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Old 01-27-2013, 06:18 PM   #76
wizz
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PeterW View Post
The DL 650 is WET weight + all fluids. You can add at least 25kg to the other two , which admitted don't get them up to Mr Porky :), but gets them a fair bit closer. The DL is still more likely the one you'd get to ride home from your adventure as well (as compared to it being on the back of a truck)


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Thats ridiculous. the 620 is a proven reliable air cooled mill, as the strom has also proven to be. neither are likely to end up "in the back of a truck" unless its due to rider error. And after doing the valves and belts I have zero concern of the engine "grenading". It more closely resembles my old vfr than the light motor of my exc. The weak points on the multi is the suspension (same with strom, xr, dr, klr, and a lot of the midweight adv bikes) and valves every 6000 miles. None of the bikes mentioned are truly lightweight bikes in the sense of ktm exc and the ilk, but if youre worried about 88,000 lbs behind you I wouldnt be riding a thumper either unless it can pump
some horses like a 690.
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Old 01-27-2013, 08:50 PM   #77
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Hello wiss. The 88 000 lbs was my comment to SRG on why some Japanese bikes weigh in heavier that other manufactures units. The Jap's tried to make light bikes, but some of the frames on a few models from the big 3 had some problems that poped up along the way. The dealers reported this to the manufactures, and the push to fix many of the frame problems were solved with renforcement gussetes in critical points where it was needed.


From Jeathrow Bowdean PS: But what would I know about this stuff !!!

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Old 01-27-2013, 09:44 PM   #78
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Im no engineer, but I can appreciate what youre saying. The engineering that goes into some of the chassis design is just awesome.
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Old 01-28-2013, 07:04 AM   #79
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In the good old days before computers and huge design facilities, Colin Chapman (founder of Louts cars) would remove or lighten components to the point of premature failure. He'd then go back one design generation and call it good. His (racing) drivers were not as fond of this technique as Colin was. Colin called it "adding lightness".
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Old 01-28-2013, 10:49 AM   #80
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Gusseting and strengthening frames (Ducati frames are quite strong as a rule, and often steel rather than aluminum) should add only a few pounds. More weight is often added as the result of heavier wheels, cycle parts, steel or iron brake components, less consideration of weight in areas of seat pans and individual choices to save expense when picking materials for other areas. The pounds add up. I don't mean to make light () of the difficulties and expenses added and inherent in using exotic materials in place of less expensive and equally as strong (or stronger) individual components. Mass has benefits, but those do not include superior performance or necessarily better design, reliability or longevity. Often, the decision to build from one material or another comes down to cost. Certainly practical considerations enter the picture. Aluminum/alloy bodywork is both more expensive to manufacture and more easily damaged in service for a given tensile strength, but rarely is it considered inferior, and pound for pound, offers more strength than steel. But it costs much more to form and is generally harder to maintain on a vehicle designed to take street knocks.

As a rule, for equal strength, it costs less to build a heavier device than a lighter one. Lotus racing efforts and their early cars are good example not simply of lighter weight being less reliable design, but rather of the resulting durability of their process. Chapman was a brilliant designer, but the execution of the ideas in certain vehicles left a lot to be desired. It is quite fair to say that it costs less to build a heavy vehicle than a lighter one of equal strength, but in so many ways light weight is a tremendous asset in anything that must move to make a living. Today's technologies are capable of great strength for weight, but you have to be willing to pay for it.
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Old 01-28-2013, 11:01 AM   #81
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I was hung up in both of my worlds of what to do last year. I like street bikes and off road units, and it end up being that I had to do 2 units. The wee started off as my all rounder, with the idea of 90% hyw and 10% off road, but I found out that the off road thing was for hard dry gravel roads with stock tires on the wee. A few bad spots that told me a-lot about the bike and my self. This is where my second bike came from. I have had a XL 600, then a KLR 650, and a DR 650 just before the wee-v. So something lighter was needed to replace the 650cc catagory, and it ended up being a DRZ 400. It's not a power house until I meet Eddie Oh'Dell. I'm on a stage 1 power kit with the opition to move up to more power if I need it, but the stage 1 kit got me up to speed.

My dream bike is 500cc 200 lbs, and a 6 speed trany with a nice seat. I hope that the bike engineers get this under way before I get to old to ride. Ha

From Jeathrow Bowdean

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Old 01-28-2013, 02:04 PM   #82
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... the mythic WR450R...

