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Old 11-10-2012, 04:57 PM   #31
ttpete
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DADODIRT View Post
Uh, radius or diameter?
OP was saying radius of, what was it, 36 feet. That's 72 feet of pavement?
Looking at the aerial pic, I'd say that anyone who can't get around that circle without putting a foot down probably shouldn't be riding on the public roads. Given the average rider's competency level, I feel that it's dangerous to ride anywhere near strangers.
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Old 11-10-2012, 05:05 PM   #32
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Any PGR rider's abilities are a totally seperate issue from the PGR group itself. The PGR do not road test members so I don't see how anyone can blame the group as a whole for a few bad apples. I guess that's the easy thing to do though. We can also lump this guy in with all HD riders or all white riders over 50 or whatever the case may be if it's easier than just saying "that guy can't ride".
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Old 11-10-2012, 05:43 PM   #33
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Originally Posted by txwanderer View Post
Well, ain't you just a special kind of cupcake. Join the club and get at the end of the line.
I am not special. I am a combat veteran of Vietnam. There are a lot of us. We killed people and people killed us. Your pirate brigade is pure bullshit. Fuck you and the horse you rode in on.
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Old 11-10-2012, 05:44 PM   #34
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Originally Posted by txwanderer View Post
Well, ain't you just a special kind of cupcake.
And you're a special kind of douchebag. If you want to dress up like a Pirate and play Patriot by all means do so, but don't expect us to think you're somehow doing something noble. Supporting military isnt equal to being military.
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Old 11-10-2012, 05:53 PM   #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ray h View Post
Any PGR rider's abilities are a totally seperate issue from the PGR group itself. The PGR do not road test members so I don't see how anyone can blame the group as a whole for a few bad apples. I guess that's the easy thing to do though. We can also lump this guy in with all HD riders or all white riders over 50 or whatever the case may be if it's easier than just saying "that guy can't ride".
The problem is that group rides containing riders of all skill levels are inherently dangerous. The make of motorcycle has nothing to do with it. Neither does the name of the organization. We've all seen video of chain reaction crashes caused by the skill mix and by poor organization and planning. To me, it's just an accident on its way to happen.
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Old 11-10-2012, 05:59 PM   #36
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Originally Posted by ttpete View Post
The problem is that group rides containing riders of all skill levels are inherently dangerous. The make of motorcycle has nothing to do with it. Neither does the name of the organization. We've all seen video of chain reaction crashes caused by the skill mix and by poor organization and planning. To me, it's just an accident on its way to happen.
I agree, it just seems that we have two different discussions going in this thread and some people are linking them together like they are related.
The guy who can't turn around in a culdesac has nothing to do with a person's views on the PGR.
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Old 11-11-2012, 08:37 AM   #37
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I've went on a half-dozen PGR "missions" in GA and SC and have been impressed with the organization of each one.

On another note...

"Combat Vet" means different things to different people and IMO, some folks are quick to throw it out there as if experiencing what they perceive as "combat" somehow adds credibility to what they are saying/posting.

I'm not trying to debate what is real "combat", rather to maybe encourage folks to leave that out of the conversation. Members of this forum whose life experiences have been profoundly shaped by what was seen/did downrange don't necessarily need the label "combat vet" to get credibility.

I still believe in what the PGR has evolved to. This photo was when we stood for Col. Murray.

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Old 11-11-2012, 10:40 AM   #38
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Originally Posted by dolomoto View Post

"Combat Vet" means different things to different people and IMO, some folks are quick to throw it out there as if experiencing what they perceive as "combat" somehow adds credibility to what they are saying/posting.

I'm not trying to debate what is real "combat",
...... uhhhhh, yeah you are.
If someone has served and they say they've seen combat - I'll take them at their word.
.... and if they tell the PGR to fuck off, I'll respect that too.
As said above, there's a big diffence between supporting military and BEING military..... and there's too many people that don't respect what serving actually means (as is evident in this thread)

I'd be real curious to know how many PGR members have served.
(I haven't)
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Old 11-11-2012, 03:37 PM   #39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dolomoto View Post
I've went on a half-dozen PGR "missions" in GA and SC and have been impressed with the organization of each one.

On another note...

"Combat Vet" means different things to different people and IMO, some folks are quick to throw it out there as if experiencing what they perceive as "combat" somehow adds credibility to what they are saying/posting.

I'm not trying to debate what is real "combat", rather to maybe encourage folks to leave that out of the conversation. Members of this forum whose life experiences have been profoundly shaped by what was seen/did downrange don't necessarily need the label "combat vet" to get credibility.

I still believe in what the PGR has evolved to. This photo was when we stood for Col. Murray.
I'm not ashamed of my service, nor am I embarrased about having the badges of honor showing my direct involvement in "combat" as it's defined by the United States military. If I want to talk about it publicly, I've served to protect that right not only for myself, but for all the other's.

Just like I served to protect your freedom of speech to try and demand to set rules for others when you have no right to do so on a public forum - I may not agree with it, but I was willing to lay down my life to defend it, just like all the others who've served or are still serving.

