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Old 03-28-2014, 09:59 PM   #31
ebrabaek
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Joined: Jan 2010
Location: El Paso,NM
Oddometer: 4,606
Quote:
Originally Posted by 1coolbanana View Post
I got an email back from Rekluse asking me to strip it down and take pics and measure everything up, which Ive done.
In the process, Ive discovered that the apparent numbers on the discs is the pics above are meaningless as Ive found that I have about the same number of each number and they all look the same bar the one with the wider friction pads.
So forget about the numbers on them, the only difference is visual.

Also, I need to clarify that all the slipping I was getting was high revs not low, like above 5k rpm when opening her up in 4th, 5th and 6th gears.

Ive taken it for a quick spin and no slip now but a cant really try it out at "out of town" speeds in the burbs.
That is under high load/torque. For some reason there are not enough clamping force on your plates. And you can/will wear out your clutch in a matter of a few runs. Stay with Rekluse. I pointed the thread to them, and I have nothing but the utmost confidence they will fix'ya up. That's what they do.
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Old 04-23-2014, 04:12 AM   #32
1coolbanana
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After a bit more emailing to and fro and Ive sent all the images which to me, the machining looked a little rough, burred and scratched up on the slider pads.
Rekluses conclusion that there is nothing wrong, so I put it all back together and have ridden another 500klms.
Ive had to adjust it once more, backed off, as it was starting to slip in the higher revs again.
Its now set to about 3/4 of a turn and the last 300 klms has been ok...but why wouldnt it be, after all, Im told theres nothing wrong with it

See how it goes.
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Old 04-23-2014, 05:04 AM   #33
Yascher
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That is complete crap...something is totally wrong here, as the recluse itself is designed to disengage at idle, and all the adjustment should do, is to tune in the exact moment it disengages and has no drag at idle.
If you get some slip on revs slightly above idle, it means need to run in or adjust.

But yours slips at high torque/load-therefore it is not recluse related (at least directly) it means that it slips due to too little friction in the discs-which could be the result of many things:
- damaged/dented discs
- incorrect oil (which i doubt)
- damaged/grooved clutch basket, which grabs the discs and prevents normal sliding/enegagement

just to check, try changing for heavier set-up with optional parts from recluse kit.

might be a good idea to post your parts pictures here as well

last resort-put the original clutch discs without the exp and see if it works properly, but keep the recluse slave
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Old 04-23-2014, 04:20 PM   #34
RoundOz
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My recent install slipped in high gears on first trial. I had adjusted the clutch movement as per the manual....1/8" or so when revved. I checked the adjustment again when I got back (everything heated up and broke in well) and there was no clutch lever movement (slack) at all. Adjusted it again to the 1/8th to 1/4" movement when revved and have put 500+ miles on it with no further slippage. Perfect.

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Old 04-23-2014, 04:25 PM   #35
RoundOz
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BTW, I am several hours from home, the bike and the install manual but I am oretty sure the troubleshooting section states that slippage in high load situations can be due to incorrect adjustment...not enough lever movement when revved in neutral.

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Old 04-23-2014, 04:33 PM   #36
1coolbanana
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Yascher View Post
That is complete crap...something is totally wrong here, as the recluse itself is designed to disengage at idle, and all the adjustment should do, is to tune in the exact moment it disengages and has no drag at idle.
If you get some slip on revs slightly above idle, it means need to run in or adjust.

But yours slips at high torque/load-therefore it is not recluse related (at least directly) it means that it slips due to too little friction in the discs-which could be the result of many things:
- damaged/dented discs
- incorrect oil (which i doubt)
- damaged/grooved clutch basket, which grabs the discs and prevents normal sliding/enegagement

just to check, try changing for heavier set-up with optional parts from recluse kit.

might be a good idea to post your parts pictures here as well

last resort-put the original clutch discs without the exp and see if it works properly, but keep the recluse slave
I had temporarily re-installed my original clutch and its perfect with the Rekluse slave.
Standard clutch is as new and works great, no issues there.
The bike only has 12k klms (8000 miles?)
I just refitted the Rekluse after emails with them and as I said, started slipping again at higher revs, Ive backed out/adjusted the slave and all has been fine for 300 or so k's.
The Rekluse is totally related to high speed slip as it is what creates the gripping force by expanding when the revs are increased.

My current theory is that the poor machining, burrs and scratched up sliding pad sufaces (from burrs floating around) have required longer than normal run in.

Will post the pics later.
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Old 04-25-2014, 03:36 AM   #37
1coolbanana
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Pics as requested









Adjustment is currently set at 3/4 turn on the slave and no slipping in 300k's
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Old 04-25-2014, 03:42 AM   #38
Yascher
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I'm not sure what exactly 3/4 turns are doing, I didn't use the manual and adjust only by the grab on the idle, as far as bike it slowly trying creeping forward without brakes when fully hot it is OK, if it doesn't creep, than it means there is too much slack, and it might slip in the taller gears at increased torque
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Old 04-25-2014, 06:24 PM   #39
RoundOz
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Okay...I have the Exp 2.0 manual in front of me now.

