across a precast parking curb block without falling over, do figure 8's across the face of an incline driveway at slow speed. Invent ways to test your balance. You will learn braking, clutch control and balance or fall over trying. You can learn on a big bike(not as easy at first) you can learn on a trials bike(easier but you still fall). Without balance, speed is wasted on the foolish. Without balance you fall over. Once you learn lesson 1 Grasshopper...lesson 2 is loose surface control. Lesson 3 is speed control. Checkout big bike offroad courses. Practice.
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Old 06-17-2012, 08:40 PM   #87
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I'd say the ride to Coco's is one of the easier big bike routes (even on street tires).
Not the week after the race.
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Old 06-17-2012, 08:47 PM   #88
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It's all fun and games until you decide you can make it to Cocos on a big bike
I have the kind of luck that means one day I'll find myself way over my head, my bike lying on the ground like that pic, and a whole group of you enduro guys from this forum will show up.
If that happens, I'll eat crow. (As long as you help me pick up my bike.)
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Old 06-17-2012, 08:54 PM   #89
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Originally Posted by road_apple View Post
Try to narrow the gap between your skills and the capability of the bike by developing slowspeed skills on pavement first. Your bike is your bike. People don't have a perfect match between skills and their bike without practice, boo-boos and more practice. Get up on the pegs. Practice manuverability at slow speed to learn balance. Riding standing on the pegs on painted lines in a parking lot, weave a pattern between objects, then ride across a precast parking curb block without falling over, do figure 8's across the face of an incline driveway at slow speed. Invent ways to test your balance. You will learn braking, clutch control and balance or fall over trying. You can learn on a big bike(not as easy at first) you can learn on a trials bike(easier but you still fall). Without balance, speed is wasted on the foolish. Without balance you fall over. Once you learn lesson 1 Grasshopper...lesson 2 is loose surface control. Lesson 3 is speed control. Checkout big bike offroad courses. Practice.
My wife and I have both been doing that! Figure 8s in parking lots and slow riding. The incline driveway thing is a great idea. My bike is new to me and her's is to her. We plan to practice proper technique picking up the bikes too.

We've done the basic and advanced street courses. I am looking at off-road courses.
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Old 06-17-2012, 10:00 PM   #90
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Originally Posted by CafeRacer99 View Post
I have the kind of luck that means one day I'll find myself way over my head, my bike lying on the ground like that pic, and a whole group of you enduro guys from this forum will show up.
If that happens, I'll eat crow. (As long as you help me pick up my bike.)
I'll help you pick up the bike after ensuring you are okay.

And taking pictures.
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