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Old 11-26-2012, 08:54 AM   #106
wzd1a
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I'm not whining - I am over it. My formerly conservative opinions were obviously wrong - only the federal gov't knows what is best for everyone.

This thread however, is a lot of whining. Get over it - go for a walk.
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Old 11-26-2012, 09:43 AM   #107
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Signed everything, sent a letter, and cross posted the info to another forum that's mainly snowmobilers but many members also ride dirt. As snowmobiliers, none of us there are new to these fights, we've battled for access for a long time, so many of them should be all over this.
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Old 11-26-2012, 10:19 AM   #108
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Originally Posted by FatChance View Post
Unfortunately, everyone did get together on November 6th and the majority decided they wanted to support the guy who will sign away your land access rights. I find it ironic to hear the outrage about this closure of public land from the same people who actively supported him right here in the Rockies forum knowing that this was one of the things he wanted to do.
Oh pleeeze. You don't really think that this all came about on Nov 7th do you? This is the Sierra club and I don't recall seeing anything in either parties platform about Nat Monuments. They do however want to save money so that may be our best hope for a counter attack. They can't enforce what they have now.
I have been fighting land closures forever. It goes back to the un-muffled 2Ts yet we continue to ride with guys on (now) uber loud 4Ts.
If some of the nitwits would have listened to how annoying loud dirt bikes were back then we would not have near the problems that we are facing now. They will claim sedimentation, fish, salamanders, etc. but the noise and outright racing on trails through the forest is what brought this on.

We can't peacefully co-exist anymore. We missed our chance.

Now it is up to litigation $$$$ and politicians $$$$ to bail us out.


Oh yeah, the next time a guy shows up for a ride on a loud bike, un-welcome him.
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Old 11-26-2012, 10:51 AM   #109
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Originally Posted by dmac1 View Post
In case you don't have time to find it, here is the link that will generate a letter to president obama. Takes all of 20 seconds.
https://secure3.convio.net/arra/site...s64a52.app331a
Done.
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Old 11-26-2012, 11:55 AM   #110
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Originally Posted by FatChance View Post
Unfortunately, everyone did get together on November 6th and the majority decided they wanted to support the guy who will sign away your land access rights. I find it ironic to hear the outrage about this closure of public land from the same people who actively supported him right here in the Rockies forum knowing that this was one of the things he wanted to do.
Got any details on that?
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Old 11-26-2012, 11:55 AM   #111
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You guys are trying to somehow associate this MAJOR land grab with the recent elections and that couldn't be farther from the truth. Was that on the platform or even an issue in the campaign? Take the blinders off, stay focused and do something about THIS.

Just a quick search about the Sierra club will tell you what is going on.

The value of building Sierra Club membership became clear as development increasingly threatened the wilderness. The vast Sierra Forest Reserve, initially thought inviolable, had been opened to logging and sheep grazing, and in 1914 the Club conducted its last outing to Hetch Hetchy Valley before it was flooded by a reservoir. Muir died that Christmas Eve; some thought his heart was broken by the loss of this majestic canyon on the Tuoloumne River. In the same year, automobiles first entered Yosemite Valley, and with them began the modern era of industrial tourism, presaging future conflicts for the Club.

You must understand your enemy in order to defeat them. That's why I study women.

The president in the white house is the least of our problems here. He is not going to make a decision all by himself!!
If you really want to do something, don't just write the president, write the Utah legislators, the governor, the mayor of Moab, the interior secretary, and of course the businesses and let them know why this will affect THEM. They don't care how much you like to ride dirt bikes. Really.....they don't.

We have seen this recently in NM. Everyone talks a mean talk, but doesn't have the time to go to a meeting or send $20 to the Blue Ribbon Coalition. I remember Ned putting some stuff up here a few years ago about a Utah trail alliance and I sent them a few bucks. There are things that you can do to help, but mostly what they will need is money right now.

We are too splintered with alliances and coalitions everywhere. The Sierra Club is focused and is a machine that has tremendous clout and resources.

Can someone find out where the best place to send $$ to fight this fight is?

