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Old 02-11-2013, 05:08 AM   #316
Sic Semper Tyrannis
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2014 Honda CTX700, CTX700D are probably the world’s dullest motorcycles

http://www.fasterandfaster.net/2013/...ably.html#more

"2014 Honda CTX700, CTX700D are probably the world’s dullest motorcycles"

"For us, however, this bike is entirely devoid of any emotion whatsoever – it’s dull and cold and clinical and frigid. And that it comes from a manufacturer that used to build some of the most exciting, most technologically advanced motorcycles in the world makes it doubly sad."



No more press bikes for you!!!


Unless Honda has some knowledge of an untapped market of economists and
actuaries that LUST for a certain measure of dullness in their (otherwise usually exciting) motorcycles....I'd say these are going to be the turds in the punch bowl and clogging up dealerships for quite some time.


And unlike hondas other misunderstood poor sellers: GB500 Honda hawk etc....won't be collectors items in 20 years.
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Old 02-11-2013, 05:37 AM   #317
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sic Semper Tyrannis View Post
http://www.fasterandfaster.net/2013/...ably.html#more

"2014 Honda CTX700, CTX700D are probably the world’s dullest motorcycles"

"For us, however, this bike is entirely devoid of any emotion whatsoever – it’s dull and cold and clinical and frigid. And that it comes from a manufacturer that used to build some of the most exciting, most technologically advanced motorcycles in the world makes it doubly sad."



No more press bikes for you!!!


Unless Honda has some knowledge of an untapped market of economists and
actuaries that LUST for a certain measure of dullness in their (otherwise usually exciting) motorcycles....I'd say these are going to be the turds in the punch bowl and clogging up dealerships for quite some time.


And unlike hondas other misunderstood poor sellers: GB500 Honda hawk etc....won't be collectors items in 20 years.
It doesn't look like they even tested one. That's some good journalism there. They even suggested Honda release a CBR1000RR with DCT, I'd love to see the bitchfest when that happens.

As for dullness, if that's what you want to call it Honda has been marketing it for years in some of their cars. A lot of people find easy to own and easy to ride appealing.
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Old 02-11-2013, 06:03 AM   #318
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Originally Posted by ph0rk View Post
It doesn't look like they even tested one. That's some good journalism there. They even suggested Honda release a CBR1000RR with DCT, I'd love to see the bitchfest when that happens.

As for dullness, if that's what you want to call it Honda has been marketing it for years in some of their cars. A lot of people find easy to own and easy to ride appealing.
There is no discussion about those new cruiserbikes for me. Maybe targeted to US market, no idea. I will just ignore them.

But as to the DCT feature: great thing to ride. I realize there are many who like to change gears themselves.
But even for enduro competition riders there are many who like the rekluse clutch or whatever. I personally rode the KTM Freeride E without any clutch and gears, always perfect linear power: extreme fun to ride on difficult grounds. Easy. Fast. Perfect flow. Would no longer bother with any standard drivetrain if I had the choice for myself.

And for road usage, it is quite similar with the DCT. It is not a feature for track riding, doing hard maneuvers with slipperclutch and so on, but it is very cool, enjoyable and not at all boring for normal road usage of all kinds.
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Old 02-11-2013, 06:16 AM   #319
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Last night I took an objective look at the big four Japanese manufacturers and Triumphs website. As I said earlier, I have been hard on Honda in recent years, but Honda had the most diverse lineup by far. They have entries into almost every class of bikes and they have the value leaders in almost every class. They don't offer a big ADV bike here in the states, and they don't offer hard core dual sports, but their line up is chock full of bikes and they offer many bikes that others don't. They need bigger tanks and bigger bags on some of their offerings for them to appeal to me, but I applaud Honda for daring to be different and for daring to explore new territory.

The new 500X has my full attention. The CTX seems pretty cool too, but I don't like the foot forward position. If they offered a CTX as it is right now with mid controls, a bit of a larger tank and there were large bags options, I'd likely buy one. A scaled down Goldwing at the CTX price point would be awesome! ABS is being offered on most of the new models. I don't begrudge Honda for building reliable, practical, well priced bikes and for pushing the technological envelope even if what they offer isn't a bike I would ever consider. Choices are good.
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Old 02-11-2013, 06:35 AM   #320
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Originally Posted by MookieBlaylock View Post
that dont mean anyone gonna buy them. Dull and slow doesn't usually move a lot of bikes, especially since the targeted market ,new riders, doesn't even know they exist yet
Dull is subjective and slow is relative. I enjoy the thrill of brisk acceleration, but as I reflect back on my riding and the things that made that riding enjoyable, speed and acceleration were not what did it for me. One of my best rides ever was done on a Burgman 650. In fact it was more fun than any other bike I have ridden through Deal's Gap. I need enough passing power to pick off slow movers on curvy roads, but most of the bikes I've owned had more power than I ever really needed. I'm not a skilled enough rider to tax any suspension I've ridden in the twisties either. The truth is that if you are pushing most bike past their handling limits, you should probably be on a track and not a public road.

