What Dual Sport should Honda build next

[Dirtgrain]

I was just wondering about what a dual clutch would be like on an off-road bike. On the NC700X, the DCT ABS version is 33 lbs. heavier. I'm not sure how much of that is the DCT. 25 lbs.? Could a lightweight DCT be made for a dualsport or off-road bike?

Would a DCT (forgetting the added weight for a moment) be a good thing for off-road conditions? Would it be better than an auto-clutch?

I was thinking of a bike that can go anywhere, has a seat height no greater than 35", is around 300 lbs., has decent power (more than my DR350, for sure--better low-end, especially), and gets great mpg (FI, maybe DCT).

[Kawidad]

I wish Honda would, but they won't so unfortunately all this talk is just......


Kinda like wishing Kawasaki, Suzuki and Yamaha would too.

[Grreatdog]

Maybe next year Honda will update the XR650L for its 20th birthday.

[ADVNCW]

Originally Posted by Off the grid

Honda will never make a decent dual sport. And they never have.

My dream: 230L to be a 300L, and have similar gas mileage and a 3 gallon tank.

Yea, the new model lineup lacks a good dual sport. There is a real nice "dirt-styled street bike" in the CRF250L! The CRFX models would be fun as a high-maintenance high-performance plated dirt bike, but not a low-maintenance bulletproof dualsport. I like the NCX700 but it is not a dual sport by any means.

Perhaps many motorcycle consumers lack knowledge, riding experience and skills to understand what makes a good dual sport trail bike. I ride a Honda dual sport that has excellent weight, great handling through good geometry, acceptable suspension, highest mileage. It has little 'gravitas', no pseudo penis-extender potential. But the 230L that I ride has shown on tough and tight mountain terrain to lead other of the expensive long-travel motorcycles. We have traded rides, and admittedly the 230L is less in suspension and HP, but more in precise steering and usable low end torque. Yesterday twice this big rider climbed two hills that the well known widely acclaimed motorcycle did not! Clearly something like a KTM200 or a Husky 310 would blow away my little dog 230L on the tight and rough, but 230L requires not much maintenance and will probably have trouble-free mileage long after the exotic bikes are a memory. And 73 MPG on the WABDR with my 230 lbs plus 40 lbs camp load!

As stated, 230L has little 'gravitas', and no pseudo penis-extender potential. But it is one of the better dual sports in history. Yet it is widely maligned and misunderstood. Understood only by some with real experience and understanding of motorcycles, and smaller folks who enjoy the easy handling.

Apparently most motorcycle consumers cannot stop at easy handling, speed-limit capable, lightweight motorcycles. They must have an expensive moto that has gravitas, gives some feelng of pseudo penis-extension, roosts and wheelies or looks like it will, cruises the superslab, and then is over 300 lbs.... This seems to drive the market...

Oh yeah, my wish is for my 230L to be a 300L, and have similar gas mileage and a 3 gallon tank. Perfect!

[LukasM]

Originally Posted by ADVNCW

My dream: 230L to be a 300L, and have similar gas mileage and a 3 gallon tank.

Yea, the new model lineup lacks a good dual sport. There is a real nice "dirt-styled street bike" in the CRF250L! The CRFX models would be fun as a high-maintenance high-performance plated dirt bike, but not a low-maintenance bulletproof dualsport. I like the NCX700 but it is not a dual sport by any means.

Perhaps many motorcycle consumers lack knowledge, riding experience and skills to understand what makes a good dual sport trail bike. I ride a Honda dual sport that has excellent weight, great handling through good geometry, acceptable suspension, highest mileage. It has little 'gravitas', no pseudo penis-extender potential. But the 230L that I ride has shown on tough and tight mountain terrain to lead other of the expensive long-travel motorcycles. We have traded rides, and admittedly the 230L is less in suspension and HP, but more in precise steering and usable low end torque. Yesterday twice this big rider climbed two hills that the well known widely acclaimed motorcycle did not! Clearly something like a KTM200 or a Husky 310 would blow away my little dog 230L on the tight and rough, but 230L requires not much maintenance and will probably have trouble-free mileage long after the exotic bikes are a memory. And 73 MPG on the WABDR with my 230 lbs plus 40 lbs camp load!

As stated, 230L has little 'gravitas', and no pseudo penis-extender potential. But it is one of the better dual sports in history. Yet it is widely maligned and misunderstood. Understood only by some with real experience and understanding of motorcycles, and smaller folks who enjoy the easy handling.

Apparently most motorcycle consumers cannot stop at easy handling, speed-limit capable, lightweight motorcycles. They must have an expensive moto that has gravitas, gives some feelng of pseudo penis-extension, roosts and wheelies or looks like it will, cruises the superslab, and then is over 300 lbs.... This seems to drive the market...

Oh yeah, my wish is for my 230L to be a 300L, and have similar gas mileage and a 3 gallon tank. Perfect!

It's pretty sad that you just can't admit how much more fun a light AND powerful AND well suspended bike is to ride than your "dog" - as even you yourself call it.

