ADVrider

Go Back   ADVrider > Bikes > Trials
User Name
Password
Register Inmates Photos Site Rules Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Old 12-14-2012, 03:41 PM   #1
rotorhead511 OP
Live and let live.
 
rotorhead511's Avatar
 
Joined: Nov 2011
Location: Milton, Fl
Oddometer: 402
AvGas, what say you.

Anyone using it. There is a local airport that has it but not sure if low lead is ok. AvGas is 100LL which is 100 octane, good for the bike, LL is the low lead not sure if its good for the bike.
__________________
'12 450 XC-W
'08 450 EXC-R (Sold)
'04 GasGas TXT Pro 280
rotorhead511 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-14-2012, 03:49 PM   #2
laser17
Studly Adventurer
 
Joined: Mar 2008
Location: Boston,Massachusetts
Oddometer: 581
Its fine.
laser17 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-14-2012, 03:55 PM   #3
EZman671
Adventurer
 
Joined: Jul 2011
Oddometer: 87
Ran a Lycoming aircraft engine many years on 100LL.

Do not let it fool you LL is not very low lead. Spent many hours scraping/picking lead deposits out of the spark plugs.

Not sure where to verify this but I think I read at one time it was close to one ounce of lead per gallon.

Many also think that high octane gas has more power. Octane is more for the control of burn rate to prevent detonation.

Air cooled engines typically have many hot spots within the cylinder valve area that can easily trigger detonation. So in that sense the 100 octane is good. What lotza lead will do to your engine is the question but I bet it is not anything good.

On top of that 100LL is not cheap.

Look around for a marine type place they often have non-alcohol gas available.
EZman671 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-14-2012, 05:07 PM   #4
neilking
Gnarly Adventurer
 
Joined: Mar 2008
Location: Austin, TX
Oddometer: 406
Actually lead is a good lubricant. The actual compound is called tetra-ethyl-lead, it's not lead in pure form.
__________________
74 TY 80, 175 and 250 no longer at Brewtus's house
86 TLR200
95 Sportster 1200
13 Factory Beta 250
neilking is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-14-2012, 05:45 PM   #5
kanur
Studly Adventurer
 
kanur's Avatar
 
Joined: Nov 2007
Location: Cape Girardeau, MO
Oddometer: 631
I use it in everything 2 stoke I have, It will store for a very long time and it does not damage vintage fiberglass tanks. If I put corn-o-hol in my Sammy Miller tank'ed TY's the carb will be clogged with resin so bad the slide will be sticky to touch in a week. I have not drained the tanks in the 2 years since I started using the Av-Gas
__________________
Just cause I don't run my mouth don't mean I got nuth'n to say. Mike Cooley DBT
kanur is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-14-2012, 06:38 PM   #6
2whlrcr
gooligan
 
Joined: Jan 2005
Location: Dubuque, Iowa
Oddometer: 4,960
Quote:
Originally Posted by EZman671 View Post
Ran a Lycoming aircraft engine many years on 100LL.

Do not let it fool you LL is not very low lead. Spent many hours scraping/picking lead deposits out of the spark plugs.

Not sure where to verify this but I think I read at one time it was close to one ounce of lead per gallon.

Many also think that high octane gas has more power. Octane is more for the control of burn rate to prevent detonation.

Air cooled engines typically have many hot spots within the cylinder valve area that can easily trigger detonation. So in that sense the 100 octane is good. What lotza lead will do to your engine is the question but I bet it is not anything good.

On top of that 100LL is not cheap.

Look around for a marine type place they often have non-alcohol gas available.
I agree with this. I had a 115hp Lycoming with a STC to run automotive gas. To meet the engine's lead requirement, Lycoming recommended using only one tankful of avgas per 100 hours of run time.
2whlrcr is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-14-2012, 06:38 PM   #7
hexagonstiffnuts
n00b
 
Joined: Feb 2012
Oddometer: 8
I've been working on planes for about 25 years and riding for at least 30 so I've used my share of 100LL. I will only use it straight if storing a bike for the winter. AV-gas doesn't go bad like car gas, it can't, some of those little prop jobs sit for months at a time between flights and if your carb starts acting up on take off . You will get lead deposits in the exhaust and combustion chamber if used a lot and I've found my gas mileage suffers on my street bikes. It sure smells nice though, unlike that crap from the local Citgo.
hexagonstiffnuts is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-14-2012, 07:45 PM   #8
Tosh Togo
Beastly Adventurer
 
Joined: Nov 2010
Oddometer: 1,594
Quote:
Originally Posted by EZman671 View Post
Ran a Lycoming aircraft engine many years on 100LL.

Do not let it fool you LL is not very low lead. Spent many hours scraping/picking lead deposits out of the spark plugs.

Not sure where to verify this but I think I read at one time it was close to one ounce of lead per gallon.

Many also think that high octane gas has more power. Octane is more for the control of burn rate to prevent detonation.

Air cooled engines typically have many hot spots within the cylinder valve area that can easily trigger detonation. So in that sense the 100 octane is good. What lotza lead will do to your engine is the question but I bet it is not anything good.

On top of that 100LL is not cheap.

Look around for a marine type place they often have non-alcohol gas available.
What he said... it's only Low Lead when compared to the amount of TEL that was in avgas back in the good old days.

Another good source for reliable stable fuel in whatever octane you want would be any of the places that sell race fuel.