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Old 01-30-2013, 09:13 PM   #83
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Jan 30/ 2013. It's -29 c with a wind chill factor of -37 and it is time to take V-Pig to tune up guy since I won't be riding for a few days, " " " More like a few Months that is !!! " " " I rolled her out into the snow for loading into the back of the pick up truck, and the 600 lbs pig did not like going up the ramp, so I desided to use the out side dirt mound.

I drove the V Pig up to the dirt / ice mound, and over it went. I guess the V Pig didn't want to go for a tune up, but if is going to happen, it has to happen. The cheap hand guard is not rated for -37 c if you folks are woundering. Ha Ha.

The V Pig was laying 10 degrees past center, with wheels higher then the handle bars, and I will say one thing that I know for sure. This V Pig is heavy, and I'm sure that many bikes out there are. I one maned V Piggy back onto her feet, and the tune-up dude is happy to have something to work on.

For some strange reason, I can see that my lighter custom DRZ project is now going forward after fighting with V-Pig. At least if I go down, I won't need to use my super powers to get it off the ground !!!

From Jeathrow Bowdean. PS: At my middle age bracket. Lighter is better !!!
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Old 01-30-2013, 11:12 PM   #84
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SRG View Post
I know different manufacturers come up w/ their listed weights differently - some more "real world" than others. Doesn't change the fact that the 620 MS indeed close to 400# and most of the others aren't - esp. the Japanese ones. How do they make a VStrom 650 and Versys 650 outweigh a Ulysses?
They don't. You are comparing apples and tangerines.

Go to a reliable source that actually weighs the bikes they test (say, MCN) and see what they list as wet weight for the different bikes you are interested in. They don't have all the tests online, but just as an example here are some of what you can find on their website:

2004 V-Strom 650 - 471.5 lbs (5 gal of fuel included)
2008 Versys 650 - 452.5 lbs (5 gal of fuel included)
2006 XB12s - 470.5 lbs (4.4 gal of fuel included)

The XT has a claimed dry weight 25 lbs higher than the Lightning (XB12s) so it's not likely that it is actually lighter than a V-Strom, let alone a Versys despite carrying less fuel. The wet weight of a Uly is closer to 500 lbs than 400. Regardless, there is no doubt that a Uly is not a "boring" bike. Whether that makes it the bike you are looking for is up for you to decide after you ride one. Spec sheets (whether based on apples or tangerines ) are meaningless until you see if it actually works in the real world.


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Old 01-31-2013, 06:22 AM   #85
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2004 V-Strom 650 - 471.5 lbs (5 gal of fuel included)
2008 Versys 650 - 452.5 lbs (5 gal of fuel included)
2006 XB12s - 470.5 lbs (4.4 gal of fuel included)

So the 1200cc Ulysses and the (highly recommended) 650cc V Strom are nearly identical in weight. No one else thinks that's at least odd or unexpected? At least the 650 Versys is 18# (not so much, really) lighter than the 1200 Uly.

The only wet weight for the 620 Multistrada I could find was 437# which is moving away from the goal of 400# but it's still the lightest of our group.
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Old 01-31-2013, 06:29 AM   #86
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SRG View Post
2004 V-Strom 650 - 471.5 lbs (5 gal of fuel included)
2008 Versys 650 - 452.5 lbs (5 gal of fuel included)
2006 XB12s - 470.5 lbs (4.4 gal of fuel included)

So the 1200cc Ulysses and the (highly recommended) 650cc V Strom are nearly identical in weight. No one else thinks that's at least odd or unexpected? At least the 650 Versys is 18# (not so much, really) lighter than the 1200 Uly.

The only wet weight for the 620 Multistrada I could find was 437# which is moving away from the goal of 400# but it's still the lightest of our group.
The Multistrada 620 is aircooled. It helps making it the lightest of this bunch.
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Old 01-31-2013, 10:21 AM   #87
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I, um, knew that. Aircooled (old school) w/ fuel injection and 6 speed box (new school). I had a Duc SportClassic 1000 for a short time - it has a bigger version of the same motor - I thought it was very nice (the rest of the bike was not my cup of tea).
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Old 02-05-2013, 05:12 PM   #88
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For a note of closure to this thread - I just made a deal on a near new (4k mi.) '06 620 Multistrada for <$5500. It's really a nicer bike than I needed, but I'd say the goals were met plus some. Can't wait - this is gonna be fun.
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Old 02-05-2013, 07:08 PM   #89
wizz
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awesome, congratulations.
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