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Old 06-25-2013, 04:21 PM   #256
DRTBYK
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Future Request

How about an Android app to run on the just announced Garmin Monterra. Load your RN file and the RN app reads the GPS position and advances the roll chart automatically. You could allow "scrolling" forward and back with a "return" button that would bring the chart back in sync with your current position.

To bad I'm old and have lost my coding skills - not really. I am old but I'd rather ride than code. I don't do roll chart rides very often these days but still like the concept.

Just some thoughts...great work guys.
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Old 06-25-2013, 05:16 PM   #257
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Originally Posted by wingnut11 View Post
So I thought it was mentioned that this could be printed as a pdf. My question is this, Is it possible to simply save it as a pdf file? say on a smart phone? I can read pdf files on my phone, so I was thinking maybe I could sort of use it as an electronic roadbook.
you can get free pdf drivers like nitropdf to print free to pdf. It may not be as customizable as the native adobe drivers, but maybe it'll work for you. Oh... and reading it on a phone. You will be miserable. Try it though.
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Old 06-25-2013, 07:24 PM   #258
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DRTBYK View Post
How about an Android app to run on the just announced Garmin Monterra.
There's already an electronic roadbook, called Tripy. Nobody uses it for racing in this type of rally that I'm aware of, probably because the real racers don't want it. Here are a few thoughts to consider:
- The Monterra screen is way too small.
- Paper is more reliable and field repairable than electronics.
- There's no way any serious rally organization would allow a fully programmable consumer GPS product to be used if cheater apps could be loaded and used in the race. Most of the standard functions the Monterra does, like showing a map, would be considered cheating in a rally. An essential part of rally is the unique navigation and the constant questioning yourself if you're in the right place. You’re never supposed to know where you are, other than that you believe you are where the roadbook tells you to be.
- It would be cheating to have the roadbook “sync” itself to a GPS type locating device. This goes with the previous point.
- How would you connect the roadbook forward/reverse handlebar buttons to this device? Does it allow external hardware inputs? Craftcoder did it on a standard Android device, but not sure about the Monterra? Using the touch screen to scroll would be completely unacceptable on a bike.
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Old 06-25-2013, 07:36 PM   #259
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Originally Posted by beechum1 View Post
you can get free pdf drivers like nitropdf to print free to pdf. It may not be as customizable as the native adobe drivers, but maybe it'll work for you. Oh... and reading it on a phone. You will be miserable. Try it though.
Actually I think you may be right. Originally I thought if it could be saved as a pdf I could use a smart phone in landscape view to read it and have the road books on there instead of taking up space on my bike. But the more I thought about it the more I don't like the idea. It may work and I might still see if it can be done just because, but at this point I don't think it will be a way that would work well for me. Thanks for talking me out of it.
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Old 06-25-2013, 08:06 PM   #260
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HogWild View Post
There's already an electronic roadbook, called Tripy. Nobody uses it for racing in this type of rally that I'm aware of, probably because the real racers don't want it.
Scott
I feel I need to chime in here as Tripy sponsors me I dont want to derail this thread so bear with me..

If I loaned you my extra you would have a totally different opinion about Tripy... its software is similar to Rally Navagator.. but much more advanced to be used with the unit..

It actually is the GPS unit that the Dakar uses to map the rally (you can actually see David Castera using it on last years maping/ pre run video) and it is utilized by all the service vehiicles in the rally.

The only drawback is they do not have a map for north america yet and no plans to in the near future.

Back to regualar Rally Navagator programming .. keep up the great code work Dave and thanks Mike!
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Old 06-25-2013, 08:30 PM   #261
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HogWild View Post
There's already an electronic roadbook, called Tripy. Nobody uses it for racing in this type of rally that I'm aware of, probably because the real racers don't want it. Here are a few thoughts to consider:
- The Monterra screen is way too small.
- Paper is more reliable and field repairable than electronics.
- There's no way any serious rally organization would allow a fully programmable consumer GPS product to be used if cheater apps could be loaded and used in the race. Most of the standard functions the Monterra does, like showing a map, would be considered cheating in a rally. An essential part of rally is the unique navigation and the constant questioning yourself if you're in the right place. You’re never supposed to know where you are, other than that you believe you are where the roadbook tells you to be.
- It would be cheating to have the roadbook “sync” itself to a GPS type locating device. This goes with the previous point.
- How would you connect the roadbook forward/reverse handlebar buttons to this device? Does it allow external hardware inputs? Craftcoder did it on a standard Android device, but not sure about the Monterra? Using the touch screen to scroll would be completely unacceptable on a bike.
I believe there is some use of this type of tech in competitive racing (Tripy) but my suggestion was aimed more at the recreational use of Roll Charts which seems to be growing lately around the world. It was also just a geeks' view of a way to enhance Rally Navigator's recreational use.

As for the tech - keeping in mind I'm talking recreational use - it's not a problem to remote the control of the display using Bluetooth or WiFi. But, I don't think scrolling linked to the GPS would be an issue for recreational use.

