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Old 07-05-2012, 12:53 PM   #1
aarlint OP
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NEW Tiger 800 xc DEAD for 3+ months (now resolved)

My wife and I decided to head to argentina on motorcycles so we picked up a couple of adventure bikes. My bike of choice was the 2012 tiger 800xc which I bought in january of 2012 in cash.

I love this bike! It was fast and smooth on the road and great for playing in the utah mountains as well. After a 6 hour drive or so down to moab utah, my wife and I stopped to take a break and wait for some friends. We turned the bikes off and I left my key in the ignition. When i went to turn on the bike all I saw was a red alarm light in the lower corner of the panel. There was absolutely no sound or other activity. No pump prep, nothing. We fiddled with everything; kickstand, killswitch, battery, ignition button, key positions, gas tank (couldnt hurt). We tried everything, eventually, after about 45 mins the bike roared to life and we were on our way. I gave triumph a call right then and there and said... wtf... what happened. They couldnt explain it and said that since there wasnt a showing problem I should wait to bring it in. The rest of the trip was awesome... tearing up the moab hills on a tigger was awesome!

Unfortunately this wasnt the end of the issue. Shortly after the trip the bike did the same thing in front of bestbuy in my home town. Luckily my wife was able to pick me up and take me to work and I picked up the bike after work. It started! So I looked up on the internerd to see what the deal was and if anyone else had experienced this. There are a few different cases of it but all were resolved by replacing the immobilizer.

I took my bike down to the dealership in salt lake city and they started to diagnose the problem. They got the exact same result as me and decided that the immobilizer should be replaced. Here is where the story goes from bad to worse. The immobilizer took 3 weeks to get here from the UK and it didnt work!

They then decided that it was necessary to replace the computer. So they did that. No change. I was still out a great bike for the beginning of good riding weather. The service headquarters decided that it could be the wire harness and they should check that out. So the dealer went through the wiring harness with a comb and didnt find anything. Still NO JOY.

At this point in the story the bike has been in the shop over a month and the main service headquarters decides that the immobilizer that was a replacement must have been a dud on arrival. They send a new one. This time direct! It still takes 2 weeks and FAILS to fix the problem. The bike is now giving another error on top of the other one and is failing ot sync with the keys.

The bike has now been in the shop since may and has had the following parts repaired or replaced:

Immobilizer
wiring harness
computer
Immobilizer (again)

The tiger is still not fixed and the main service headquarters in the states are frankly handling the situation very poorly. The law in Utah states that if a bike has had 6 or more repairs OR has been out of your possession due to repairs for a business day month, then the bike is a lemon and needs to be replaced or bought back. My situation clearly fits the description (using the 30 business day rule) and triumph will not give me a new bike..

I am now talking to the state about starting a law suit and I have warned triumph that I am beginning the process.

I would like to know what the community thinks about this kind of outrage. I would also like the owners and future owners of the tiger 800 xc to know what they potentially could find at their door. If anyone has experience with lemon law cases or maybe what I should do in this situation... please help!... you are my only hope!
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Old 07-05-2012, 01:59 PM   #2
Calamity Jesus
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You probably need a lawyer to initiate the Lemon Law. Triumph isn't going to just give you money or a new bike without paperwork.


Have you talked with Triumph or have you only been dealing directly with your service department?
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Old 07-05-2012, 02:15 PM   #3
Dave in Wi
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Beaverboy View Post
You probably need a lawyer to initiate the Lemon Law. Triumph isn't going to just give you money or a new bike without paperwork.


