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Old 11-01-2012, 06:03 PM   #1
stren OP
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Brakes oil change on a 2009 Adv with ABS

Hi,

Sorry if this has been asked before but been looking for the past days and couldnt find any info.

Im due to do the brakes oil change and Im just not sure how to go on about it. The bike is a 2009 GS-Adv with ABS. Does the procedure from Jim von Baden applies to this bike? I mean, do I need that bleeding funnel? Or is it a completely different thing?

Cheers.

Stren
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Old 11-01-2012, 07:30 PM   #2
whisperquiet
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It is different....easier because your bike does not have the servo brakes.
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Old 11-01-2012, 07:42 PM   #3
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When ever anyone uses brakes and oil in the same sentence it makes me cringe. I do not mean to insult, but you must use DOT4 brake Fluid, it is not oil. If petroleum oil gets in a brake system, get out your wallet. Everything has to be rebuilt or replaced.

You only have one post, and it has happened before,

Rod
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Old 11-01-2012, 08:37 PM   #4
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It is real easy if you know how to bleed a standard brake system, because that is all you are doing. I just did this, I use a little thing I can't remember where I got it but it's called a one man brake bleeder or something like that.

Something like this...



Just hook this all up, and crack one bleeder at a time and when your reservoir is almost empty (but don't let it suck air!!!!), fill it up to the brim with your new fluid and pump until the new fluid starts showing in the bottle. For best results, make sure you mount the bottle on something lower than the caliper. Then you almost don't have to pump the master cylinder, you can probably just crack loose the bleeder and let the fluid drain out, just keep filling it at the top. Crack the bleeder on the other caliper and do the same. Front and rear brake fluid change and bleed should take less than an hour

I hate to be the one to go there but if you fill out your profile so people see where you live, what you ride, what your experience level is, etc, we can all be of a lot more help.

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Old 11-02-2012, 08:32 AM   #5
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Very simple, just follow these instructions: http://www.jimvonbaden.com/R1200_2007+_Brake_Bleed.html

Jim
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Old 11-02-2012, 11:54 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by whisperquiet View Post
It is different....easier because your bike does not have the servo brakes.

True, but.......your bike still has a servo in the ABS circuit. To flush that out you need a GS911 to activate the ABS.

Right Jim?
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Old 11-04-2012, 05:07 PM   #7
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Hi, thanks everyone for your input.

Rod, offence not taken at all. Sometimes we assume that people know the basics, and in the end they don't. That's when sh*t happens!

I was just not sure whether the fluid change was a normal brake bleeding or required a more complex process just like with the servo brakes.

Aviator, thanks for your help. Appreciate that. I will move on to filling out my profile details asap.

Billdonna, I dont think you need the GS911 to do the bleeding. If you did, I'm quite sure Jim would have pointed that out.

Jim, you are a legend! Thanks for a great website and even better DVDs.

Cheers,

Stren

I
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Old 11-04-2012, 08:54 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by billdonna View Post
True, but.......your bike still has a servo in the ABS circuit. To flush that out you need a GS911 to activate the ABS.

Right Jim?
The GS-911 will cycle your servo, but isn't really necessary to bleed the brakes, on any R1100/1150/1200.

Jim
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Old 11-05-2012, 04:22 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JimVonBaden View Post
The GS-911 will cycle your servo, but isn't really necessary to bleed the brakes, on any R1100/1150/1200.

Jim

Jim, I talked this thru with you before. You are correct, the GS911 is not necessary to bleed the brakes.

There is a small amount of brake fluid in the ABS servo circuit. If one wants a truely complete flushing of the brake fluid cicuit, in order to remove all contamination, the ABS must be cycled to introduce fresh, clean brake fluid into the servo.

