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View Results: Are you better off now than you were 4 years ago?
Yes 65 54.17%
No 55 45.83%
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Old 11-09-2012, 08:18 PM   #361
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Originally Posted by pfb View Post
Since we are all armchair presidents here, let's say you are king for a day.

How do you fix our 'spending problem'?

The first pie chart is the fixed budget, almost all non-discretionary except for the two slices top right. If we are willing to default on social security, medicare, or radically cut defense spending, problem solved. But nobody sees an easy way to do that... These are legacy spending issues that have been building for decades and are about as far from an easy answer as it gets.



I know! Let's cut the discretionary budget! But wait, that's mostly defense spending as well...



So even if you hate big bird, think public education is a complete waste of money, want zero dollars to go to planned parenthood even though 0% of that funding goes to abortion, think alternative energy spending is hooey, and cut them all, lets say in HALF, you still are talking about removing a spit's worth of spending in an ocean of problem. Those spending categories in my mind are red herrings... They might be your moral/political/social beliefs, but they have very minimal impact on federal spending and deficit.

Well I'd save 6% right off the bat by eliminating education from the federal budget. Why on earth should education be handled on the Federal level? There was no (cabinet level) Dept of Education until Jimmy Carter made it so in 1977.
Education should be a matter of state, city and local school board. The fine folks of Colorado, better yet the fine folks of your local city council and school board can figure out how to fund, build and staff schools.
Same with college. All Federal grants and loans could be handled through the individual college and the state within which they operate. Think of how much $$ is wasted by sending our locally generated Money all l the way to Wash DC through levels and levels of beauracracy so they can tell us how much "grant" money we get back. We send them $100,000 they filter it through their BS and then tell us Colorado "wins" a $30,000 educational grant. Grant my ass. They stole $70,000 from us and we're all celebrating that we got a "grant". So eliminate the Dept of Edu for starters and let our local taxes fund out local schools.

Rant over.
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Old 11-09-2012, 08:36 PM   #362
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Well I'd save 6% right off the bat by eliminating education from the federal budget. Why on earth should education be handled on the Federal level? There was no (cabinet level) Dept of Education until Jimmy Carter made it so in 1977.
Education should be a matter of state, city and local school board. The fine folks of Colorado, better yet the fine folks of your local city council and school board can figure out how to fund, build and staff schools.
Same with college. All Federal grants and loans could be handled through the individual college and the state within which they operate. Think of how much $$ is wasted by sending our locally generated Money all l the way to Wash DC through levels and levels of beauracracy so they can tell us how much "grant" money we get back. We send them $100,000 they filter it through their BS and then tell us Colorado "wins" a $30,000 educational grant. Grant my ass. They stole $70,000 from us and we're all celebrating that we got a "grant". So eliminate the Dept of Edu for starters and let our local taxes fund out local schools.

Rant over.
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Old 11-09-2012, 08:45 PM   #363
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Well I'd save 6% right off the bat by eliminating education from the federal budget. Why on earth should education be handled on the Federal level? There was no (cabinet level) Dept of Education until Jimmy Carter made it so in 1977.
Education should be a matter of state, city and local school board. The fine folks of Colorado, better yet the fine folks of your local city council and school board can figure out how to fund, build and staff schools.
Same with college. All Federal grants and loans could be handled through the individual college and the state within which they operate. Think of how much $$ is wasted by sending our locally generated Money all l the way to Wash DC through levels and levels of beauracracy so they can tell us how much "grant" money we get back. We send them $100,000 they filter it through their BS and then tell us Colorado "wins" a $30,000 educational grant. Grant my ass. They stole $70,000 from us and we're all celebrating that we got a "grant". So eliminate the Dept of Edu for starters and let our local taxes fund out local schools.

Rant over.
Do you really think that the voters in Colorado would vote for a tax increase big enough to make up for the loss in fed dollars??
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Old 11-09-2012, 08:45 PM   #364
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You mean like:
  • Iran's right to develop nuclear capability?
  • Israel's right to turn Iran into a crater?
  • Pakistan's right to shoot a female who has the nerve to try and go to school?
  • Afghanistan's right to foster terrorist organizations?
  • [fill in the blank country's] right to brutally oppress its citizens?
  • China's right to ignore others intellectual property?
  • North Korea's right to invade South Korea?