Don't turn this into a post election pity party. This is an enviromental land grab, pure and simple.

Boo! Look out! Obama is going to take your guns too!
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Old 11-26-2012, 12:04 PM   #112
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Contact Salazar by US Mail, e-mail or phone:

Secretary Ken Salazar
Department of the Interior
1849 C Street N.W.
Washington DC 20240

feedback@ios.doi.gov

202/208-3100
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Old 11-26-2012, 12:11 PM   #113
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Originally Posted by Gordy View Post
You guys are trying to somehow associate this MAJOR land grab with the recent elections and that couldn't be farther from the truth. .

Boo! Look out! Obama is going to take your guns too!
Your simply wrong - it is directly related to the elections as is the gun grab proposed Nov. 24, 2012 here in CO,


1st story on Utah one week after election:

More than 100 outdoor-recreation companies Tuesday formally petitioned President Barack Obama to designate a national monument surrounding Canyonlands National Park near Moab, a major tourist hub for everything from mountain biking to navigating the area's famous slot canyons....

....Other groups from the Sierra Club to Great Old Broads for Wilderness complained to Secretary of the Interior Ken Salazar in 2011 about "rampant off-road-vehicle abuse, proposed uranium and tar sand mining, and oil and gas development" in Utah's canyon country.

Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/travel/2012/1...#ixzz2CFYoNAEt

Co Gun control from Nov. 24, 2012:

AURORA-The conversation on gun control is getting louder ever since the theater shootings this summer. Many victims of the shooting and their families say now is the time to take a stance. They're lobbying the legislature to pass stricter laws during the coming legislative session.

Representative Beth McCann and Representative Rhonda Fields are co-sponsoring a bill that would ban the sale and possession of assault weapons and high capacity magazines. McCann says the bill is still in the early stages, but it's coming along.

"I'm looking at legislation to address banning the sale and possession of really assault weapons. I'm really targeting these weapons that seem to be designed to shoot as many people as you can in a short period of time," McCann said.

An Edison Research poll conducted for the AP shows that the majority of Coloradans are fine with the way gun laws are now. Representative McCann says the results of the poll aren't consistent with the feedback she's been getting so she'll continue to push for stricter laws. Governor Hickenlooper says he welcomes the conversation on gun control, but says it goes hand in hand with the conversation on mental health.
Political experts say because the house and senate are controlled by the Democrats, it's likely that the bill will at least make it out of committee.

Link: http://www.9news.com/rss/story.aspx?storyid=301373

Yep it is related - no doubt - but this is what the majority want, so ok.
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Old 11-26-2012, 12:12 PM   #114
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gordy View Post
You guys are trying to somehow associate this MAJOR land grab with the recent elections and that couldn't be farther from the truth. Was that on the platform or even an issue in the campaign? Take the blinders off, stay focused and do something about THIS.

Just a quick search about the Sierra club will tell you what is going on.

The value of building Sierra Club membership became clear as development increasingly threatened the wilderness. The vast Sierra Forest Reserve, initially thought inviolable, had been opened to logging and sheep grazing, and in 1914 the Club conducted its last outing to Hetch Hetchy Valley before it was flooded by a reservoir. Muir died that Christmas Eve; some thought his heart was broken by the loss of this majestic canyon on the Tuoloumne River. In the same year, automobiles first entered Yosemite Valley, and with them began the modern era of industrial tourism, presaging future conflicts for the Club.

You must understand your enemy in order to defeat them. That's why I study women.

The president in the white house is the least of our problems here. He is not going to make a decision all by himself!!
If you really want to do something, don't just write the president, write the Utah legislators, the governor, the mayor of Moab, the interior secretary, and of course the businesses and let them know why this will affect THEM. They don't care how much you like to ride dirt bikes. Really.....they don't.

We have seen this recently in NM. Everyone talks a mean talk, but doesn't have the time to go to a meeting or send $20 to the Blue Ribbon Coalition. I remember Ned putting some stuff up here a few years ago about a Utah trail alliance and I sent them a few bucks. There are things that you can do to help, but mostly what they will need is money right now.

