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Old 04-04-2013, 06:02 AM   #781
Merlin III
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cubdriver View Post
It did go somewhere, into the rest of the engine, and will probably all drain down in a while and give you a good reading like you had before. Bike position has a lot to do with how the reading looks also. No way it disappeared somewhere for good, not that much that soon,and when you drain it out, unless you also drain the oil filter, you will not get it all out.

I hope you are experiencing what aviators call "automatic rough". It is what we hear and feel when we are out over water or just having a general bad time of it.

Hang in there. You will soon be one of the most experienced KLR experts, although the learning curve is whipping you about a bit.
I second that. Once again I don't own a KLR, but in general, when checking oil in a MC you have to follow a very precise procedure as stated in the referenced post and in your manual. It is very hard to get accurate readings unless you follow the same procedures every time and that includes letting the bike set a specified time period after heating up the oil (no more, no less) and the position of the bike in terms of level is very important as specified in the owner's manual.

Ask me how I know? I have had to clean out my air box more than a few times. It is pretty easy when on a long trip to become overly obsessive about your oil levels and not follow strict protocol.
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Old 04-04-2013, 08:11 AM   #782
rodr
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Merlin III View Post
I second that. Once again I don't own a KLR, but in general, when checking oil in a MC you have to follow a very precise procedure as stated in the referenced post and in your manual. It is very hard to get accurate readings unless you follow the same procedures every time and that includes letting the bike set a specified time period after heating up the oil (no more, no less) and the position of the bike in terms of level is very important as specified in the owner's manual.
True that. Doesn't seem likely you'd have lost oil overnight. Start it again, let the engine warm up for a few minutes, then shut it off and wait one minute for the oil to settle before checking the level. Make sure the bike is perfectly upright when checking. That's how it works with my DL650 anyway.
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Old 04-04-2013, 01:57 PM   #783
NomadGal OP
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Okay, drained the oil last night and I had only 1 1/2 quarts in there. So I lost almost a whole quart of oil in 160 miles.
It did take me 5 hours to ride that far seeing as the road was very twisty and hilly, which probably was part of the reason for losing the oil. How I had a full reading at first and then an empty reading afterward is beyond me!
Today we checked the air box, the oil filter, the crankcase vent pressure (same as mine), under the engine for maybe oil leakage there, compared oil cap pressure (same as mine) filled her back up and went for a ride.
Logan ride behind me and when we stopped told me that I did indeed have smoke coming from my muffler when I throttled down (i.e. braking using the engine).
Logan said he might have seen a little going up the hill at 65 mph but wasn't sure.
When we got back we checked the oil, but it's still full. I will check it in a few hours for accurate reading. Somehow I thought it was full the other day, just to find it was empty in the morning.
Also, Does anyone know if the 22 cent mod makes you use more gas? Went from 60 miles a gallon to 50
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Old 04-04-2013, 02:20 PM   #784
PaulGir
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NomadGal View Post
Okay, drained the oil last night and I had only 1 1/2 quarts in there. So I lost almost a whole quart of oil in 160 miles.
It did take me 5 hours to ride that far seeing as the road was very twisty and hilly, which probably was part of the reason for losing the oil. How I had a full reading at first and then an empty reading afterward is beyond me!
Today we checked the air box, the oil filter, the crankcase vent pressure (same as mine), under the engine for maybe oil leakage there, compared oil cap pressure (same as mine) filled her back up and went for a ride.
Logan ride behind me and when we stopped told me that I did indeed have smoke coming from my muffler when I throttled down (i.e. braking using the engine).
Logan said he might have seen a little going up the hill at 65 mph but wasn't sure.
When we got back we checked the oil, but it's still full. I will check it in a few hours for accurate reading. Somehow I thought it was full the other day, just to find it was empty in the morning.
Also, Does anyone know if the 22 cent mod makes you use more gas? Went from 60 miles a gallon to 50
Smoking exhaust on over-run (closed throttle) often indicates worn valve guides.
Google: klr650 breather - there are references there to excessive oil usage
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Old 04-04-2013, 03:07 PM   #785
knybanjo
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You likely need a new top end but.....






.....oil burners can often continue for many miles if you keep them topped off.

For now it would be a good idea to carry plenty with you and check it before getting back on the road at every stop.
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Old 04-05-2013, 07:24 PM   #786
NomadGal OP
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Yeah......
I am still here in Silver City even though I had cleaned up my tent, and packed most of my stuff.
Logan and Carla told me they were not comfortable about me leaving to take a 100 mile dirt road through the middle of nowhere on a bike that was losing oil fast, and told me they were okay with me staying until I had her fixed.
My trip with Logan confirmed that I am losing oil through burning (black smoke when engine breaking) So I've got one clue.