Have you talked with Triumph or have you only been dealing directly with your service department?
Lemon law it. Definitely consult a lawyer. Each state has slightly different requirements, and you need to fulfill them to the letter to get them to buyback. To the letter. There was a case here in WI where a woman jumped through all the hoops but did not include a specific word or phrase in a letter, and was denied.
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Dave in Wi screwed with this post 07-05-2012 at 02:30 PM
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Old 07-05-2012, 02:25 PM   #4
Rob Dirt
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You need to call Triumph US & talk to the Boss. That used to be Peter or Scott. (678)854-2010. Call often & squeak a lot. The squeaky wheel gets the grease.
They have the power to make it right. I would try to avoid talking to a lawyer. However, if you can read the lemon law to the Boss over the phone that might motivate them to help faster.
Triumph has a good rep about warranty & out of warranty repairs.
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Old 07-05-2012, 02:26 PM   #5
aarlint OP
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Here in utah the state handles all of the fees and provides all the legal work, courtesy of the tax dollars. I just need to get them all the info... manuals, document of sale, blah blah blah.
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Old 07-05-2012, 02:29 PM   #6
aarlint OP
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rob Dirt View Post
You need to call Triumph US & talk to the Boss. That used to be Peter or Scott. (678)854-2010. Call often & squeak a lot. The squeaky wheel gets the grease.
They have the power to make it right. I would try to avoid talking to a lawyer. However, if you can read it to the Boss over the phone that might motivate them to help faster.
Triumph has a good rep about warranty & out of warranty repairs.
Actually, I have been talking to Peter Carlio right now from the service headquarters here in the US. Nice guy, but he said they wouldnt give me a new bike or buy mine back until they had exhausted all their options. I suppose they could replace the immobilizer 100 times and still say that. Looks like the states my only option.. for replacement.

The biggest problem is I have been without a bike for 3 months... and its awesome weather!
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Old 07-05-2012, 02:49 PM   #7
aarlint OP
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Here is the law:

13-20-5. Reasonable number of attempts to conform.
(1) It is presumed that a reasonable number of attempts have been undertaken to conform a motor vehicle to the applicable express warranties, if:
(a) the same nonconformity has been subject to repair four or more times by the manufacturer, its agent, or its authorized dealer within the express warranty term or during the one-year period following the date of original delivery of the motor vehicle to a consumer, whichever is earlier, but the nonconformity continues to exist; or
(b) the vehicle is out of service to the consumer because of repair for a cumulative total of 30 or more business days during the warranty term or during the one-year period, whichever is earlier.
(2) The term of an express warranty, the one-year period, and the 30-day period shall be extended by any period of time during which repair services are not available to the consumer because of a war, invasion, strike, fire, flood, or other natural disaster.
Enacted by Chapter 168, 1985 General Session

Bold text added to show where it applies.
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Old 07-05-2012, 02:51 PM   #8
PiJiL
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Ouch, must hurt that a bike you love doesn't work..

Many shops just replace shit with diagnosing as they don't understand how things really work.

Call triumph in your local state and ask them to diagnose the bike, the state or national trainer know how the bike works and will find the fault.

have a shout on a frumpy forum as they often have contacts in triumph that could help.

Pete
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Old 07-05-2012, 05:03 PM   #9
Dave_S
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Sorry to hear about the problems with your Tiger. Where is your dealer in all of this? Is he putting pressure on Triumph? I recently bought a 1200 Explorer, my third Triumph, and I would be very upset also if I was without my bike for 3 months. My advice is to keep the pressure on, according to this thread on the Explorer board: http://www.tiger-explorer.com/index....ic,2198.0.html, Triumph does replace faulty bikes. It sounds like that gentleman's dealer may have had a lot to do with it, so talk to your dealer and have him help you with Corporate.

Good luck, I hope the situation works out for you.
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Old 07-05-2012, 05:20 PM   #10
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Are you dealing with the SLC BMW/Triumph dealer?


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Old 07-05-2012, 05:33 PM   #11
phillipsrog
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Same issue here

I've mentioned this before. Same bike, same dealer, same problem. Fortunately, mine only happens occasionally and is easily fixed by getting the bike in the shade for a few minutes. It's heat related, regardless of what anyone else tells you. I will almost guarantee it.