The ostrich method of international policy isn't going to end well. Both mainstream parties agree on that.
Sorry, but the interventionist method is going disastrously, and is almost entirely responsible for everything that our country has been struggling with since 2001. Both mainstream parties? Like that's an endorsement. It's none of our business. Bring the troops home, do everything in-house, and lay waste to anyone who attempts to compromise our borders. Be the biggest scariest porcupine anyone has ever seen. Beyond that....your list looks like a compilation of our country's biggest failures. While the desire to protect the innocent is a noble one, nobody has the ability to police the world.

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Old 11-09-2012, 09:17 PM   #365
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Well I'd save 6% right off the bat by eliminating education from the federal budget.
So without even arguing why eliminating all federal education spending would be disastrous, it is still a disingenuous argument. You want to cut it because you don't believe in it, not because it comes anywhere close to fixing the deficit.

Personally, I think spending on education at a federal level is one of the most important places to invest, but again, it's not really a deficit/taxation/budget issue, more of a vision of what our country should be. Yup, I said country. Not what Colorado should be...
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Old 11-09-2012, 09:20 PM   #366
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So without even arguing why eliminating all federal education spending would be disastrous
Because having the fed involved isn't already disastrous?
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Old 11-09-2012, 09:25 PM   #367
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Well I'd save 6% right off the bat by eliminating education from the federal budget. Why on earth should education be handled on the Federal level? There was no (cabinet level) Dept of Education until Jimmy Carter made it so in 1977.
Education should be a matter of state, city and local school board. The fine folks of Colorado, better yet the fine folks of your local city council and school board can figure out how to fund, build and staff schools.
Same with college. All Federal grants and loans could be handled through the individual college and the state within which they operate. Think of how much $$ is wasted by sending our locally generated Money all l the way to Wash DC through levels and levels of beauracracy so they can tell us how much "grant" money we get back. We send them $100,000 they filter it through their BS and then tell us Colorado "wins" a $30,000 educational grant. Grant my ass. They stole $70,000 from us and we're all celebrating that we got a "grant". So eliminate the Dept of Edu for starters and let our local taxes fund out local schools.

Rant over.
You could improve on your own education, so please read this article.
http://febp.newamerica.net/backgroun...federal-budget
Or perhaps you don't know what a Pell Grant is or other details of the federal education budget. If there were no federal standards and federal support for certain programs our educational system would be as random as that in eastern Europe.
And in case you didn't know it Romney broke with his idiot mate Paul Ryan on Ryan's goal to abolish the Pell Grant program.
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Old 11-09-2012, 09:30 PM   #368
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Bring the troops home, do everything in-house, and lay waste to anyone who attempts to compromise our borders.
Since 9/11, there have been no successful foreign terrorist attacks within our borders. Do you think that is because the TSA is having airline passengers take off their shoes?

No. It's because we are addressing the insurgencies at the source as much as possible.

Do you think if nukes start flying from Israel to Iran or between Pakistan and India that we are somehow safe within our borders?

Again, No. (Actually, hell no)

I DO agree that we should think long and hard before engaging in any foreign military action, and that we should always always always try to avoid it, but the idea that somehow we are safer without any foreign policy other than isolationism is naive at best.
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Old 11-09-2012, 09:36 PM   #369
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If there were no federal standards and federal support for certain programs our educational system would be as random as that in eastern Europe.
Much better to have it be universally consistent shit like it is now?

Having raised 5 children through several school districts, my experience has been that the current public school system may now be the most jacked-up, nonsensical, bureaucratic institution known to all mankind. I'd rather deal with the DMV than the impossible levels of stupidity that you find in school administrations and policies. I could spend hours recalling stories of absolute fanatical levels of idiocy. Any change to the current system would be positive.
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Old 11-09-2012, 09:46 PM   #370
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my experience has been that the current public school system may now be the most jacked-up, nonsensical, bureaucratic institution known to all mankind. I'd rather deal with the DMV than the impossible levels of stupidity that you find in school administrations and policies.
And you think it will improve by reducing funding???

Though I would be all for dismantling GWB's disastrous "No Child Left Behind" act which spiked public education bureaucracy to an all-time high.
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Old 11-09-2012, 09:50 PM   #371
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Since 9/11, there have been no successful foreign terrorist attacks within our borders. Do you think that is because the TSA is having airline passengers take off there shoes?

