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Old 08-09-2013, 06:38 AM   #1
Prmurat OP
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Option for raked tree?

Has anyone used "racked cups" instead of raked triple trees?
Something like this on Ebay: item:190544961001
In general: is 3 degrees enough or is it better to go to 5??
Thanks.
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Old 08-09-2013, 07:54 AM   #2
GreatWhiteNorth
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Trail reduction

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Originally Posted by Prmurat View Post
Has anyone used "racked cups" instead of raked triple trees?
Something like this on Ebay: item:190544961001
In general: is 3 degrees enough or is it better to go to 5??
Thanks.
I don't think that'll actually reduce steering effort. What you're looking to achieve is "trail reduction", not just raking the front end out. Some time ago I stumbled across this pic on the 'net which explains it well:



Several companies offer modded triple trees - I bought mine for my Gold Wing from Side Effects in Kamloops BC. Made a huge difference.
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Old 08-09-2013, 09:26 AM   #3
jaydmc
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raked cups will do almost nothing for you. You want to reduce trail. You did not say what bike you are working with. We have many different triple tree's. Side-effects is no longer doing tree's
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Old 08-09-2013, 10:45 AM   #4
JustKip
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Triple tree vs. Leading link?

Does a modified TT reduce trail and steering effort as much as LL? I KNOW LL costs quite a bit more...
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Old 08-09-2013, 11:16 AM   #5
Old Mule
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trail

Kip, it is not the method used to reduce trail that counts, but the amount of trail that you end up with.
There have been many solo bikes that used leading link forks, from Honda 50s to springer Harleys.
Use the diagram up above to do the calculations on your own bike. What is the trail now?

Just get the number down to about half of that, and then figure out which method you want to use to achieve your goal.

Ther are a couple threads on this site that go deeply in to the subject of leading link and Earles forks. Do your research.
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Old 08-09-2013, 12:44 PM   #6
jaydmc
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As stated, it does not matter how you reduce trail as long as you reduce it. I like to get the final numbers under 2 inches when possible. In the past leading links were the only way to go as fork tube diameter was a lot smaller then most bikes are using today. As such forks tended to flex a lot and also have stiction issues that made leading links a better way to go. There are many other ways that work out well to reduce trail. So, What bike are you working with?
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Old 08-10-2013, 02:52 PM   #7
claude
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Cups may reduce trail more with some triple trees than others. It just depends on how much structural 'meat' on has to work with on any given tree. You do not want to compromise the structural integrity of the trees..period..

Aftermarket trees are probably better in most cases than cups. However....make sure that the producer of the aftermarket trees is okay with them being utilized for sidecars or trikes. Some trees are made to work with the chopper type solo bikes with steering head angle changes and long front ends to arrive at a decent trail figure and may not be up to the task of handling the side loads imposed by a dual track vehicle.

Champion does nice stuff.... Jay's stuff should be fine..there are others. Leading links are still my favorite for various reasons but we do trees also.
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Old 08-12-2013, 07:46 AM   #8
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Thank you Claude for your lights.
How do you explain the price difference between these 2 items:
Ebay # 281142558830
Champion page: http://www.championsidecars.com/prod...ID=6&itemID=25

I could understand a few $100s but simple to double?!

Thank you!!
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Old 08-12-2013, 09:38 AM   #9
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If you are wanting to decrease the amount of trail on a solo bike, to make it steer better with a sidecar attached, I cant see how increasing the rake angle by fitting chopper type triple trees is likely to help with this?

Would have thought increasing the angle also means much more trail, and means bikes handle worse than with the stock triple trees?
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Old 08-12-2013, 09:52 AM   #10
jaydmc
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Take another look at the rake and trail calculator, When the front wheel is moved forward with out changing the angle at the steering head (which would require cutting and welding or "raked" bearing cups) you are moving the axle closer to the line that is drawn from the steering head which leaves you with less trail making for lighter steering. Changing the "rake" if it is done at the frame as it would be with cups or cutting and welding on the frame not only moves the line from the steering head to the ground forward but it also moves the axle making for little change in trail.
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Old 08-12-2013, 11:06 AM   #11
Twin-shocker
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Interesting.................I would have thought raking the yokes, would have resulted in steering flopping over in one direction or the other, when the bar's are turned, in pretty much the same way as you would get with a chopper?

Steepening the steering angle by altering the frame itself, tends to mean much more positive steering on older style bikes, many of which have much more rake than a modern sports machine.
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Old 08-14-2013, 08:23 PM   #12
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I returned today from an almost 1800 mile trip with my girlfriend. Around town or solo, my K1100/Ural works great. Heavily loaded and racking up miles, I get weary. Time for me to research the options.
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Old 08-15-2013, 06:50 PM   #13
Prmurat OP
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So no explanations on price difference?
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Old 08-15-2013, 07:30 PM   #14
GreatWhiteNorth
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Big difference

Quote:
Originally Posted by Prmurat View Post
So no explanations on price difference?
Leading links are (usually) waaay more expensive than modified triple trees.
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Old 08-17-2013, 10:19 PM   #15
Prmurat OP
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Does anyone know what the size of the extension (fork tubes) offered with the raked trees from Champion?
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