Logan on his V-Strom, His KLR is getting it's annual checkup, haha.


couldn't resist taking a pic of myself in front of the post office. What shiny windows!!


My decadent little camping spot in Logans yard, protected by a gate so no mountain cats can bug me.

Today I rode 50 miles in mountain country, zig zag up and down, and discovered an hour after I left that I had forgotten to reconnect the crankcase breather tube. This ended up a good thing, because I could see oil in the tube, and splashed under the air box that the tube was leaning toward.
So yeah, I am am also losing oil through there.
The ride to Lake Roberts a was beautiful though.







When I got back Logan helped me put Spirit up on a couple of jacks, and I took the rear wheel off to get to the vent under the air box, to see if oil was in there as well.
That side of the air box was clean as a whistle (well, not counting the dust) but no oil.
The countershaft and sprocket where still clean too, no oil leaking out of the new seal.
I also took the tank back off, so tomorrow I can tackle taking the head off.
I made us all some scrumptious Aloo Gobi for dinner, and ate it watching HarryPotter

Now I'm comfy in my tent haha, so much for being back on the road!
I keep on thinking about what the architect said in the Matrix Revolutions:
"Hope. It is the quintessential human delusion, simultaneously the source of your greatest strength, and your greatest weakness."
I guess one of the reasons I am not giving up on Spirit is because I am hoping that I can figure out what is wrong and fix her. And I guess the other reason is that I love being out on the road and camping, finding remote places in the forest or hills and just relax and enjoy life!
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Old 04-05-2013, 08:05 PM   #787
just jeff
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22cent mod

Quote "Also, Does anyone know if the 22 cent mod makes you use more gas? Went from 60 miles a gallon to 50"
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Hi NomadGal
The KLR is setup very lean from the factory to meet emission regs. That is why your plug is so white. It should be light tan in color with the correct mixture.
The 22cent mod richens the mixture. Any time you do this the fuel milage drops. The benefit is better power, better response and less chance of engine damage due to detonation.
The KLX needle kit (available from Eagle Mike) is a better option than the 22cent mod. The needle is tapered rather than stepped like the KLR needle. This provides more gradual fuel metering. The KLX needle also has several slots at the top. Placing the supplied clip in different slots allows you to move the needle up or down resulting in a richer or leaner mixture. The kit also comes with several main jets. You can usually go with a smaller main jet with the KLX needle in a stock bike. This will get your milage back.
I did the 22cent mod on my 2011 and got rid of my surge that occurred going down the highway. I did a KLX needle kit in my 2003 and find the throttle more crisp with better response and slightly better power. I'm not sure on the milage yet. I only have about 50 miles on the bike.
Regards....justjeff
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Old 04-06-2013, 02:57 PM   #788
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Took the head off today.


Seems like yesterday when I last had her like this!


Hard to take a picture of the scoring and burn marks inside the cylinder


Valves not looking too clean, but I can't tell if they are damaged or have oil blow-by too

Eagle Mike was back stocked on the 685 and 688 kits, and I heard he doesn't do valves.
Contacted WymanWinn at the klr650.net, and he will do everything (boring etc., valves and ship it back for a decent rate)
Waiting to hear back from him as to how long it would take to do all this.
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Old 04-06-2013, 03:02 PM   #789
PaulGir
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NomadGal View Post
Yeah......
I am still here in Silver City even though I had cleaned up my tent, and packed most of my stuff.
Logan and Carla told me they were not comfortable about me leaving to take a 100 mile dirt road through the middle of nowhere on a bike that was losing oil fast, and told me they were okay with me staying until I had her fixed.
My trip with Logan confirmed that I am losing oil through burning (black smoke when engine breaking) So I've got one clue.



When I got back Logan helped me put Spirit up on a couple of jacks, and I took the rear wheel off to get to the vent under the air box, to see if oil was in there as well.
That side of the air box was clean as a whistle (well, not counting the dust) but no oil.
The countershaft and sprocket where still clean too, no oil leaking out of the new seal.
I also took the tank back off, so tomorrow I can tackle taking the head off.
I made us all some scrumptious Aloo Gobi for dinner, and ate it watching HarryPotter

Now I'm comfy in my tent haha, so much for being back on the road!
I keep on thinking about what the architect said in the Matrix Revolutions:
"Hope. It is the quintessential human delusion, simultaneously the source of your greatest strength, and your greatest weakness."
I guess one of the reasons I am not giving up on Spirit is because I am hoping that I can figure out what is wrong and fix her. And I guess the other reason is that I love being out on the road and camping, finding remote places in the forest or hills and just relax and enjoy life!
Sounds like you have the common crankcase over pressure problem.
Installation of a cheap PCV valve seems to fix this.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7GVXwhr1QoE
http://www.advrider.com/forums//showthread.php?t=416131

http://www.thumpertalk.com/topic/655...at-will-it-do/
http://www.thedirtycrew.com/2011/01/...-hose-mod.html
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Old 04-06-2013, 04:55 PM   #790
terryckdbf
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Might just be the camera angle but those valves do not look that bad, Seen a lot worse.