No. It's because we are addressing the insurgencies at the source as much as possible.

Do you think if nukes start flying from Israel to Iran or between Pakistan and India that we are somehow safe within our borders?
I have my opinions about why people are being groped by the TSA, but that's a different subject.

Insurgents against foreign governments are none of our concern, and our involvement only serves to breed more people who want to harm our country. Do you really think the families of the thousands of innocents being killed in Pakistan by O'Bama's drone war aren't going to look for a way to settle the debt?

Given that everyone on the planet knows we have the ability to completely de-populate it at the push of a button, I'm confidant none of them will send a missile in our direction. Seemed to work fairly well with the Soviet Union.
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Old 11-09-2012, 10:08 PM   #372
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Given that everyone on the planet knows we have the ability to completely de-populate it at the push of a button, I'm confidant none of them will send a missile in our direction. Seemed to work fairly well with the Soviet Union.
Mutual Assured Destruction (MAD) was incredibly dangerous at best against the Soviet Union... Read some of the now declassified history of the Berlin Crisis and Cuban Missile Crisis to get a sense of just how hairy things really were.

But MAD as a deterrent against against attacks from cave dwelling Taliban and other terrorists? Seriously?

I'm revoking my King For a Day offer... too dangerous!
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Old 11-09-2012, 10:15 PM   #373
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Sorry, but the interventionist method is going disastrously, and is almost entirely responsible for everything that our country has been struggling with since 2001. Both mainstream parties? Like that's an endorsement. It's none of our business. Bring the troops home, do everything in-house, and lay waste to anyone who attempts to compromise our borders. Be the biggest scariest porcupine anyone has ever seen. Beyond that....your list looks like a compilation of our country's biggest failures. While the desire to protect the innocent is a noble one, nobody has the ability to police the world.
I think that is naive at best. As long as we continue to rely on foreign goods, services and economic trading then we'll need to continue to exert global "influence" to protect our interests. Sadly this will necessitate subverting opposition governments, suborning foreign economies/currencies and flexing muscles as needed. Simply the way of the world at this time.

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And you think it will improve by reducing funding???
Yes. Eliminating ALL federal involvement would certainly improve things. Correspondingly, the amount of tax collected federally for eduction should revert back to the corresponding localities. The amount of graft and waste taken by running these dollars through the federal washing machine is a crime against our children. Programs like "no child left behind" are somehow even more stupid than the politicians that enacted them. Having sat on the BoT for a private school I've seen first hand how schools can be ran 5000% more efficiently at a micro level.

In today's public system the kids that are successful do so in spite of the school and it's administration.. typically through parental involvement (which often means the parents are also involved in fighting against the normal school policies to provide their child with opportunities). Unfortunately many more children are shuffled through the system and handed a high-school diploma with literally having 5th grade level fundamental skills.
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Old 11-09-2012, 10:23 PM   #374
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I think that is naive at best. As long as we continue to rely on foreign goods, services and economic trading then we'll need to continue to exert global "influence" to protect our interests. Sadly this will necessitate subverting opposition governments, suborning foreign economies/currencies and flexing muscles as needed. Simply the way of the world at this time.


Yes. Eliminating ALL federal involvement would certainly improve things. Correspondingly, the amount of tax collected federally for eduction should revert back to the corresponding localities. The amount of graft and waste taken by running these dollars through the federal washing machine is a crime against our children. Programs like "no child left behind" are somehow even more stupid than the politicians that enacted them. Having sat on the BoT for a private school I've seen first hand how schools can be ran 5000% more efficiently at a micro level.
I am curious which school did you go to and which were you BOT on? What was the class size and who funded the private school. My granddaughters go to a private school which cost $1000/mo and one has a crazy lady who teaches all the classes and teaches nothing worthwhile while the public school (Redmond, Wa) is one of the best in the country. What was your school and is your school?
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Old 11-09-2012, 10:29 PM   #375
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Do you really think that the voters in Colorado would vote for a tax increase big enough to make up for the loss in fed dollars??
They would be voting for a tax decrease. Keep in state money in state and you don't have to raise nearly as much of it
Keep your county tax dollars within your county. 100% of it. And you could build and staff some awesome schools.
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