Final Drive Death

[freeflow]

Originally Posted by DriveShaft

There are 15,000+ advriders, quite a few of whom own GS's. We've managed to produce less than 40 responses. With all the piss and vinegar in some of these members, I half expected a larger turn out.

agreed...I posted on this topic months ago right as I purchased my 04 adv

if we want more feedback, perhaps this should get posted in Jomomma

more piss n vinegar there

[bavarian]

Those pics about the possibiity of a roadside repair of the bearing are just great! Thank you.

R1100 RT - 93.000 kms and no probs
2002 GS - 35.000 kms and no probs

[DriveShaft]

Originally Posted by westnash

Your prices are a little off as is the mileage. I rear bearing causing a breakdown in boo foo egypt and repaired at dealer every 40k is way too much....and this is after following the bmw maint schedule,,,there is nothing maintenance free or even maintenance cheap about anything with a BMW roundel!

My price is off? My Mileage is off? With the lack of mechanical knowledge you've demonstrated on this site, your opinion carries little weight. One look at your thread history, and it's pretty clear that you blame your bike in instances where human error and lack of knowledge have been the primary culprit. And now you troll around looking for every opportunity to express how slighted you feel that the extra $6000 you spent on the blue/white roundel didn't actually buy you an invincible maintenance-free machine (not that you've actually had a final drive problem). Lacking the wherewithall to successfully sue them for such audacity, you instead take solace in the petty jibes you can mete out on the Internet.

As for the price range, just take a look at Dennis Kirk's webpage a little. $200 for a top-of-the-line chain and sprocket set. I know you're pretty frugal, though, so click down to the economy chains with the cheap-ass o-rings that don't last for shit...You have to go for the close-out priced POS's to get down to $37. Most of them are around $60-$90. Right about what I said. A nice D.I.D chain...about $171--even more than the range I mentioned.

As for the mileage, that's obviously going to have a huge variance as to when you'll need to swap out. But after googling around a bit, I'm pretty sure I'm right on target with my estimates...particularly in an adventure-riding crowd. The numbers posted: 10-13kmi...12.5kmi...13kmi...15kmi. The truth is you can eke out more with easy riding and routine maintenance, but trusting a ragged out chain is basically identical to trusting a ragged out driveshaft. Both will eventually get you stuck when you don't want to be.

Which gets me back to the original point...given the choice between a driveshaft that might flake out on me somewhere north of 40kmi versus chains that flake out somewhere north of 12kmi, I'll take the driveshaft.

[drdata]

Driveshaft, good point. My only issue is that the degree of raggegness can easily be seen on a chain. Seems the older (11xx) FD also had some built in inspection/maintenance. The new FDs on the r12 do not have a drain plug, nor do thay have the magnet to collect metal.

These units should not be sealed for life, and there should be a way to inspect (easily) so one can plan. If I missed this for the R12, please advise.

Cheers

PS> I know that the fluid can be swapped, but what about metal bits, and if the dealer finds out I had the unit opened up should the FD later fail, have I voided the "lifetime" warranty?

[westnash]

Before you start calling people names I suggest you get your facts right! You can apologize all you want for the roundel but other people don't. Your lowball cost on the final drive repair when it breaks by the side of the road, is towed to a BMW dealer is so far off the mark so the rest of the blather gets discounted right away.

[DriveShaft]

Originally Posted by westnash

Before you start calling people names I suggest you get your facts right! You can apologize all you want for the roundel but other people don't. Your lowball cost on the final drive repair when it breaks by the side of the road, is towed to a BMW dealer is so far off the mark so the rest of the blather gets discounted right away.

Reread my post, Westnash...what name, exactly, did I call you?

And final drive repair costs have been enumerated by many others on this thread. They're all pretty much in agreement. The cost of towing and such...those items will hit you whether you're packin' a chain or a shaft. Sorry it irks you so much.

[DriveShaft]

Originally Posted by drdata

Driveshaft, good point. My only issue is that the degree of raggegness can easily be seen on a chain. Seems the older (11xx) FD also had some built in inspection/maintenance. The new FDs on the r12 do not have a drain plug, nor do thay have the magnet to collect metal.

These units should not be sealed for life, and there should be a way to inspect (easily) so one can plan. If I missed this for the R12, please advise.

Cheers

PS> I know that the fluid can be swapped, but what about metal bits, and if the dealer finds out I had the unit opened up should the FD later fail, have I voided the "lifetime" warranty?

