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Old 10-24-2013, 10:58 AM   #5101
mdubya
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Parx400 View Post
LInk?
GP One wasn't enough?

http://www.gpone.com/en/201310241198...-Petrucci.html
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Old 10-24-2013, 12:37 PM   #5102
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wiseblood View Post
Anyone post this yet?



Why is everyone shocked and amazed and acting like this has never happened before?
Rossi last year...(Hector Barbera and Casey Stoner also had chunking issues)


Dani in 2009...


http://www.bikesportnews.com/news-de...fm?newsid=7421



It isn't new...it has happened before and it will happen again.
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Old 10-24-2013, 12:39 PM   #5103
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ZLTFUL View Post
Why is everyone shocked and amazed and acting like this has never happened before?
Rossi last year...(Hector Barbera and Casey Stoner also had chunking issues)

It isn't new...it has happened before and it will happen again.

Comforting thought at 300+kph eh?
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Old 10-24-2013, 12:45 PM   #5104
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Originally Posted by DC2wheels View Post
Comforting thought at 300+kph eh?
You take the worlds most powerful motorcycles, you develop a tire to take the most physically demanding stresses in motorsports and you hope for the best. Most of the time, they get it right. Sometimes, they get it wrong.

When it happened at Assen last year, nobody said, "Oh...Bridgestone must not have tested enough..."
When it happened to Dani in 2009, it was attributed to a manufacturing hiccup.

Bridgestone came into the race with as much information as they could attain short of a top name rider on a top flight bike and a weekend worth of testing and they miscalculated.

They took a risk by supplying a tire without having 100% of the data they needed. That risk *normally* pays off...this time it didn't.


Talk to test pilots about risk...about taking a plane up that seems to work great on paper but then crashes in a fiery ball of...well...fire.

The point is, it is all about calculated risk.
I am not trying to be the devil's advocate here but shit has happened before and shit will happen again. Best to learn as much as you can from it and move on.
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Old 10-24-2013, 12:49 PM   #5105
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Originally Posted by ZLTFUL View Post
the most physically demanding stresses in motorsports .

Source?

Agree with the rest of your post but I don't think that statement is accurate.
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Old 10-24-2013, 12:52 PM   #5106
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Amazing that the major limiting factor that Dorna puts on these bikes is the one item that has the greatest safety risk to not only the riders, but the whole show (as seen last weekend).

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Old 10-24-2013, 12:56 PM   #5107
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Quote:
Originally Posted by swimmer View Post
Source?

Agree with the rest of your post but I don't think that statement is accurate.

So you don't think that connecting a motorcycle, leaned over, at 200+mph on a contact patch the size of a credit card requires a tire that can handle immense physical forces?

Compare this to a NASCRAP slick or a Formula 1 slick...those tires have massive contact patches comparatively.
They spread the force of braking through all 4 contact patches while a MotoGP bike is a lot of time 100% braking on just the front tire.

From: http://www.motogp.com/en/MotoGP+Basics/tyres

Quote:
One of the most remarkable things about World Championship motorcycle racing is the way in which the transfer of the phenomenal power of the MotoGP™ bikes takes place through tyre-contact patches not much bigger than the size of a credit card.
In comparison with racing cars, motorcycling’s four-wheeled counterparts benefit from having roughly ten times as much tyre-contact surface - so it is an understatement to say that with 240 horsepower at their disposal tyre selection is critical for MotoGP™ riders. The power delivery to contact surface ratio is much greater than in any form of car racing.
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Old 10-24-2013, 01:01 PM   #5108
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Originally Posted by ZLTFUL View Post
Why is everyone shocked and amazed and acting like this has never happened before?

After 11 laps?
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Old 10-24-2013, 01:04 PM   #5109
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Originally Posted by wiseblood View Post
After 11 laps?
Rossi pitted at like lap 13 at Assen in 2012 and swapped out his rear tire.
By then, the tire had lost several chunks about the diameter of a baseball.
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Old 10-24-2013, 01:06 PM   #5110
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I never said the tire is not handling high forces. I am just not convinced it's the most demanding tire application in motorsports. It wouldn't take much to convince me, just a quote from a tire engineer from Bridgestone or Pirelli would be enough.

I have actually read that top fuel dragsters/funny cars is the most demanding tire application in motorsports. That was a comment from a Goodyear person but, goodyear aint making motogp tires.
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Old 10-24-2013, 01:07 PM   #5111
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Originally Posted by ZLTFUL View Post
When it happened at Assen last year, nobody said, "Oh...Bridgestone must not have tested enough..."
When it happened to Dani in 2009, it was attributed to a manufacturing hiccup.

Bridgestone came into the race with as much information as they could attain short of a top name rider on a top flight bike and a weekend worth of testing and they miscalculated.
Can΄t remember them getting the tyres so wrong before, that nobody could do no more than 10 laps, or they will be toast. Ok, Marquez did, and his rear was in a dangerous condition.

Besides, Bridgestone claims that they will be able to make a tyre, that will last the distance for 2014. So they admit, that lack of testing was really the only reason.

(BTW, Stoner lives in Oz, has tested for Honda just lately, and does go pretty well at PI...)
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Old 10-24-2013, 01:31 PM   #5112
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I agree with you Pecha...but several riders claimed that they were able to go over 20 laps on the same tires with little to no issues...

swimmer...several publications are available on the subject...
Vehicle Dynamics and Control, 2005, R. Rajamani
Tire and Vehicle Dynamics, 2005, H.B. Pacejka
Contact Mechanics, 1987, K.L. Johnson
Vehicle Dynamics: Theory and Application, 2009, R. N. Jazar

Unfortunately, I don't have the ISDN's handy atm...

Anyway, I won't deny that the rotational forces in top fuel dragsters are immense but you are placing force on the tire in 2 planes...while a motorcycle tire up to 4 planes of directional force.

While the Wikipedia explanation simplifies things quite a bit, it is still a good read:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bicycle...cycle_dynamics

In comparison, the elaborate explanation of car tire dynamics doesn't require nearly as much to explain:
http://www.menet.umn.edu/~gurkan/Tir...%20Lecture.pdf

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Old 10-24-2013, 02:38 PM   #5113
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Meanwhile, Yamaha are reported to have asked for the incident between Lorenzo and Marquez - who made contact in Australia as Marquez rejoined the circuit following his late pit stop - to be examined by Race Direction...

just read this on Crash .... the things Yamaha will do to win ... tossers
JL already said it was a 50/50
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Old 10-24-2013, 02:51 PM   #5114
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Meanwhile, Yamaha are reported to have asked for the incident between Lorenzo and Marquez - who made contact in Australia as Marquez rejoined the circuit following his late pit stop - to be examined by Race Direction...

just read this on Crash .... the things Yamaha will do to win ... tossers
JL already said it was a 50/50
I disagree - MM seemed to move into the racing line when he should have stayed left. As the pit speed limit was extended to the end of the lane, there was no way he could have been anywhere near race speed.

MM already has a full dance card - this could see him at the back of the grid.
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Old 10-24-2013, 03:03 PM   #5115
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As JL said he braked late and took a wider line
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