Comfort and convenience have defined my trips to a large degree. Speed and handling never have. That's this rider's style at any rate. So the dull and slow bike that people haven't ridden prior to making that pronouncement, may just work for riders like me.
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Old 02-11-2013, 06:57 AM   #321
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Originally Posted by Dranrab Luap View Post
Dull is subjective and slow is relative. I enjoy the thrill of brisk acceleration, but as I reflect back on my riding and the things that made that riding enjoyable, speed and acceleration were not what did it for me. One of my best rides ever was done on a Burgman 650. In fact it was more fun than any other bike I have ridden through Deal's Gap. I need enough passing power to pick off slow movers on curvy roads, but most of the bikes I've owned had more power than I ever really needed. I'm not a skilled enough rider to tax any suspension I've ridden in the twisties either. The truth is that if you are pushing most bike past their handling limits, you should probably be on a track and not a public road.

Comfort and convenience have defined my trips to a large degree. Speed and handling never have. That's this rider's style at any rate. So the dull and slow bike that people haven't ridden prior to making that pronouncement, may just work for riders like me.

Well said.

So some org that calls themself "faster and faster" doesn't like the CTX? I'm shocked!

It really bugs me, all this whining about "dull" and "slow". Gee whiz folks, if it don't blow your skirt up, move on. Do you think that Honda should target every new offering directly to you? I mean, Honda has come out with a lot of new products over the last year or so - but NONE of it is what I would have picked. And they already had the bikes I wanted in Japan and/or Europe. I applaud them just the same. The NC concept is something completely new, and it has gotten rave reviews all over the world. Are you really surprised that Honda would try to build on that? I suspect they have done their homework and they feel the CTX will bring in some new riders. God knows WE could use some fresh blood to help push motorcyclist's rights, make America more aware of two wheelers, use less gas/oil, take up less parking... This is nothing but a good thing.

Rock on, Honda!

Oh, and if you could see fit to ship me a CB1300 Bol D'or I sure would appreciate it. Red and white please, with black wheels and hard bags. And send me one of those robots too. It can mow the yard while I go riding.
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Old 02-11-2013, 06:59 AM   #322
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Originally Posted by Dranrab Luap View Post
Last night I took an objective look at the big four Japanese manufacturers and Triumphs website. As I said earlier, I have been hard on Honda in recent years, but Honda had the most diverse lineup by far. They have entries into almost every class of bikes and they have the value leaders in almost every class. They don't offer a big ADV bike here in the states, and they don't offer hard core dual sports, but their line up is chock full of bikes and they offer many bikes that others don't. They need bigger tanks and bigger bags on some of their offerings for them to appeal to me, but I applaud Honda for daring to be different and for daring to explore new territory.

The new 500X has my full attention. The CTX seems pretty cool too, but I don't like the foot forward position. If they offered a CTX as it is right now with mid controls, a bit of a larger tank and there were large bags options, I'd likely buy one. A scaled down Goldwing at the CTX price point would be awesome! ABS is being offered on most of the new models. I don't begrudge Honda for building reliable, practical, well priced bikes and for pushing the technological envelope even if what they offer isn't a bike I would ever consider. Choices are good.
Ummm...nice try, but well thought out, logical responses have no place in this thread. Please move along.
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Old 02-11-2013, 07:12 AM   #323
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Originally Posted by mrbreeze View Post
. Gee whiz folks, if it don't blow your skirt up, move on
i thought this was a discussion forum where all points of view are welcome
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Old 02-11-2013, 07:17 AM   #324
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I see this thread has been merged. Yay.
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Old 02-11-2013, 07:28 AM   #325
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dranrab Luap View Post
The new 500X has my full attention. The CTX seems pretty cool too, but I don't like the foot forward position. If they offered a CTX as it is right now with mid controls, a bit of a larger tank and there were large bags options, I'd likely buy one. A scaled down Goldwing at the CTX price point would be awesome! ABS is being offered on most of the new models. I don't begrudge Honda for building reliable, practical, well priced bikes and for pushing the technological envelope even if what they offer isn't a bike I would ever consider. Choices are good.
That's where I'm at too. And I haven't been a fan of Honda for the last few years. I instantly disliked the 700X on styling and the filler-cap placement, but it's gone on to be a Top 10 or Top 5 seller in the UK, Germany, and Italy. The USA owners on this site seem to love them. The CTX and - especially - the CB500X, I could live with.

The big thing for me, and a lot of people I know these days, is 'total cost to own'. With gas being so expensive over here, I need to think about how many trips I can afford over a year, and if it comes down to a bike I love that does 40mpg and a bike I can live with that does 70mpg, well that's a lot of extra miles & smiles I can enjoy.