Yeah, I agree--that's the one thing about exposed chains that gave me some sense of comfort. Seeing tooth wear and marking off chain stretch were definitely useful in planning. It doesn't help so much in indicating when you're going to get a rock in there, jamming up the exposed drive (rare on the street, but more common when you throw in dirt and mud tracks). But it does help for general wear-and-tear.

Those guys really put a stake in the ground with the R12, and it really rubs me wrong, for obvious reasons. I'm not buying the whole "lifetime warranty" either--not with their track record. It's going to take a long burn-in time to make me a believer on that. So, I'll reserve my judgement till...say...2007.

[cxwing]

Originally Posted by DriveShaft

Those guys really put a stake in the ground with the R12, and it really rubs me wrong, for obvious reasons. I'm not buying the whole "lifetime warranty" either--not with their track record. It's going to take a long burn-in time to make me a believer on that. So, I'll reserve my judgement till...say...2007.

Driveshaft, can you elaborate on what's different for the 1200, as opposed to the 1150. I'm at 31Kmiles on a 1.5 year old bike. I'm on my third seal failure and fear the end of the warranty period as I'm a total noob regarding mechanics, but I'm learning (I'm still at level 0, but at least I'm trying
:grinner )

[DriveShaft]

Originally Posted by cxwing

Driveshaft, can you elaborate on what's different for the 1200, as opposed to the 1150. I'm at 31Kmiles on a 1.5 year old bike. I'm on my third seal failure and fear the end of the warranty period as I'm a total noob regarding mechanics, but I'm learning (I'm still at level 0, but at least I'm trying
:grinner )

Pretty much what DrData said is what I know, CXwing. I'm probably not the one to ask, since I'm not planning on owning one till the platform proves itself out, if ever. Definitely others are more knowledgeable than I on the R12GS.

[cxwing]

Thanks. Does anybody know if anything has been changed in the design of the FD that might reduce the failure rate? Things such as less angle changes between the engine and the wheel.

[drdata]

Originally Posted by cxwing

Thanks. Does anybody know if anything has been changed in the design of the FD that might reduce the failure rate? Things such as less angle changes between the engine and the wheel.

Well, it seems they put/left a big hole, obstensibly for cooling, and perhaps this is what extendsmservice life. The drain plug is not a drain, becuase you have to disasemble-hence "sealed for life".

The upside is the same FD is used on the K1200r, which has like 159 HP. Seems if there is a weak link the K-boys will be among the first to know.

FWIW, I have volunteered to maintain a R1200 FD FaQ. The problem is that while I can write/organize, I have no real skilz/knowledge WRT to FDs.

[XPADREX]

Originally Posted by cxwing

Driveshaft, can you elaborate on what's different for the 1200, as opposed to the 1150. I'm at 31Kmiles on a 1.5 year old bike. I'm on my third seal failure and fear the end of the warranty period as I'm a total noob regarding mechanics, but I'm learning (I'm still at level 0, but at least I'm trying
:grinner )

IF I'm assuming correctly, a seal failure is different from a bearing failure- but might somehow be related.

3x in 31k? Ouch!

Did they give any idea as to what was wrong?

There's a part of me that wonders if the seal was replaced, without the underlying cause being treated- but perhaps that's just wishful thinking.

All I gotta say is that after checking the replacement procedure, it seems to me that taking some time every 10 or 15k to check out a final drive is acceptable to me; well, TBH, I would say "it's not the end of the world".

I would prefer such things NOT need be done- but if they are, then so be it.

After all, people in this world deal with desmodromic valve adjustments, chain and sprocket replacement (as has been pointed out), wheel bearing replacement- so I guess this might simply be a cross to bear.

[XPADREX]

I re-read my post, and I want to add:

I hope BMW DOES address this issue- and either isolate the cause, or make sure bearings are inexpensive.

[cxwing]

Originally Posted by XPADREX

3x in 31k? Ouch!

Did they give any idea as to what was wrong?

Every time it was the same story: trip with my wife, so me + passenger + bags and camping equipment, and lots of dirt roads, with more sections at low speed than when I'm alone ( ), and that seems the recipe for the seal failure.
I'll know more on friday...

[bemiiten]

Originally Posted by cxwing

Every time it was the same story: trip with my wife, so me + passenger + bags and camping equipment, and lots of dirt roads, with more sections at low speed than when I'm alone ( ), and that seems the recipe for the seal failure.
I'll know more on friday...

I would push for a new final drive if 3 seals have failed.