If the brake fluid is bad enough to merit replacing, would one not want to ensure the ABS is cleaned as well? The GS911 added this function for a reason. It would be interesting to hear if the dealers cycle the ABS when they do a flush.
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Old 11-05-2012, 06:10 AM   #10
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I just did mine and used the 911. The 911 rapidly cycles the solenoids and does make for a better job! First I bled the brakes normally till fluid ran clear. I flushed them again a second time, now with the 911 hooked up. The fluid got cloudy again, not as much as before! It just made me feel better. The big advantage of the 911 is that the rapid cycling/pulsing help expell air in the fluid. My 0,02
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Old 11-05-2012, 09:18 AM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JimVonBaden View Post
The GS-911 will cycle your servo, but isn't really necessary to bleed the brakes, on any R1100/1150/1200.

Jim
Quote:
Originally Posted by billdonna View Post
If one wants a truely complete flushing of the brake fluid cicuit, in order to remove all contamination, the ABS must be cycled to introduce fresh, clean brake fluid into the servo.

If the brake fluid is bad enough to merit replacing, would one not want to ensure the ABS is cleaned as well? The GS911 added this function for a reason. It would be interesting to hear if the dealers cycle the ABS when they do a flush.
So for typical maintenance one does not need to cycle the servo? If it got contaminated, I could see it. But for the biannual flush it is not necessary? Also, under normal use, wouldn't the existing fluid in the servo migrate out? If so, I just might do a flush a week apart after the fluid cycles around.
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Old 11-05-2012, 09:24 AM   #12
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Originally Posted by The Evil Twin View Post
So for typical maintenance one does not need to cycle the servo? If it got contaminated, I could see it. But for the biannual flush it is not necessary? Also, under normal use, wouldn't the existing fluid in the servo migrate out? If so, I just might do a flush a week apart after the fluid cycles around.
The couple of teaspoons that are left will rapidly be diluted once the new fluid is introduced. That is why I do not feel it necessary. Kind of like an oil change, you never get it all out, but the little left is not an issue.

If you really want to do it, and do not have a GS-911, go ahead and ride the bike around activating the ABS a few times and do it again.

Personally, with two bikes over 50K miles and never having cycled the servos during brake flushes, I am pretty OK with it. The fluid is suficiently flushed every other year to keep the issues to a minimum. Keep in mind, cars use a similar system, and how many people flush their car brakes at all, let alone every two years?

Jim

PS I just wish to reiterate that you should do what you are comfortable with.

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Old 11-05-2012, 11:43 AM   #13
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Why not bleed the brakes, jump on the bike, find a dirt road and activate your ABS 5 - 10 times, and then bleed it again?

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Old 11-05-2012, 12:40 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by g_e_young View Post
Why not bleed the brakes, jump on the bike, find a dirt road and activate your ABS 5 - 10 times, and then bleed it again?

g-
Brake fluid has additives to control PH and prevent corrosion. As long as changed regular, they will protect against some small amount of old fluid.

So really no need.

Rod
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Old 11-06-2012, 04:27 AM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Evil Twin View Post
So for typical maintenance one does not need to cycle the servo? If it got contaminated, I could see it. But for the biannual flush it is not necessary? Also, under normal use, wouldn't the existing fluid in the servo migrate out? If so, I just might do a flush a week apart after the fluid cycles around.

Ok, here's my understanding of what's happening. If you flush again a week following your last flush, the fluid in the ABS will not have changed unless you have locked up your brakes.

The brake fluid we use is hygroscopic, ie. it pulls water out of the air and holds it in suspension. This fluid will appear cloudy as opposed to fresh fluid which is clear. The ABS is particularly sensitive to water and can/will corrode if left unchanged for extended periods of time. This is why the service schedule specs out regular flushes.

However...the ABS circuit is a normally closed circuit and only opens to pulse the brakes, when the Internal ABS Control Modulator is activated by the wheel sensors. This means (to me anyways) that a small amount of contaminated brake fluid is retained in the ABS control circuit if the ABS was activated at any time since your last flush.

Personally, I want this fluid to be cleaned out when I flush so that there will be no chance of corrosion in my ABS if it does not get activated for a couple of years. But...I am a stickler when wrenching. Like Jim says...do what you are comfortable with. I`m just giving another option.
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