We are too splintered with alliances and coalitions everywhere. The Sierra Club is focused and is a machine that has tremendous clout and resources.

Can someone find out where the best place to send $$ to fight this fight is?

Don't turn this into a post election pity party. This is an enviromental land grab, pure and simple.

Boo! Look out! Obama is going to take your guns too!
+Agazillion, well said Gordy!!
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Old 11-26-2012, 12:12 PM   #115
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Petition signed and letters being worked on.
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Old 11-26-2012, 12:20 PM   #116
enduro-ince
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wzd1a View Post
Your simply wrong - it is directly related to the elections as is the gun grab proposed Nov. 24, 2012 here in CO,


1st story on Utah one week after election:

More than 100 outdoor-recreation companies Tuesday formally petitioned President Barack Obama to designate a national monument surrounding Canyonlands National Park near Moab, a major tourist hub for everything from mountain biking to navigating the area's famous slot canyons....

....Other groups from the Sierra Club to Great Old Broads for Wilderness complained to Secretary of the Interior Ken Salazar in 2011 about "rampant off-road-vehicle abuse, proposed uranium and tar sand mining, and oil and gas development" in Utah's canyon country.

Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/travel/2012/1...#ixzz2CFYoNAEt

Co Gun control from Nov. 24, 2012:

AURORA-The conversation on gun control is getting louder ever since the theater shootings this summer. Many victims of the shooting and their families say now is the time to take a stance. They're lobbying the legislature to pass stricter laws during the coming legislative session.

Representative Beth McCann and Representative Rhonda Fields are co-sponsoring a bill that would ban the sale and possession of assault weapons and high capacity magazines. McCann says the bill is still in the early stages, but it's coming along.

"I'm looking at legislation to address banning the sale and possession of really assault weapons. I'm really targeting these weapons that seem to be designed to shoot as many people as you can in a short period of time," McCann said.

An Edison Research poll conducted for the AP shows that the majority of Coloradans are fine with the way gun laws are now. Representative McCann says the results of the poll aren't consistent with the feedback she's been getting so she'll continue to push for stricter laws. Governor Hickenlooper says he welcomes the conversation on gun control, but says it goes hand in hand with the conversation on mental health.
Political experts say because the house and senate are controlled by the Democrats, it's likely that the bill will at least make it out of committee.

Link: http://www.9news.com/rss/story.aspx?storyid=301373

Yep it is related - no doubt - but this is what the majority want, so ok.
OK I get it. They (OIA and friends) wouldn't of bothered to petition Mittens right?

Well I guess all we can do is write and donate for now and see what the president and company decide. I hope that he swats this hole thing down and that then all you bitter folks will LET IT GO!!!! its unhealthy
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Old 11-26-2012, 12:56 PM   #117
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gordy View Post
You guys are trying to somehow associate this MAJOR land grab with the recent elections and that couldn't be farther from the truth. Was that on the platform or even an issue in the campaign? Take the blinders off, stay focused and do something about THIS.

Just a quick search about the Sierra club will tell you what is going on.

The value of building Sierra Club membership became clear as development increasingly threatened the wilderness. The vast Sierra Forest Reserve, initially thought inviolable, had been opened to logging and sheep grazing, and in 1914 the Club conducted its last outing to Hetch Hetchy Valley before it was flooded by a reservoir. Muir died that Christmas Eve; some thought his heart was broken by the loss of this majestic canyon on the Tuoloumne River. In the same year, automobiles first entered Yosemite Valley, and with them began the modern era of industrial tourism, presaging future conflicts for the Club.

You must understand your enemy in order to defeat them. That's why I study women.

The president in the white house is the least of our problems here. He is not going to make a decision all by himself!!
If you really want to do something, don't just write the president, write the Utah legislators, the governor, the mayor of Moab, the interior secretary, and of course the businesses and let them know why this will affect THEM. They don't care how much you like to ride dirt bikes. Really.....they don't.