The term is Free Play Gain...the amount the clutch lever play increase on revving the bike in neutral. The 3/4 turn (1 turn in the book) is just the initial adjustment of the slave cylinder. The free play gain is the correct way to fine tune this and it should be checked after warming up and after break-in, and periodically thereafter. 1/8" is the recommended gain. It is also stated that the LC-8 is prone to large changes from cold to warmed-up. The bike should not be ridden without it adjusted correctly, it says. There are videos and docs on the website that illustrate this. The latest version is the 3.0 ...not sure of the changes.
By the way, my kit came with different weights and springs for adjustment. Not sure what effect these have but I'm guessing it would change how and when the clutch engages. I have not felt the need to experiment...mine feels pretty good.
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Old 04-25-2014, 06:27 PM   #40
RoundOz
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I agree with your adjustment point...

...mine is adjusted per the manual and has a slight tendency to creep forward. I can easily hold it with one foot on the ground.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Yascher View Post
I'm not sure what exactly 3/4 turns are doing, I didn't use the manual and adjust only by the grab on the idle, as far as bike it slowly trying creeping forward without brakes when fully hot it is OK, if it doesn't creep, than it means there is too much slack, and it might slip in the taller gears at increased torque
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Old 04-25-2014, 07:16 PM   #41
renogeorge
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I have installed several of these on smaller KTMs. It easy to miss the "start" point on the slave adjustment. When you are there, it will be MUCH harder to turn. I missed this the first time and started counting clicks too soon. As someone said, the "free gain" works. Keep turning the adjuster in until you have the specified gain/clutch lever movement. Then fine tune in SMALL increments.

FWIW
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Old 04-26-2014, 02:38 AM   #42
1coolbanana
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Went for a little 30 k ride today and there was no more slipping but it does shudder on take off.
EXP 3 is different to EXP 2 in that the EXP 3 comes with a set of six drive plates.
The different spring combos are for changing the feel of the clutch take up, from slow smooth, standard and hard and fast.
The different weights are for the 950.
My free gain is still at 3mm, at just that creep point where its always been...........until it starts to slip and then theres none and the slave has to be backed off
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1coolbanana screwed with this post 04-26-2014 at 02:45 AM
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Old 04-26-2014, 05:56 AM   #43
RoundOz
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My info may be different...

...but the 2.0 instructions (yes I found that section at the back) say the weights are for softer engagement (both 9x0's use the same heavy weights standard). and the spring combos are for adjusting where the engagement point is -different combos for 990/950.
I'm obviously no expert, just a happy end user with, in this case, the wrong manual, but I don't think your adjustment should be so finicky. Here are the steps I would try though, unless you have already done them:
Bleed the slave one more time...slowly and carefully.
Use mineral oil unless all your components have been changed and brake fluid is ok.
Make sure your engine oil is JASO MA rated and clean.
Check your idle speed is correct (Via TuneEcu is the only way I have done it but I am sure there are other ways)
Check your chain adjustment and whether it is stretched in one spot (thinking of causes for the shuddering).
Check the slave is operating smoothly (May need to remove the clutch cover to do that).
Check for free play in the clutch components
Check the clutch boss/judder spring (don't know much about this - just repeating what the manual says)
Check that all the plates are flat on a piece of glass
Lightly deglaze them and rinse them well.
Check that if you are using different spring colors, that the two colors are on opposite sides of the EXP.
Again, sorry if you have done all this.
If still not happy contact an expert (like CJ) who uses a Rekluse and/or hit Rekluse or your distributor up for new components.

Quote:
Originally Posted by 1coolbanana View Post
Went for a little 30 k ride today and there was no more slipping but it does shudder on take off.
EXP 3 is different to EXP 2 in that the EXP 3 comes with a set of six drive plates.
The different spring combos are for changing the feel of the clutch take up, from slow smooth, standard and hard and fast.
The different weights are for the 950.
My free gain is still at 3mm, at just that creep point where its always been...........until it starts to slip and then theres none and the slave has to be backed off
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Old 04-26-2014, 10:58 AM   #44
Nailhead
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Mine shudders a lot, and makes quite a racket on take-off, but it works well, so I live with the weird noises.

A note on your troubleshooting hints, Oz: somewhere I read ATF is an acceptable substitute for mineral oil in the clutch. I'm using ATF+4 & it's worked just fine, it just adds a little drag to the clutch pull.
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Old 04-26-2014, 11:15 AM   #45
RoundOz
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nailhead View Post
Mine shudders a lot, and makes quite a racket on take-off, but it works well, so I live with the weird noises.

A note on your troubleshooting hints, Oz: somewhere I read ATF is an acceptable substitute for mineral oil in the clutch. I'm using ATF+4 & it's worked just fine, it just adds a little drag to the clutch pull.
Yeah, I guess some clutches just do that but unrelated to the adjustment is my understanding. Mine is pretty quiet.
Good to know about the ATF. Took me a while to find mineral oil....finally found it in the farm store as a digestive aid (read "colon-blow") for cows and horses. As long as this doesn't lead to another oil thread

Btw....I spent a few hours in Denver traffic a week ago....the Rekluse paid for itself there and then! My trip down to check out the KaTuM before I bought it in 2010 led me to about an hour of near gridlock on I-25 on my old 900SS. Tore all the tendons in my left hand and was reduced to mostly clutchless gear changes on the way home.
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