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Old 02-25-2013, 08:06 AM   #151
alpster87
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You are correct in your technique which is the next step in the manuel ,however both should be done as it gives a better look at the strength and or remaining spring tension left in the Rings ...
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Old 02-25-2013, 08:57 AM   #152
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Originally Posted by alpster87 View Post
... Note; Before installing piston rings measure the free end gap of each ring using vernier calipers Therefore putting no blame on anyone in the Forum for his own misfortunes..
free end gap doesn't really tell you anything with regards to installing a new piston/ring set... ring gap in the bore is all that really matters unless you're thinking of re-using old rings and checking for service limits..

dang OP, i just read this thread by recommendation of a buddy. i was a little skeptical during some of your build posts, and then ecstatic for you when you got 'er fired. and now share everyone else's sentiments that you learned a hard lesson. but hell, it wouldn't be fun if it was easy. now you've got a good story to tell in 30yrs when some kid tells you how he's going to build the baddest engine on the block!

good luck on getting her back on the road!
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Old 02-25-2013, 01:58 PM   #153
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I was making the point that the op had read the manuel from cover to cover and that all the information he needed to install his new and super cool parts was there in the text ... yes maybe the manufactures specs may have been slightly different ,but even the factory specs probably would have stopped him from having this problem... I too hpoe to here that he is on the road soon
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Old 02-25-2013, 03:45 PM   #154
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Originally Posted by desmodab View Post

Interesting that not one of these guys happened to mention it or suggest it to to the OP in the first several pages of his posts as he was doing the installation.
Pg. 5, post #65
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Old 02-25-2013, 03:53 PM   #155
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Originally Posted by alpster87 View Post
Sorry to here about OP`S misfortunes as well ,however in his first posting he states how he has read the service manuel from cover to cover ...and in the manuel it says to check ring end gap before installling piston in a step by step instruction for cyl and piston install... Note; Before installing piston rings measure the free end gap of each ring using vernier calipers Therefore putting no blame on anyone in the Forum for his own misfortunes..
Can I get an Amen?

While I do feel for Planemanx,...this is no one else's falt. As many have said, if anything this is a very valuable learning experience for him as well as many others watching this thread. In an attempt to be pragmatic, what it will take to fix this problem, in the grand scheme of things is peanuts. Compare the cost of this fix in relation to the amount of $$$ most of us will and should earn in a lifetime and the percentage is almost insignificant.

The knowledge gained will pay for itself later on, although it's tough to see it that way now for Planemanx, I would assume. Gapping the rings properly is the owner's responsibility. Nobody elses.

I gotta say, IMHO, our society has done a great job of convincing a great majority of us that we are not responsible for our actions, decisions, and futures.
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Old 02-25-2013, 04:27 PM   #156
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Originally Posted by Xcuvator View Post
There should have been a bold notice in the directions.
It's all laid out in the ring fitting instruction sheet that comes in the kit. There's a formula and an example of how to calculate the ring gap based on the bore size and the kind of application where the motor will be used.
It's the engine builders responsibility not only to gap rings but to make sure the proper fit for any critical parts.
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Old 02-25-2013, 04:43 PM   #157
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Originally Posted by Rob.G View Post
Jeff has some great points on the pre-gapped stuff. Hey Jeff... any thoughts on doing up a page on the ProCycle site that has step by step instructions on gapping rings? The ones you have on the fork and shock builds are great.
Yeah, next opportunity I'll do a little pictorial.
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Old 02-25-2013, 04:47 PM   #158
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Originally Posted by Rustycage View Post
This kinda leads into my question, is there a next size overbore piston available? Or does cylinder need to be resleeved, say if it goes out of spec due to wear?
No overbore
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Old 02-25-2013, 07:56 PM   #159
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Alright, I've been quiet lately, lets get this back on track. I understand this is completely my fault, and no others. I should have researched more. This was my first time doing anything of this magnitude. I love working on my motorcycle, and things sometimes go wrong. Shit happens, deal with it, learn from it, and move on.

My cylinder is on its merry way back across the country to procycle, where Jeff graciously offered to hone it and check that it is still in spec. If so, it will come back; if not, I guess I'll be buying another...

My piston is in my garage as a friendly reminder to check over my work all the time.

After work today, i cleaned up my work area. As somebody said in either this thread or the big DR thread, I should organize my area better.



It still looks messy, but all the parts are now laid out, and all the tools away, ready for use next time. I checked my feeler gauge, and I have all the correct sizes for the ring gaping process (Top ring: .020" 2nd ring: .024-.028" Oil ring: .015") I'll try to remember to gap them on the next installation

Out or curiosity I ripped open the oil filter... WARNING: Some of you might cry at what your about to see:







That's a lot of metal. I peeked into the gears through the cylinder hole in the engine, and didn't see any flakes, but I will still flush the engine out anyway. Glad I bought that 10 pack of oil filters from Procycle.


For now, i guess Ill be riding my other horse, a 2009 Piaggio BV-250. Its actually a load of fun (if your a scooter nerd like me). I get more looks on it than the DR:

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planemanx15 screwed with this post 02-27-2013 at 06:42 PM
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Old 02-25-2013, 08:20 PM   #160
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Well I dont want to be the grump in the crowd but with that much crud in the filter i dont believe flushing it out is going to do the job .All that aluminum has gone straight to the lower con rod and the main brg`s it may last for quite some time but my guess is you will have a premature failure of this engine in the future if crank and mains and oil pump are not addressed ,just my opinion. I am sure others will say differently
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Old 02-25-2013, 08:39 PM   #161
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Originally Posted by alpster87 View Post
Well I dont want to be the grump in the crowd but with that much crud in the filter i dont believe flushing it out is going to do the job .All that aluminum has gone straight to the lower con rod and the main brg`s it may last for quite some time but my guess is you will have a premature failure of this engine in the future if crank and mains and oil pump are not addressed ,just my opinion. I am sure others will say differently
Welp, looks like you have some more work to do while waiting for the new parts to arrive. I'd build one of those case-splitting tools like Jeff has and plan to split it. Might as well. It doesn't look all that hard from reading Jeff's thread on DRRiders where he's assembling his 900 stroker motor (if you haven't seen that thread yet, go find it, it's awesome, tons of great photos).

If it's in your budget, you might wanna go ahead and do what I was going to do -- replace all the bearings and the timing chain while it's apart. From the photos in that thread, it looks pretty straightforward, especially if you have a service manual.

At the very least, pull everything out and clean it good like the others suggested.

Rob
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Old 02-25-2013, 08:40 PM   #162
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790 big mess

planemanx15,it looks like more than an engine flush job to me.When you see a filter that looks like that don't ignore the warning signs,it is time to organize a clean work space and get some more tools out and get at 'er!
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Old 02-25-2013, 09:02 PM   #163
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Best to check it now. Better safe than sorry...
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Old 02-25-2013, 10:01 PM   #164
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^^^^^
+1

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Old 02-26-2013, 05:35 AM   #165
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i just read all this at the DR site...

http://drriders.com/topic6662.html

ProCycle, truly.... you 'da man!!! that's some really bad shizzit!... i like my KTM, but now i feel i really shouldn't have read that....

some really excellent work, dooder!... no shortcuts, excellent machine work and attention to detail... god, i wanna ride that thing!...
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