There are plenty of us that feel very comfortable with our penis size (fixate much to mention this 3x in one post?) and still prefer to ride something that will excite us and that can haul the mail if we want it to, all while being reliable and perfectly ride-able at slower speeds.

Can't say there is any Honda made in the last 20 years that I would consider at the moment, they don't seem to get the need for wide ratio transmissions and top ends that last long on their 450 sized CRFs, and they build way too heavy old school stuff in the 650 class. The XRR was ok at some point but the RFS KTM is basically a better version of it, with e-start, 6-speed and lighter weight.

[RebelYell]

I actually like the smaller cc bikes on the tighter trails they handle better,make the best use of there powere and arent a handful to go thru the woods with.I dont know w all the epa bs I doubt honda could go back and build air cooled street bikes again at a affordable price.That crf 250l is one of the best buys going right now me believes.

[LukasM]

Originally Posted by ADVNCW

Read my words- "Clearly something like a KTM200 or a Husky 310 would blow away my little dog 230L on the tight and rough" Asshole, go away.

Unlike brainwashed Euro punks, many Americans have independent thought. I have explained what I want and like. You are an asshole following me around on this forum.

If I wanted to race, jump, hit berms, wheelie, have the lightest high HP machine, I would already own a KTM or a Honda CRFX. That is not want I want to do when I ride. Take your little ego and micropenis and asshole arrogance elsewhere.

"Clearly something like a KTM200 or a Husky 310 would blow away my little dog 230L on the tight and rough"

I don't see all that much independent thought from you, other than really unoriginal personal attacks that make you sound like an angry child rather than the older dude that you are.

I am not brain-washed, but unlike you I can freely chose the motorcycles I want to ride, and in performance dual sports it is simply a fact that the Europeans are the only ones building really good bikes at the moment. I do currently own Japanese bikes too, and have owned many in the past, if they build something good in the future I will definitely consider it for a DS too. The word brand loyalty means nothing to me, even if you don't seem to get that.

If you are relatively happy with your "dog" that's cool, but you need to come to grips with the fact that there are modern bikes that are lighter, better handling, better performing bikes that still get excellent fuel economy and that are very reliable, they just cost more. If somebody would trade you a 570 Berg or a 500 EXC for your 230L you would see the light too, and it sure doesn't have anything to do with penis size...

Originally Posted by ADVNCW

Apparently most motorcycle consumers cannot stop at easy handling, speed-limit capable, lightweight motorcycles. They must have an expensive moto that has gravitas, gives some feelng of pseudo penis-extension, roosts and wheelies or looks like it will, cruises the superslab, and then is over 300 lbs.... This seems to drive the market...

[LukasM]

Originally Posted by ADVNCW

Your words express your own narrow views and your intolerance of others. You are incorrect in some applications, but you only wish to spout your superior arrogant epithets. Maybe you have done something that makes you assume some superiority in regard to motorcycles- don't care, you matter less than you think. Would rather not interact with you so just ignore me.

My intolerance, yet you are the one who keeps calling me a Euro punk, Adolf, etc, while we are having a - at least on my part - rational discussion about motorcycles. Not sure where this anger and insecurity comes from man, but it sure doesn't make you sound like an educated, happy and balanced person.

If you can get over yourself and start staying on topic and being objective, I'll gladly discuss the advantages and disadvantages of any model and brand of bike - yes even KTMs are not perfect - that's why I'm on this site.

[Night Falcon]

Originally Posted by smokeeater495

I'll see this bike and raise you an RC51 based V-twin engine. KTM 990 killer?

It appears KTM are killing the 990 all by themselves

[The Letter J]

how do I put someone on ignore?

[The Letter J]

and to stay on topic, a crf450x but with an xr650l powerplant would probably check all the boxes for the riding that I enjoy. Suspension is way more important to me than power and the 650l is more than reliable enough compared to all of the mx bikes that I've had in the past. I wonder what a chassis/powerplant combination like that would weigh? should be sub-300lbs and the aftermarket is already in place.

[Barman]

Originally Posted by The Letter J

how do I put someone on ignore?

Go to members Public Profile click User Lists and there's the ignore tab.

[ADVNCW]

Originally Posted by RebelYell

I actually like the smaller cc bikes on the tighter trails they handle better,make the best use of there powere and arent a handful to go thru the woods with.I dont know w all the epa bs I doubt honda could go back and build air cooled street bikes again at a affordable price.That crf 250l is one of the best buys going right now me believes.

Yea, I do like it I am just hung up on the weight, mostly agree. I thought about getting the 250L and doing mods to lose 15 lbs, would be a sweet gravel/ dirt road ride. But I decided to ride what I have.

My thoughts are similar to yours. It seems there is a certain power to weight to utility configuration of a 200cc to 250cc motorcycle that has advantages.

[Night Falcon]

Would be nice to see Honda start with a clean sheet and develop a mid sized (500-700cc) modern ADV bike (by modern I mean light weight, 50-60hp good springs yada yada) and set a new bench mark like they did with the XR's back in the day. Don't see it happening though.

[Bongolia]

Originally Posted by 150ron

CRF400L, just like the current 2013 CRF250L, but with a bigger motor, same weight would be nice if possible.

this.