We have seen this recently in NM. Everyone talks a mean talk, but doesn't have the time to go to a meeting or send $20 to the Blue Ribbon Coalition. I remember Ned putting some stuff up here a few years ago about a Utah trail alliance and I sent them a few bucks. There are things that you can do to help, but mostly what they will need is money right now.

We are too splintered with alliances and coalitions everywhere. The Sierra Club is focused and is a machine that has tremendous clout and resources.

Can someone find out where the best place to send $$ to fight this fight is?

Don't turn this into a post election pity party. This is an enviromental land grab, pure and simple.

Boo! Look out! Obama is going to take your guns too!
Truth and intelligence. Can't be said better.
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Old 11-26-2012, 02:17 PM   #118
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wzd1a View Post
Your simply wrong - it is directly related to the elections as is the gun grab proposed Nov. 24, 2012 here in CO,


1st story on Utah one week after election:

More than 100 outdoor-recreation companies Tuesday formally petitioned President Barack Obama to designate a national monument surrounding Canyonlands National Park near Moab, a major tourist hub for everything from mountain biking to navigating the area's famous slot canyons....

So this would have been held back for four years had the GLOP controlled the White House? Wrong, this has been coming for a looong time and they are well prepared. Do you really think that they drew this up in a few weeks.??

Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/travel/2012/1...#ixzz2CFYoNAEt

Link is broken.

Co Gun control from Nov. 24, 2012:

AURORA-The conversation on gun control is getting louder ever since the theater shootings this summer. Many victims of the shooting and their families say now is the time to take a stance. They're lobbying the legislature to pass stricter laws during the coming legislative session.

Representative Beth McCann and Representative Rhonda Fields are co-sponsoring a bill that would ban the sale and possession of assault weapons and high capacity magazines. McCann says the bill is still in the early stages, but it's coming along.

"I'm looking at legislation to address banning the sale and possession of really assault weapons. I'm really targeting these weapons that seem to be designed to shoot as many people as you can in a short period of time," McCann said.
You going deer hunting with an actual assault weapon. Keep prepping.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Proud Highway View Post
^ poster boy for civic illiteracy.

The exclusive power to designate a NM is by executive order (see Antiquities Act of 1906).

You are completely wrong if you are suggesting that Romney would have (mis)used the office to decree a multimillion acre NM in Utah.

and you know this how???

This isn't an attack on anyone's politics or a matter subject to debate. It's just a plain fact. Elections have consequences. In this case, this is one of the consequences.
Sure elections have consequenses mister literate. But the national election that was three weeks ago have nothing to do with a well planned out land grab in Utah by enviromentalists that have been trying this for the better part of our lifetimes not only here but all over the place. This proposal would not have been shelved to wait out the dems in the White House. If you don't like how the election turned out, sorry. Get involved there too and maybe get a better candidate next time.

If you guys want to rally behind the GOP and how this would not have happened under your guy, go right ahead, but why don't you do it in CS&M so that we can get to work here and help save Canyonlands.
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Old 11-26-2012, 02:59 PM   #119
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Boy, that's a lot of red and caps and such. Here's a fixed link - http://www.foxnews.com/travel/2012/1...utah-monument/. The story was obviously moved since I posted that link weeks ago here: Rampart Range becoming a wilderness area? Post #10. (date 11.14.2012)

This was posted was a week before this thread was conceived - yeah, you guys get right on this.....

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gordy View Post
You going deer hunting with an actual assault weapon. Keep prepping.

Sure, hunting was what the founding fathers were considering w/ 2nd amendment rights....


If you guys want to rally behind the GOP and how this would not have happened under your guy, go right ahead, but why don't you do it in CS&M so that we can get to work here and help save Canyonlands.
I am not rallying around the GOP - I can't wait for this and other closures to happen. The faster the better.

wzd1a screwed with this post 11-26-2012 at 03:09 PM
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Old 11-26-2012, 03:04 PM   #120
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Originally Posted by doc_ricketts View Post
Got any details on that?
Doc, you are an intelligent, insightful man. Look in the mirror...
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