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Old 02-26-2013, 07:29 PM   #16
Adrian V OP
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I think I'm going off Tubliss....

Given the issues that people are reporting with Tubliss and BergDonk's face plant (Jees mate, I'd never even heard of Compartment Syndrome, but is sounds painful ) I think I'm going to take "A" up on his suggestion and try a Michelin mousse on the front and stick with a UHD tube on the back.

I have heard though that mousses can be quite tyre specific, does it matter which front tyre I use apart from the size (M15 - 80/100 + 90/90 and M16 - 90/100?). I have tended to use the HP4 (with a KTM), but I have a DRZ400 now and am likng the Dunlop D907F.

"A", which mousses and tyres do you and Fred use for your desert trips and will you put them in at the start of your trip, or swap them in at the start of the Canning?

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Old 02-26-2013, 07:53 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Adrian V View Post
Given the issues that people are reporting with Tubliss and BergDonk's face plant (Jees mate, I'd never even heard of Compartment Syndrome, b..........

Nasty shit, and could happen to anyone who takes a decent hit:
http://www.google.com.au/#hl=en&suge...w=1456&bih=853

Be aware!
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Old 02-26-2013, 09:39 PM   #18
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Originally Posted by tHEtREV View Post
Just remember the real advantage of Mouses is that they provide the extra grip of low pressure without the risk of pinching of tearing out the valve.

They are not supposed to be a puncture proof tube, the can and do disintegrate, and are no where near as long lasting as a good tube.

If you don't need the grip that bad, then go for a super heavy duty tube with a bit more air in it, that would be the best for reliability.
I would have to disagree, a mousse is supposed to be puncture proof when used for what they are designed for that's the whole point. Obviously, the lower the pressure in a tube the bigger the chance of a pinch flat whereas a mousse is about the equal of 10 -12 psi without the risk of pinch flat.

Sure, they can and do disintegrate if they have not been lubed up properly when installed or regular lubing during their life span or they are used for long and or hot running but they're not designed for that. They are for competition / enduro / single track use where you want lower pressure and are able to hit rocks etc without fear of pinch flats and you don't have to carry tubes and tyre changing tools to save on weight.

I would never run them for general trail riding or adventure riding but in the right circumstances they are the ducks nuts.
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Old 02-26-2013, 10:29 PM   #19
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Originally Posted by kipo View Post
I would have to disagree, a mousse is supposed to be puncture proof when used for what they are designed for that's the whole point. Obviously, the lower the pressure in a tube the bigger the chance of a pinch flat whereas a mousse is about the equal of 10 -12 psi without the risk of pinch flat.

Sure, they can and do disintegrate if they have not been lubed up properly when installed or regular lubing during their life span or they are used for long and or hot running but they're not designed for that. They are for competition / enduro / single track use where you want lower pressure and are able to hit rocks etc without fear of pinch flats and you don't have to carry tubes and tyre changing tools to save on weight.

I would never run them for general trail riding or adventure riding but in the right circumstances they are the ducks nuts.
Agree with what you said.
Btw there are mousse tubes specifically designed for higher speeds & temps. have a look at 4enduro dot com. Murray is a good guy and inmate on dirtbikeworld. Btw no affiliation other than buying from him and being impressed with his service.
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Old 02-26-2013, 10:47 PM   #20
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Geez Bergdonk, that's scary, I will be having a look at my tubliss this weekend to check for any damage. I did a search on the internet to see if yours is a common problem and did not find much on sudden failures
.
Anyway all I have is a positive experience with Tubliss over the last 2 1/2 years and 45000 km of ADV riding on my DRZ carrying fuel loads of up to 55L and 20L water for multi day desert rides with zero problems.


Canning Stock Route 2012 - (Hillbillys pic)

The conditions that I ride in are mainly sandy and the ability to run at low pressures makes all the difference in traction and being able to travel in sand with less physical effort.
Cheer guys, dont worry, I drive all my mates crazy singing the praises of this system, especially if they are complaining about riding in sand.
Ride safe.
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Old 02-27-2013, 12:18 AM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by geoz View Post
Agree with what you said.
Btw there are mousse tubes specifically designed for higher speeds & temps. have a look at 4enduro dot com. Murray is a good guy and inmate on dirtbikeworld. Btw no affiliation other than buying from him and being impressed with his service.
Yeah, I've seen the 4enduro on DBW, I think I'll buy my next set of mousses off him.

The problem I see with the tubeliss system is as mentioned, if it fails out bush you're screwed because you are not carrying spares for flats and if you are you might as well be running tubes.

But on this subject why don't they make spoked rims for more bikes like the Beemer ones or the ones they run on trials bikes? That way you have a tubeless rim without the risk of the tubeliss system failing and just carry a plug kit.
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Old 02-27-2013, 01:15 AM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kipo View Post
Yeah, I've seen the 4enduro on DBW, I think I'll buy my next set of mousses off him.

The problem I see with the tubeliss system is as mentioned, if it fails out bush you're screwed because you are not carrying spares for flats and if you are you might as well be running tubes.