Quote:
Originally Posted by neilking View Post
Actually lead is a good lubricant. The actual compound is called tetra-ethyl-lead, it's not lead in pure form.
While there's some truth to that in terms of saving certain kinds of poppet-valve seat materials, the OP's bike is a two stroke.
Tosh Togo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-14-2012, 09:27 PM   #9
TXNMGUY
dirt dobber
 
Joined: Sep 2010
Location: Pagosa Springs, Co.
Oddometer: 90
Been using AVgas 100LL from my local airport. Have not had one problem with it.
TXNMGUY is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-16-2012, 06:06 AM   #10
Twin-shocker
Beastly Adventurer
 
Joined: Jan 2012
Oddometer: 1,673
Quote:
Originally Posted by rotorhead511 View Post
Anyone using it. There is a local airport that has it but not sure if low lead is ok. AvGas is 100LL which is 100 octane, good for the bike, LL is the low lead not sure if its good for the bike.

Trials bikes are relatively low revving and dont run high compression. As such there is no real need to run higher octane fuel, and all thats really required is proper jetting, and adjusting pilot mixture to suit conditions on the day bike is being ridden.
Twin-shocker is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-16-2012, 07:12 AM   #11
broncobowsher
Beastly Adventurer
 
broncobowsher's Avatar
 
Joined: Apr 2010
Location: Baking in AZ
Oddometer: 1,004
I suspect my local source of race gas may dry up. If rumors of Firbird closing do happen then I expect the race gas at the pump across the highway will go as well. They have the pump for the needs of the racers across the street.

If/when that happens I plan to hit the local airport for 100LL. I run AV gas in my 50 year old boat as well. The AV gas is great storage fuel. I have had it sit without any stabalizer for years. Half a tank will evaporate, but what was left was still good. No stink, not gummed or anything bad. Can't say that for pump gas. The only thing is getting AV gas is more or a pain then pulling up to the pump. I have to go through the Cafe enterence follow the special path then turn and head to the self pay pump. Not bad when only getting 5 gallons at a time, royal pain when you need 20 gallons for the boat.
broncobowsher is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-16-2012, 09:41 AM   #12
Tosh Togo
Beastly Adventurer
 
Joined: Nov 2010
Oddometer: 1,594
Quote:
Originally Posted by Twin-shocker View Post
Trials bikes are relatively low revving and dont run high compression. As such there is no real need to run higher octane fuel, and all thats really required is proper jetting, and adjusting pilot mixture to suit conditions on the day bike is being ridden.
FYI- low rpm and high loads, (as in trials riding) are a big part of what sets the stage for detonation. At high rpm there isn't enough time for detonation to happen.

CR alone is no indication of what may happen for a given fuel.... there are some bike engines with 8:1 that detonate on anything less than really good fuel, and I've got one in my garage with ~13:1 that is happy on 87 pump gas.

Quote:
Originally Posted by broncobowsher View Post
I suspect my local source of race gas may dry up. If rumors of Firbird closing do happen then I expect the race gas at the pump across the highway will go as well. They have the pump for the needs of the racers across the street.

If/when that happens I plan to hit the local airport for 100LL. I run AV gas in my 50 year old boat as well. The AV gas is great storage fuel. I have had it sit without any stabalizer for years. Half a tank will evaporate, but what was left was still good. No stink, not gummed or anything bad. Can't say that for pump gas. The only thing is getting AV gas is more or a pain then pulling up to the pump. I have to go through the Cafe enterence follow the special path then turn and head to the self pay pump. Not bad when only getting 5 gallons at a time, royal pain when you need 20 gallons for the boat.
You should contact these guys to see what they can do... there's a good chance that there's a fuel vendor close enough to you.

http://www.vpracingfuels.com/
Tosh Togo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-16-2012, 09:59 AM   #13
Twin-shocker
Beastly Adventurer
 
Joined: Jan 2012
Oddometer: 1,673
The main reason a well maintained trials motor might knock when using Efuel, is due to the jetting in a specific area of the rev range being incorrect. Add to this the need to adjust pilot mixture to suit atmospheric conditions on the day the bike is being used, and the stage is set for various old wives tales about the need to use high octane fuels.
Twin-shocker is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-16-2012, 10:02 AM   #14
Tosh Togo
Beastly Adventurer
 
Joined: Nov 2010
Oddometer: 1,594
Quote:
Originally Posted by Twin-shocker View Post
The main reason a well maintained trials motor might knock when using Efuel, is due to the jetting in a specific area of the rev range being incorrect. Add to this the need to adjust pilot mixture to suit atmospheric conditions on the day the bike is being used, and the stage is set for various old wives tales about the need to use high octane fuels.


Yuppers... a stoichiometric A/F ratio is a great way to set the stage for detonation. Add a lot of throttle at low revs, and...

By the time you hear it, it's usually too late.
Tosh Togo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-16-2012, 10:34 AM   #15
Twin-shocker
Beastly Adventurer
 
Joined: Jan 2012
Oddometer: 1,673
I wonder how many trials motors you have encountered which have blown up due to detonation? Weird how people seem to think low heat/compression motors, need the type of fuel which you would want to run in a race motor with 13:1 compression! Poor maintenance and preparation though will greatly increase the chances of knocking, and I would guess there are plenty of bikes 2-3 years old or more, which have never had new rings or exhaust systems properly serviced.
Twin-shocker is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Share

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

.
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On

Forum Jump


Times are GMT -7.   It's 11:28 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.5
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright ADVrider 2011-2014