Been following along and wish you good fortune.

Terry
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Old 04-06-2013, 06:52 PM   #791
Motomedic
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The easiest way to check the valves is simple- pour a little gas or solvent into the port. Make sure the combustion side is dry and if it gets wet, you have a valve sealing issue. I like a volatile liquid like gas, as I believe it needs a better seal than water. How many miles are on this engine? (I'm too lazy too go fishing back in the thread, as I'm sure I asked this question the last time )

I too have seen much worse valve-wise, but it does look like you've been burning a little oil.

From the pics, if you had a valve spring compressor (which I'd be glad to loan/send you) I'm betting you could refresh things yourself. I'd want to see some good pics of the ports, but if the guides aren't too bad, the rest is easy. No more difficult than anything you've done so far. And you've already shown yourself willing and able (with a little direction ).
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Old 04-07-2013, 04:32 AM   #792
Jettn Jim
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Motomedic View Post
The easiest way to check the valves is simple- pour a little gas or solvent into the port. Make sure the combustion side is dry and if it gets wet, you have a valve sealing issue. I like a volatile liquid like gas, as I believe it needs a better seal than water. How many miles are on this engine? (I'm too lazy too go fishing back in the thread, as I'm sure I asked this question the last time )

I too have seen much worse valve-wise, but it does look like you've been burning a little oil.

From the pics, if you had a valve spring compressor (which I'd be glad to loan/send you) I'm betting you could refresh things yourself. I'd want to see some good pics of the ports, but if the guides aren't too bad, the rest is easy. No more difficult than anything you've done so far. And you've already shown yourself willing and able (with a little direction ).
+1
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Old 04-07-2013, 08:39 AM   #793
gunnerbuck
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I would think that your better off to take the head in and pay the $20 per valve to have the seats turned, guides measured and the valves inspected/ measured for wear... Not so many shops grind the old valves to get rid of any recess in their faces anymore, they just insist you replace them if they show wear... There are a few shops out there that will still do this and it saves a lot of money provided the valves are still sound and not too worn... Yours don't look like they are too deeply recessed into the seats so a regrind may be all they need...
A good shop will do all this {regrind seats, valves, check wear and lap in to get a good startup seal} which will restore the sealing properties to a like new condition for the long run...

Every one talks about hand lapping old valves to restore the sealing properties, to me this is a band aid solution better for the short term ... The valve to seat relationship is a multi angle fit... This Multi angled fit provides a longer period of wear as when the valve wears it will sink in and rest on a new part of the angle until it gets too worn as to where a recess ring forms around the face of the valve, at this point the will no longer provide a good seal, allow hot gases to blow by heat the valve stems above normal and burn out the guides...

If it turns out your valves are still workable without grinding, then your looking at $80-$100 to have the seats refreshed + the cost of 4 new valve stem seals and the top end gaskets.... This is money well spent as it will be more of a long term fix than just hand lapping the valves...
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Old 04-07-2013, 08:50 AM   #794
just jeff
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Here is an other thought on the head. If the valve stem to guide clearance is excessive then refreshing the seats is a waste of time and money. I am sure that Wymann will evaluate the condition of the head overall and perform what repairs are necessary. If it is reconditioned properly then Nomad Girl will not have to worry about it.
Regards....justjeff
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Old 04-07-2013, 12:04 PM   #795
NomadGal OP
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When it comes to the valves I'm chicken!
Too much depends on them being perfect, so I'm having Wyman do the valves and hope he'll do a good job at it.
LOL with the amount of readers I have he'd better
I've put everything in order and will box it later today and ship it off tomorrow.
I'm excited to see how Spirit will sound and run after all is done.
Hopefully she will take me to Alaska no problem!
Needless to say I'm pretty tires of working on her! I'm starting to wonder what it would be like to take a brand-new bike on the road
But then again, I would not have met the wonderful people I have, if I had not broken down all those times I did!
Who knows where this all will fit in in the grand scheme of life.......
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