But on this subject why don't they make spoked rims for more bikes like the Beemer ones or the ones they run on trials bikes? That way you have a tubeless rim without the risk of the tubeliss system failing and just carry a plug kit.
Look at the Alpina wheels which are tubeless and yes you can go to 21" and yes they are sealed spoke wheels but they are not cheap. A set of 21/18 around $2000 landed and 19/17 slightly cheaper. And yes they have the tubeless safety rim. The nuetech tubliss seems to be successful in the US and UK and for DS use apart from racing. The moose system seems limited by deterioration due to heat however a liberal use of slime seems to help alleviate this. Seems it also works well with the tubliss system. None of this is from personal experience but comes from using "google" Me, I'll probably try an Alpina 21" tubeless rim on a 990ADV. I can handle a rear blowout but a front wheel blowout would probably see me out at my age.
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Old 02-27-2013, 01:45 AM   #23
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[QUOTE=kipo;20820719]
The problem I see with the tubeliss system is as mentioned, if it fails out bush you're screwed because you are not carrying spares for flats and if you are you might as well be running tubes.

Hi Kipo, I carry spare inner tubes, they do not take up much room but you also could carry normal 18 and 21 inch tubes and if the tubliss failed, take it out , put the tubes in and away you go.
The tubes are going to be carried even if you are running normal tubes for a weekend or multi day ride, each to their own off course, but if you are having trouble riding in the soft stuff, the ability to run low pressures makes a massive difference.
Cheers
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Old 02-27-2013, 02:08 AM   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kipo View Post
I would have to disagree, a mousse is supposed to be puncture proof when used for what they are designed for that's the whole point. Obviously, the lower the pressure in a tube the bigger the chance of a pinch flat whereas a mousse is about the equal of 10 -12 psi without the risk of pinch flat.

Sure, they can and do disintegrate if they have not been lubed up properly when installed or regular lubing during their life span or they are used for long and or hot running but they're not designed for that. They are for competition / enduro / single track use where you want lower pressure and are able to hit rocks etc without fear of pinch flats and you don't have to carry tubes and tyre changing tools to save on weight.

I would never run them for general trail riding or adventure riding but in the right circumstances they are the ducks nuts.
I'm not really sure you are disagreeing with me...
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Old 02-27-2013, 04:14 AM   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Adrian V View Post
Given the issues that people are reporting with Tubliss and BergDonk's face plant (Jees mate, I'd never even heard of Compartment Syndrome, but is sounds painful ) I think I'm going to take "A" up on his suggestion and try a Michelin mousse on the front and stick with a UHD tube on the back.

I have heard though that mousses can be quite tyre specific, does it matter which front tyre I use apart from the size (M15 - 80/100 + 90/90 and M16 - 90/100?). I have tended to use the HP4 (with a KTM), but I have a DRZ400 now and am likng the Dunlop D907F.

"A", which mousses and tyres do you and Fred use for your desert trips and will you put them in at the start of your trip, or swap them in at the start of the Canning?

Fred uses Deserts front and rear. I use 907F front, Desert rear. I'm not sure what Michelin Mousse - will ring Fred and get back to you on that one. We havn't finalised the CSR plans but were thinking of putting them in at the start of the Canning - sort of depends on my son's plan. If he goes on his WR450 then it might go to Wiluna on a trailer and that would make it easy regards the multiple levers you really want and the other stuff required for putting in Mousse.
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Old 02-27-2013, 02:30 PM   #26
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Thanks "A"

I found the rear desert a slippery bugger of a tyre on my KTM, have you ever used the ED78 or the MX71? I like the 907F though . Thanks for finding the info about the mousse, I'll wait to hear from you.

Cheers,

Adrian
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Old 02-27-2013, 09:26 PM   #27
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Check with the wilddogs, they have been running TubeLiss for a while over in S A in desert conditions and the reports I was suggested good results. The resilience to thorns was a plus for them
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Old 03-01-2013, 05:16 AM   #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Adrian V View Post
I found the rear desert a slippery bugger of a tyre on my KTM, have you ever used the ED78 or the MX71? I like the 907F though . Thanks for finding the info about the mousse, I'll wait to hear from you.

Cheers,

Adrian
Just the normal Michelin Bib Mousse - they have a pressure equivalent of 13psi and the company recommends not going over 130kph. Also off road use only and I think ambient temps over 30 C and use past 6 months was a no go also. It's generally the rear tyres that generate the heat though. The use of Mousse might help prevent dents in your front rim on the big hits. You need 6 levers and three arms (or two people) and ideally a changing table or bolt the rim to the ute trayback. So there is a bit involved to get them in unless you get a shop to do the job.
The Michelin product is expensive so Fred uses a cheaper Chinese equivalent for his trail riding now.
Some people like to ride in sand with pressures lower than 13psi though. If you think that could be you, then I wouln't dismiss Tublis. My understanding is that if you do things strictly according to the manufacturers instructions then prblems are rare.
If you want a bit more definitive info I can pm you my brother's phone number Adrian.
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Old 03-02-2013, 01:45 AM   #29
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Bump as this needs more lucid discussion

Bump for the reasons given
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Old 03-02-2013, 08:43 PM   #30
Adrian V OP
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Mmm......

Thanks for th extra info 'A', but I've been giving this a bit more thought and I'm going to give Tubliss a go, for a number of reasons:
It's got to make sand riding easier and my riding involves a fair bit of sand.
Putting mousses in sounds a pain in the proverbial, where as Tubliss looks relatively straight forward.
Bergdonks painful experience not with standing, Dennis and Numbers have obviously used Tubliss a lot, with very good results and for long periods out bush.
The 'improved' beadlockers seem a lot stronger than the earlier version.
If it fails out bush, I can just put a tube in.

Numbers, Dennis is using the ED78 and a Cheng shin C183s (both 6 ply), do you prefer any particular tyres with the Tubliss?

Cheers,

Adrian

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