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Old 11-19-2012, 12:47 PM   #16
Steveman OP
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Originally Posted by EPMD View Post
mine also makes a mechanical rattling noise when the clutch is disengaged (no pressure on the lever, i.e. at a stop in neutral). i think that's just the clutch plates rattling around.

if that's what you're talking about, that's normal i think, albeit slightly louder in this BMW compared to other bikes i have owned.
Yep, that's exactly what I am talking about. When the warranty is over I will change to Motul 15/60 oil and i am very sure this will help,,,,
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Old 11-19-2012, 01:26 PM   #17
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Originally Posted by Steveman View Post
Yep, that's exactly what I am talking about. When the warranty is over I will change to Motul 15/60 oil and i am very sure this will help,,,,

15W-50 is now seems to be an approved weight range for the twins.
I'm using it, and it quiets the cam-chain clank at start-up and I think makes the clutch a bit quieter,
but then its winter, ... and I'm not that observant

but ... in any event 15W-50 is not a warranty issue any longer (IMHO) see:

http://www.bmw-motorrad.dk/se/sv/ser...MC_2012_MD.pdf
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Old 11-20-2012, 04:03 AM   #18
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15W-50 is now seems to be an approved weight range for the twins.
I'm using it, and it quiets the cam-chain clank at start-up and I think makes the clutch a bit quieter,
but then its winter, ... and I'm not that observant

but ... in any event 15W-50 is not a warranty issue any longer (IMHO) see:

http://www.bmw-motorrad.dk/se/sv/ser...MC_2012_MD.pdf
Great, did not know that but will tell it to my dealer next time. Thank you!

Cheers
Steve
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Old 11-20-2012, 08:52 PM   #19
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I only run 20W50 because it is what the dealer always uses, the only time my bike had 10W40 in it was when it came from the factory.
Two things.
If the clutch noise is getting worse, change your oil and look for the afro effect on the drain plug, thst means youve got a bearing going south on you.
Second. What was the elevation you were trail riding at when you got the hot knocking?
Race fuel is not always the best idea especially for trail riding and this bike has the advance computer controlled, anyways.
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Old 11-21-2012, 06:25 AM   #20
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Had no chance to see if there were lots of chips on the oil drain plug as the dealer did the service. I'd prefer to do the oil change myself but you know...the warranty...


I was at around 500ft when the knocking appeared. As said, the engine was very hot from going very slow in first gear and the fan was running. By the way the first time ever that I heard it was on.

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Old 11-21-2012, 06:49 AM   #21
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Same here in Mexico, dealer has to do the maintenance or the warranty is not valid and that sucks.
Fortunately, I did the in between oil changes for my own piece of mind.
I had a situation with a warning light overheat, fan on, but it was on a steep rocky trail at over 14,000ft.
The oil light flashing signaled the overheat, by the way. These motors get hot when run in low gear in thin air.
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Old 11-22-2012, 03:56 AM   #22
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Agree with all you say. Have the same problem with my KTM 690 where there is an oil change only once every 10000k's or once a year. I also did one complete oil change in between at 5000k's, where complete means with all filters and screens (there are more than one on the KTM).

14.000ft? Wow, did you go up the K2? Well, although we are not used to flickering control lights it is nothing unusual in such altitudes. The air is just to thin to effectively cool the engine. This has been reported also by riders which were somewhere high up in Nepal.

CU
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Old 11-22-2012, 11:05 AM   #23
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There are three "abnormal" noises this engine series makes. One noise is benign, the other two lead to catastrophic engine failure.

Noise 1 is caused by the water pump gear and stacking tolerances. The range of permissible dimensions on this system lead to excessive side play in some gears. This noise is random in pattern, fairly tinny sounding and fairly loud in bad cases. None ever failed and I doubt any of these rattling water pump gears ever will. Mid 2011 BMW changed this gear out with a plastic one. I do not know how long this plastic gear will last but it is quiet no matter what its tolerances are.