Add low insurance grouping, accessories, and long service intervals, and I can just get on with camping, visiting friends, touring, commuting/lane-splitting, what have you.

Since these bikes are also A2 compliant (the new tiered licencing) I could also pay it off and then hand it to my son when he's 19. My hypothetical Tiger 800 XC and Moto Guzzi Griso will just have to wait a few more years.

If you're a high-end buyer, what BMW or Ducati would refer to as a 'premium customer' these bikes probably aren't for you.
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Old 02-11-2013, 07:28 AM   #326
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i thought this was a discussion forum where all points of view are welcome

It is, but if the bike is of no interest to someone, why hang around here? Lot's of people "don't get it". It may turn out that Honda "doesn't get it". Judging by the hot and cold reactions ( mostly cold), they probably will not do well with this bike - unless they can bring in new riders - and I think that is what they are going for. It's the smart thing to do, but a huge risk, and Honda has the guts to take it. That is why I applaud them, and why everyone else should too. As motorcyclists, we are what? 2% of the population? Granted, 2% of 300+ million is still a lot of people, but some of those never buy a new bike, some rarely do, and what's left over has a lot of choices available to them. So Honda is looking for an untapped market. They are boldly going where no man has gone before - (wait a minute, gotta get my Spock ears on).

Live long and prosper.
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Old 02-11-2013, 07:29 AM   #327
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Originally Posted by Dranrab Luap View Post
The new 500X has my full attention. The CTX seems pretty cool too, but I don't like the foot forward position. If they offered a CTX as it is right now with mid controls, a bit of a larger tank and there were large bags options, I'd likely buy one. A scaled down Goldwing at the CTX price point would be awesome! ABS is being offered on most of the new models. I don't begrudge Honda for building reliable, practical, well priced bikes and for pushing the technological envelope even if what they offer isn't a bike I would ever consider. Choices are good.
You pretty much describe the NC700S as far as footpeg position and bigger tank. Too bad we don't get it.
Although given a lot of comments in this thread it probably wouldn't sell here.

I agree with your comments regarding power and handling also.

A lot of riders don't get the old adage, "Its more fun to ride a slow bike fast than a fast bike slow."
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Old 02-11-2013, 07:41 AM   #328
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Originally Posted by Dranrab Luap View Post
Dull is subjective and slow is relative. I enjoy the thrill of brisk acceleration, but as I reflect back on my riding and the things that made that riding enjoyable, speed and acceleration were not what did it for me. One of my best rides ever was done on a Burgman 650. In fact it was more fun than any other bike I have ridden through Deal's Gap. I need enough passing power to pick off slow movers on curvy roads, but most of the bikes I've owned had more power than I ever really needed. I'm not a skilled enough rider to tax any suspension I've ridden in the twisties either. The truth is that if you are pushing most bike past their handling limits, you should probably be on a track and not a public road.

Comfort and convenience have defined my trips to a large degree. Speed and handling never have. That's this rider's style at any rate. So the dull and slow bike that people haven't ridden prior to making that pronouncement, may just work for riders like me.
Last year scooters outsold dual sports in the US and Harley (almost all of which have feet forward controls) essentially outsold all other manufacturers combined. So there does appear to be actual sales evidence that slow and dull sells pretty well here in the states.

These new bikes may not be my cup of tea, but to dismiss them because they do not meet MY riding style is just silly. Lots of new riders may be looking for something dependable and forgiving, even if some more experienced riders find them a bit dull. Time will tell.
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Old 02-11-2013, 11:29 AM   #329
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I think this bike is a good idea. The reason the fuel tank is conventional is so the seat would be as low as possible, and it is VERY low. Remember that unlike a cruiser, this bike is narrow, so even someone five feet tall would have easy ground reach. However they would not have easy peg reach - I think the pegs are way too far forward. But at least you wouldn't have to use your feet much with the DCT.

It's true that some bikes are relatively boring. The NT700 Deauville, nee Dullville, is the most-cited example. I myself had an FZ-1 and while I had a lot of fun on it, the bike itself was a bit boring.
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Old 02-11-2013, 11:30 AM   #330
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Don't think that was what JerryH was saying he wanted. More about government intrusion and control of industries and the boring products required to be made available to the public for safety's sake and to appease the insurance industry, allowing them to keep more of our money and give it to politicians as kickbacks and contributions. just a thought or two...
Exactly. If you don't like this bike, your likely to be very disappointed at what the future has to offer. Soon all bikes will be like this, only even more boring. When the guvment and the insurance industry get their fangs into something, they don't let go. New cars are proof of that. Driven a Prius lately? And now they have targeted motorcycles. Be glad you've had it good for so long. Cars weren't so lucky. I suggest you get out there and buy the bike you want now, it may not be there much longer.
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