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Old 03-24-2013, 07:03 AM   #1
martin.kryjom OP
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XR 600 R XR only race motor oil inssue

HI
Long time, too busy to write all down.
After long 2 months i have put all my honda in on epice again, including motor prepared from XR only.
In the Start up procedure they say that i must check just after start if i have proper preasure of oil by loosing upper banjo bolt comming from the engine to cylinder. If the oil is comming out then all is good.
Well, thats what did not happend, upper banjo bold is dry as new, also i have take off oil filter cover and notice that filter is as new, never get any oil ,
What can be a problem?
There is no leak on the system , and all rubber hoses and joints are brand new.
How to check what is wrong?
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Old 03-24-2013, 07:09 AM   #2
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What is happening is the oil pump is air locked........

What i do is take a blowgun with a rag wrapped arround it and shoot air pressure into the oil resevoir while the bike is running..leave the upper banjo bolt slightly loose so you can see when oil flow starts and when you can stop applying air pressure..

The air pressure will force the oil into the oil pump causing it to prime itself..

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Old 03-24-2013, 07:14 AM   #3
mcma111
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^ as Brian said but you don't need the engine running to prime the oil system. Apply air pressure to the frame reservoir and watch for oil to come out the banjo bolt. Once that is done start the engine and again watch for oil. If it flows sinch the bolt and clean up the mess. For this reason I use the bottom banjo bolt because if you have it at the bottom you'll surely get it at the top.
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Old 03-24-2013, 07:15 AM   #4
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Like minds think alike. Three replys all the same in eleven minutes.
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BMW's
58 R26
79 R100s
91 R100gs

87 Harley FXRS-SP ~ 06 KTM 625 SMC ~ 72 Honda CB750/915cc ~ 92 XR600/654cc ~ 95 XR650l/675cc ~ 03 CRF450r ~ 05 CRF450x ~ 02 XR650l/675cc ~ 86 YZ490 ~ 93 YZ80 ~ 93 XR650l Project
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Old 03-24-2013, 08:56 AM   #5
martin.kryjom OP
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THANKS! U are the best Honda manual on the world.
May be is a stupid question but how to gain enough pressure on the such a big hole on the frame, do u use some trick?
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Old 03-24-2013, 09:43 AM   #6
martin.kryjom OP
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HI
I did it without engine running. I took old oil frame cap, drill the hole, put the air gun on it.
What has happend,
Banjo bold is loose, but oil is not coming , but i have oil coming out from the cap ( what i did)
Looks like there is some big pressure inside that it does not allow me to put any air inside.
Or may be i should do it when kicking or on running engine?
XR only use 628 HRC big bore with compression 11:1 ( just for info to judge whole situation)
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Old 03-24-2013, 09:51 AM   #7
mcma111
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Time to drain the oil in the frame and at the bottom of the front down tube is a filter screen. Use a 17mm deep socket to remove it after you pull the short hose that goes to the engine. Is the filter blocked? Pour some oil in the frame and make sure it comes out the bottom of the frame. Next is pull the hose to the engine and see if it's blocked. You mat have to pull the clutch cover and inspect the oil pump for foreign material blocking it.

I'll be waiting...
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BMW's
58 R26
79 R100s
91 R100gs

87 Harley FXRS-SP ~ 06 KTM 625 SMC ~ 72 Honda CB750/915cc ~ 92 XR600/654cc ~ 95 XR650l/675cc ~ 03 CRF450r ~ 05 CRF450x ~ 02 XR650l/675cc ~ 86 YZ490 ~ 93 YZ80 ~ 93 XR650l Project
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Old 03-24-2013, 11:01 AM   #8
martin.kryjom OP
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HI
Ok, I will follow U instructions.
The all parts are new, 99% including this bolt on the frame, but no other choice, i will check all now and will come back shortly.
Thanks for U support!
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Old 03-24-2013, 12:17 PM   #9
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HI
Ok, i did as follow

1 drain oil from the fraim
2 put air gun, there is a flow between "small" drain hole in the frame , so no problem here.
3) I have put small bolt back, add a lit bit of oil, put the air gun again, there is small air coming out from the lower banjo bolt ( loose already)
4) i have disconnect from the bottom of the frame short hose, oil has come down , so there is no inssue with the net filter in the bolt aslo, there is a flow.
4) I have put air gun to the short hose, no air on the lower bajo bolt ( is loose)

It may be that is too much air comming out on that test as there is no way to make it without air leak. So , im gonna now put an oil to the botle and squize , then check if i have oil on the lower banjo nolt. But if not what does it means?

WHat elese i can do?
Is so flustraiting:( i have spent 2 years on that bike, i ordered engine from XR only as in Europe there is no such a good honda race specialist as in US, i bought every single bolt for that bike, new suspension from ohlins , so many things and in the end i have to disassembly all engine parts again:(
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Old 03-24-2013, 01:13 PM   #10
martin.kryjom OP
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Ok, so I have used big 100 ml siringe , put intoo small hose, and fill with oil.
I heard that oil is coming so the engine. Now filter is no more dry, is full of oil.

Strange thing i have notice that after i put som edose of oil , it starts commbing back from the frame . WHat i think is optimistic, but the question is how it possible that oil is going all around ( from the short hose , by th eengin e, back to the frame, and coming out on the lower oil bolt ) BUT Banjo bolts are still DRY!:(((
What is going wrong?
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Old 03-24-2013, 01:23 PM   #11
mcma111
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The oil pump delivers oil to the crank and top end via different circuits and also from the engine case (sump) back to the frame. So even if the oil is going to the pump and back to the frame it's still not going to the top end (the banjo bolts)

So now if you have primed the oil pump go back and with air pressurize the frame and see if you can push oil out of the banjo bolts.
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Steve in SF

BMW's
58 R26
79 R100s
91 R100gs

87 Harley FXRS-SP ~ 06 KTM 625 SMC ~ 72 Honda CB750/915cc ~ 92 XR600/654cc ~ 95 XR650l/675cc ~ 03 CRF450r ~ 05 CRF450x ~ 02 XR650l/675cc ~ 86 YZ490 ~ 93 YZ80 ~ 93 XR650l Project
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Old 03-24-2013, 03:19 PM   #12
martin.kryjom OP
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IS THERE:) finaly , after air gun i have oil in the lower banjo bolt:)
I will try to start engine now and we will see.
THANK U
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Old 03-24-2013, 03:27 PM   #13
Ghost_Mutant
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Just make sure you didn't accidently twist the oil supply line from the bottom of the frame tank to the engine case when reattaching.

This easy to make blunder can cause oil starvation to your newly rebuilt engine
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Old 03-24-2013, 04:54 PM   #14
martin.kryjom OP
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IT WORKS!
all done! Thank U all for U help
I will post some pictures in a day or two as i almost finished whole project
Bets regards
MARTIN
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Old 03-25-2013, 07:06 PM   #15
techforlife
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OK......where are our pictures







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