In almost every case, it's happened to me when the bike is sitting for a while in direct sunlight, usually on a warm to hot day.

I went on a road trip last weekend and it happened once. I threw my jacket over the ignition, and a few minutes later it fired. For me it's more of an annoyance than a deal breaker. I still love the bike, and I feel terrible that this has happened to you, but I am watching this situation closely and have been in contact with Andy at the Triumph dealership in Sandy numerous times about it.

This seems to be a really isolated problem, but what baffles me is why two bikes from the same shop have the same issue.

We finally got a Triumph dealer in Boise, and I am going to get in touch with them and have them start working on the problem. Maybe a new set of eyes will help. Who knows?
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Old 07-05-2012, 07:22 PM   #12
Blueshark
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Service Manual

Have you bought (or downloaded or whatever) the factory service manual? Might give you a better idea of how to diagnose, even if it's the dealer's responsibility.
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Old 07-05-2012, 08:08 PM   #13
Flyboy52219
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Sorry to hear of the troubles with your XC. I hope they resolve the issues for you soon. Just to double check the simple things first, bike is in neutral and the second key is nowhere near the bike when this occurs?
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Old 07-05-2012, 10:45 PM   #14
Ducksbane
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rob Dirt View Post
You need to call Triumph US & talk to the Boss. That used to be Peter or Scott. (678)854-2010. Call often & squeak a lot. The squeaky wheel gets the grease.
They have the power to make it right. I would try to avoid talking to a lawyer. However, if you can read the lemon law to the Boss over the phone that might motivate them to help faster.
Triumph has a good rep about warranty & out of warranty repairs.
Having just been through a protracted legal battle with a major Australian company (non motorcycle related) which we won I'm with Rob Dirt.

Go as far up the Triumph ladder as possible and make it plain that they are in breach of your states laws and you won't be letting the issue rest. Also point out that you have sought advice on this matter on this forum and that bad PR for Triumph is unfortunately unavoidable. Make it plain that you aren't going to go away quietly and it would be in everyone's interest for this to be resolved quickly and amicably.

If this doesn't work, and they still can't fix your bike I suggest that you then get Hinkley involved. Here is the page with their contact details ... http://www.triumphmotorcycles.co.uk/...any/contact-us

Be very nice and polite to head office and explain your problem and (gently) how this is effecting Triumphs corporate image. Explain that you don't want to take legal action, but you feel that after this amount of time, and with neither the dealer or Triumph US being able (or perhaps even willing) to help you feel that you have to bring this to their attention.

While you talking or writing to Triumph you should be aware of the concept of "Without Prejudice" ... Definition here ... http://www.businessdictionary.com/de...prejudice.html
It may be worthwhile beginning conversations and written contact with the words Without Prejudice if you think that legal action may be forthcoming (or if you want to yell and swear a bit !) Also you should keep contemporaneous notes with dates and times for events and contacts and summaries of conversations and direct quotes if necessary. Make it known subtly during important conversations that you are taking notes. This doesn't apply if they are about to make a damaging admission "with prejudice" that you might be able to use in a legal action later.


If this doesn't get the right result take action under your states Lemon Law.

In all this never make threats you aren't willing to carry out and make it very plain that you aren't going to back down. Also remind them that morally, ethically and legally they are wrong and you are right.

For best results focus on your goal in this and don't deviate or be distracted ... keep hammering away until they come around to your point of view.

Good luck !

Edit: I'm thinking of getting a Tiger Explorer 1200 so I'm interested in whether Triumph is interested in resolving this appropriately or not, so I'll be keeping an eye on the outcome!
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Ducksbane screwed with this post 07-05-2012 at 11:00 PM
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Old 07-06-2012, 05:35 AM   #15
MookieBlaylock
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they might do what's right with an official looking letter stating your intention to lemon law it. Keep squeaking here and on triumphrat and to management , they don't want the bad publicity in this day of internet. What a pain
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