I don't need your permission to have "credibility", so -

To the rest of you - Happy Veterans Day whether you're an American service menber, or one from another country and thank you for your service regardless of whether you served in "combat" or not!

For those who haven't served, but support the people who have - thank you, there's not one Vet who doesn't apprecaite it!

Oh, and dolomoto - just so there's no misunderstanding in the message I'm trying to communincate here

As far as the PGR goes, my opinion doesn't matter - all I hope is they do the right thing by the Veterans and their families without turning it into a political event, or reason to party and not show reverence. Their original charter and intent is very honorable, and I respect that. It's good to hear other's are having a better experience than I had, ride safe under the blanket of freedom our Vets provide!

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Old 11-11-2012, 03:44 PM   #40
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PGR experiences

My experience has been a mix of good and less than good but is on balance positive. I'm usually the only non-cruiser rider there (on my mighty Wee Strom ) but the PGR in this area have been nothing but welcoming. It's hard to be the new guy joining any established group, but if you say yes to going to breakfast a couple of time it goes a long way toward getting to know people. I never got the "HD nagging" (at least not seriously) that some people have mentioned, but it has mentioned that I don't dress like everybody else...

I'm not a fan of formation riding and will likely never be. I find it very stressful to be in such close quarters with a bunch of other bikes and the inevitable slinky effect from the front of the line to the back doesn't help my confidence any. We have a national cemetery in our area so there's usually quite a few missions during the season (mission = a funeral, event = other rides like Toys for Tots, fundraisers, events for the local VA, etc).

All in all I'm glad I participate. I've met some nice folks from all walks of life and the families of the departed seems to appreciate our presence.

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Old 11-11-2012, 05:51 PM   #41
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Another Wee ridin' member of PGR...

If only a KLR showed up and joined us...

NFE
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Old 11-11-2012, 06:05 PM   #42
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BuddingGeezer View Post
I certainly support the PG's mission. All the PG members I see ride open (loud) pipe cruisers and dress like 1%s. I don't feel like a Honda ST1100, closed face helmet and textile clothing fits.
Same bike and gear as myself. Showed up at the last moment ( actually rode in in with the bike pulling the herse trailer). No one asked me any question and I was polite to everyone. The pace on the ride was quick and the riders I was with were skilled. There were many riders on the route I can't vouch for.
I did not feel excluded and I didn't try to see my way into anything.
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Old 11-11-2012, 06:19 PM   #43
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BuddingGeezer View Post
I certainly support the PG's mission. All the PG members I see ride open (loud) pipe cruisers and dress like 1%s. I don't feel like a Honda ST1100, closed face helmet and textile clothing fits.
I have been to numerous PGR missions on my wee, with my friend on his GoldWing, and have never had even a single comment about "real bikes". As a matter of fact, they have been very open to anyone who is there to support the cause. I wear a full face helmet and textile even on my RoadGlide

I suggest that y'all get over your self imposed discrimination theories, and remember the purpose of the rides, not the appearance of the riders. Sure, there are riders that don't know what they're doing, it's not a performance ride, it's a ride to honor a veteran.

I used to ride my Harley with a group of sport bike riders in California, I dould out-ride 75% of them in the twisties, and always did, but no one ever complained or made fun of another, because we were there to ride, at our own pace and our own level. I've also ridden my Bergman with Harley riders and been both faster and safer than them. You know what, I don't care! They're all riders, they're all doing what they believe to be an honorable thing for veterans and the families of vets, get over the type of bike, the style of cloths, tats or not, beards or not, the point is to honor a vet.

Rant over, than you for your patience....
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Old 11-11-2012, 06:56 PM   #44
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It is not about the patriot guard it is to ease the pain of the family and friends, and perhaps ease their own personal pains. . If the families loss is eased by having the guard there, then good for them.

I have attended one funeral with the PG there. It was obvious the family appreciated the show of comradeship. The VFW did a 21 gun salute. They gave the spent cartridges to the family. They will keep them. The patriot guard left with a lot of noise. Same thing. One of them said lets make some noise to let hell know they do not get this soul.

And 2 for motorcyclists. One was a co worker in a patched club. His widow and kids took comfort in all present. I did not not fit in, yet I was welcome and I felt better and they felt better. Same show of noise for their fallen brother.

The other was a group of guys that liked to ride and camp and party. No uniforms, no patches. But the exact same bond and group easing of pain. And same noise.

When people are under stress they act funny. You have no way to know what personal demons each of these riders carry with them. So if they act strange to you, well it is not about you.

if you get no benefit, then you probably should find what works for you.

I was honored to be a part of each. Even if a BMW makes no noise.

Rod
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Old 11-11-2012, 08:26 PM   #45
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Quote:
Originally Posted by No False Enthusiasm View Post
Another Wee ridin' member of PGR...

If only a KLR showed up and joined us...

NFE
That or a 250 Ninja.

pmacb
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