I don't believe the Monterra will need a Mapping application (craftycoder's) since it will have Garmin's but using his app to link via WiFi to DualSportMaps.com might be interesting for travel without a laptop.
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Old 06-25-2013, 08:53 PM   #262
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wrk2surf View Post
If I loaned you my extra you would have a totally different opinion about Tripy...
I already have a pretty positive opinion of Tripy. I just don't want one for myself to display a roadbook for racing purposes. BTW, does it have the ability to display satellite imagery while planning a route? To me, that's the essence of laying out a good rally route, which is why RN uses that approach. I almost never use any sort of map when planning a route. Maps hide all the best places I want to go, and the best ways to get there. "HP" is the best part of rally, and no maps anywhere show those HP paths.

Quote:
Originally Posted by DRTBYK View Post
my suggestion was aimed more at the recreational use of Roll Charts which seems to be growing lately around the world. It was also just a geeks' view of a way to enhance Rally Navigator's recreational use.
For dual sport roll chart type use, a rugged Android device would be great. Some on the D37 forum already asked if RN supported a narrow roll chart format. If Mike wants to keep forking out more money to add more features, I think a roll chart format option would be a cool and popular addition.

Quote:
Originally Posted by DRTBYK View Post
I don't believe the Monterra will need a Mapping application (craftycoder's) since it will have Garmin's but using his app to link via WiFi to DualSportMaps.com might be interesting for travel without a laptop.
I was refering to his remote control switch/joystick thingy that I think plugs into an Android device USB port.
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Old 06-26-2013, 02:49 AM   #263
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And there is:
http://advrider.com/forums/showpost....&postcount=138

Other thoughts:
Last minute changes of the roadbook. Cut and glue.
Your own method, notes on it.
One size for all.

It is the basic rallyroadbook game you play.
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Old 06-28-2013, 05:57 AM   #264
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Ipad mini app?

For the recreational rider, would there be any interest in an ipad mini app (essentially a pdf reader) that could be scrolled forward/back using a mechanical connection?

My thoughts:
- ipad mini in a griffin survivor case (mini is a similar size to paper roadbooks)
- attachment of roadbook remote (f2r, RNS, mecasystems) via an M8 connector to the headphone jack to scroll forwards/backwards

Not sure exactly what would be involved with the code for such a thing or if there are 'apple' issues with the connector cable in question.

I think it would be easier to justify a purchase of an ipad mini vs a roadbook given its multiple other uses, and eliminates the paper scroll printing issue. Certainly sounds more appealing to the recreational rider. Get lost, open up another GPS app that takes you home.

Thoughts? Worth pursuing?
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Old 06-28-2013, 07:57 AM   #265
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HogWild View Post
...

For dual sport roll chart type use, a rugged Android device would be great. Some on the D37 forum already asked if RN supported a narrow roll chart format. If Mike wants to keep forking out more money to add more features, I think a roll chart format option would be a cool and popular addition.

I was refering to his remote control switch/joystick thingy that I think plugs into an Android device USB port.
If RN could provide a PDF format for a narrow roll chart I'm sure there are coders out there who can whip up a "reader" for either Android and/or iOS. Android would certainly be the easiest solution platform and given that you would only need forward/back scrolling, I still think you could easily adapt one of the many sealed Bluetooth remote controls. As an EE I don't like USB ports for anything other than in-home desktop use. But any physical connection would open the IPV67 envelope defeating the purpose.
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Old 06-28-2013, 07:59 AM   #266
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Originally Posted by Gany View Post
For the recreational rider...
For the budget minded recreational rider, I would think a dual-sport narrow roll chart format would be better. Print on sheets on your home printer, cut to width, tape together. Roll chart holders are under $30. That keeps the cost to almost nothing, and doesn't risk hundreds of dollars in sensitive electronics when you crash.


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Old 06-28-2013, 11:37 AM   #267
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HogWild View Post
For the budget minded recreational rider, I would think a dual-sport narrow roll chart format would be better. Print on sheets on your home printer, cut to width, tape together. Roll chart holders are under $30. That keeps the cost to almost nothing, and doesn't risk hundreds of dollars in sensitive electronics when you crash.


I absolutely agree re: budget minded user. I have one of those rollchart holders on my gear shelf.

There is some irony in your attache photo and caption: "doesn't risk hundreds of dollars in sensitive electronics when you crash." e.g, a Garmin Rino 530 held on with rubber bands.
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Old 07-02-2013, 09:50 AM   #268
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Originally Posted by DRTBYK View Post
There is some irony in your attache photo and caption: "doesn't risk hundreds of dollars in sensitive electronics when you crash." e.g, a Garmin Rino 530 held on with rubber bands.
That Rhino will take ALOT more abuse than any smartphone will! I just look at my iPhone and it scratches itself...
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Old 07-02-2013, 10:56 AM   #269
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That Rhino will take ALOT more abuse than any smartphone will! I just look at my iPhone and it scratches itself...
Notice the "rolling on the floor" Smily. I own two Rino's and can attest to their durability. None the less, affixing the unit with rubber bands in the context of HogWild's post is very funny.
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Old 07-02-2013, 12:26 PM   #270
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Originally Posted by DRTBYK View Post
None the less, affixing the unit with rubber bands in the context of HogWild's post is very funny.
Fortunately that photo is just something random I grabbed from the net. It's not MY setup. No windshield for me!
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