Noise 2 is caused by incorrect clearances on the HLM big end bearing. This to my knowledge was only present on some early 2009 bikes though I sappose QC could fail and the problem could be introduced again. This was a loud lower end knock that was very detectable on a hot engine with hot oil. I'm sure higher weight oil will quiet it some but it will still explode at some point if this problem is present. On the positive side, when the HLM bearing fails the pieces tend to come out the forward and bottom parts of the engine which is preferred over the upper rear.

Noise 3 is caused by the timing chain being too long. It is unclear weather the excessive length of the timing chain is caused by a failed tensioner allowing harmonic oscillation of the chain, stacking tolerances of chain and gear size, defective chain, air ingress to timing chain damper oil supply through gasket on clutch cover, or just faulty design. This noise is present as the chain exceeds the length that the tensioner can tension. It will only be present when the oil is very hot so is unique and detectable.

Noise 1 is always there but will slowly get louder as oil gets thinner. This noise is only detectable at lower RPM. The solution is to ignore it or take your chances on a plastic water pump gear holding up.

Noise 2 will be louder as oil gets thinner and is detectable as very low in the engine with a stethoscope. This noise is detectable through the full rev range though exhaust noise may drowned it out. The solution is replacement of the HLM bearing before the engine explodes.

Noise 3 only occurs once the oil is very hot and has had time to heat the timing chain. on the average ride this noise may not present at all. If you idle the bike until the cooling fan has kicked on and off a half dozen times (20-30 minutes) this noise will always present if the timing chain is stretched beyond tolerance. The solution is replacement of the timing chain before 8 valves hit 2 pistons as the chain breaks. I'm a fan of replacing the tensioner as well and also replacing the clutch cover gasket as well as checking the flatness of the cover. NOTE: there is a PRECISE torque of the clutch cover as well as a SPECIFIC tightening sequence. I now know of 3 owners that removed their clutch cover and reinstalled without paying attention to torques and sequences and all 3 had their timing chains fail.


Good luck, hopefully this is just noise one, but if not, you really want this addressed under warranty as correction is at best a grand and at worst replacement of the engine.
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Old 11-22-2012, 12:31 PM   #24
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Good explanation. I am still absolutely sure that the noise comes from the clutch basket and not from the timing chain.

Without knowing exactly how the engine is constructed I wonder why a clutch cover should affect the timing chain

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Old 11-22-2012, 07:03 PM   #25
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Good explanation. I am still absolutely sure that the noise comes from the clutch basket and not from the timing chain.

Without knowing exactly how the engine is constructed I wonder why a clutch cover should affect the timing chain

cheers
Steve
It is somewhat normal to have some clutch rattle, as the plates are smacking around inside the basket. Mine have had a clutch plate rattle from the getgo, but when it bothers me too much, I go ride the DRZ....all cured.
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Old 11-23-2012, 11:25 AM   #26
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It is somewhat normal to have some clutch rattle, as the plates are smacking around inside the basket. Mine have had a clutch plate rattle from the getgo, but when it bothers me too much, I go ride the DRZ....all cured.
I do the same, just that I take the XR (BRP) instead of the DRZ. I dont take the DRZ because I dont have one
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Old 11-23-2012, 12:08 PM   #27
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I am glad my bike does not make this noise. Because I don't know what you folks are talking about. Dave
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Old 11-23-2012, 02:33 PM   #28
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I do the same, just that I take the XR (BRP) instead of the DRZ. I dont take the DRZ because I dont have one
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Old 12-07-2012, 01:43 PM   #29
ebrabaek
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Just switched to 20/50 from 10/40. As I am in the desert, it is warmer overall. I must say, the little missy has gone quiet'er....
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Old 12-09-2012, 10:59 AM   #30
Steveman OP
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Just switched to 20/50 from 10/40. As I am in the desert, it is warmer overall. I must say, the little missy has gone quiet'er....
Thanks for reporting!
I am not surprised, made same experience with a few other bikes
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