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Old 03-28-2013, 08:50 AM   #61
Cerberus83
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To OP -- sound like you made up your mind - good for you!

Oh, and OP, "These "frequent updates" that keep being mentioned are comprised mostly of things to fix problems and catching up with other companies!?" No, it means that they value their customers and listen to their suggestions (like making volume louder, for example). As for the comment regarding "fixing problems" - do you think Scala is not prone to them? Why aren't you getting Q2 or G4 instead of G9? Oh wait, it's because all the issues that were identified in older models were "fixed" and repackaged as a new G9 headset.


To future buyers, I would still recommend going with SENA. If you want to spend the time playing with the BT while riding (like changing FM stations every few miles), then go with "other" brands. If you want to set it and forget it and enjoy [loud] music for +10hrs on a single charge, then get SENA.
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Old 03-31-2013, 05:08 AM   #62
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Can either system provide music from the same source to both rider and passenger while acting as intercom? Simple wired solutions have done this since the Walk-Man days, but I can't find a wireless unit that specifically says it can do this.

It seems like no manufacturer does the things I want but each one has their own complicated, expensive, proprietary take on wireless comms. It could be that the Bluetooth protocol is the limiting factor here, but when you look at what current smartphones are capable of, all purpose built motorcycle communicators seem like VHS tech in a Blu-ray world. (I'll ignore the irony of the fact that Blu-ray itself is about to go the way of VHS)

A smartphone could connect to the bass-thumping, crystal clear headset of your choice through minijack, USB or Bluetooth, while intercoming AND sharing music/GPS/phone audio with another smartphone over WiFi, if Bluetooth is incapable of all that mixing. And these $3-4-500 single use lumps can only do one thing at a time? Ho hum.
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Old 03-31-2013, 06:25 AM   #63
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Can't speak for Scala, but I don't think you can with SENA. With SMH10, you can talk to your pillion or another rider while listening to music/directions through GPS, but the other person would not hear the music/directions. I actually like that b/c then you can give out directions as you see fit and the audio would not be distracting to the other person.

If you really want to stream audio (music/directions) to multiple riders that you need to get SM10 [LINK].
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Old 03-31-2013, 08:40 AM   #64
Ola M
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cerberus83 View Post

If you really want to stream audio (music/directions) to multiple riders that you need to get SM10 [LINK].
That's what I meant. Another box, more money, more wires, to replicate functionality which a $20 box from China can do with two wires? To pillion at least, which is what I want. I'll go with alternative B, not buy any of those products at all.

On another forum someone said the Scala Rider could do this, but the Vox was very sensitive -as has been hinted here as well. Considering the price, it's very tempting to roll my own.

edit: looks like you can't: http://cardoscalariderg9.com/wp/pair...ala-g9-review/

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Old 03-31-2013, 12:45 PM   #65
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ola M View Post
That's what I meant. Another box, more money, more wires, to replicate functionality which a $20 box from China can do with two wires? To pillion at least, which is what I want. I'll go with alternative B, not buy any of those products at all.

On another forum someone said the Scala Rider could do this, but the Vox was very sensitive -as has been hinted here as well. Considering the price, it's very tempting to roll my own.

edit: looks like you can't: http://cardoscalariderg9.com/wp/pair...ala-g9-review/
Its a limitation of BT. Its actually not even a limitation of the headset systems, but rather that most BT music devices out there including smart phones don't support two simultaneous A2DP connections for music. So even if you have 2 SMH10's or 2 Scala G9's and both have their own A2DP connection for music, there aren't many music devices including smart phones that would have two individual A2DP connections available for music where both headsets can connect to it at the same time.

In the case of the SM10, that is exactly what Sena did. They provided a device that you plug in any music source of your choice and that device actually has 2 independent A2DP profiles available so that both the rider and pillion headsets an connect to that device at the same time. I'm actually not aware of any other device that doe that, although there may be some?

Connecting via wires and sharing between a music source with 2 headsets is infinitely easier just because its hard wired. There isn't much of a limitation there with wires.
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Old 04-01-2013, 05:58 AM   #66
Ola M
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Thanks. I'm sure there are ways to work with the BT protocol to get around such limitations but that it isn't worth the cost by the company. I'll give the BT units a miss and go with wires or DIY.

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Old 04-01-2013, 07:30 AM   #67
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ola M View Post
Thanks. I'm sure there are ways to work with the BT protocol to get around such limitations but that it isn't worth the cost by the company. I'll give the BT units a miss and go with wires or DIY.
Autocom......
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Old 04-01-2013, 08:07 AM   #68
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Revzilla's 2013 BT Buying Guide

Video link
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Old 04-02-2013, 04:09 PM   #69
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I want to thank all you guys for posting some great information about these 2 devices. However, my priorities are a little different than most.

I'm looking at these communication systems for mainly bike-to-bike use. I'm part of a motorcycle club that is sanctioned by my university and every saturday and sunday we do group rides. Not only this, but we usually have 8, 10, 12 and upwards of 15 guys ride every time. Because of this, we are looking at communication systems.

We want something with a good range. Our ideal setup would be having the leader, the guy in the back and then 2 guys in the middle on the same chat. Obviously, at times where we are going a lot faster than the PSL, there will be distance between us. So our #1 priority is range and if disconnected, we want something that will reconnect us instantly (seems like SENA wins the connectivity, but Scala wins the range?).

Secondly, most of us ride listening to music (usually streamed from a phone). Do both of these systems allow for listening to music and then being able to talk over the music?

Thanks guys, look forward to your thoughts!
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Old 04-02-2013, 04:19 PM   #70
El Gato
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Originally Posted by workinboy View Post
Do both of these systems allow for listening to music and then being able to talk over the music?
I'll answer this for the Sena. No, you can't talk "over" the music. Comms interrupt the music. When you're done talking and the comms session is ended the music begins again. I really wish that the Sena could stream multiple audio signals simultaneously. I used to have my Sena linked to my iPhone (for music and calls), GPS (for turn-by-turn guidance) and to my buddy for comms. However, it seemed that every time we approached a turn or key navigation point and one of us was about to say something important the GPS would cut in with instructions. It got so annoying that I finally unpaired the GPS and I just get guidance from it by looking at it, which seems to work just fine and we don't have our conversation interrupted.
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Old 04-02-2013, 04:22 PM   #71
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Originally Posted by El Gato View Post
I'll answer this for the Sena. No, you can't talk "over" the music. Comms interrupt the music. When you're done talking and the comms session is ended the music begins again. I really wish that the Sena could stream multiple audio signals simultaneously. I used to have my Sena linked to my iPhone (for music and calls), GPS (for turn-by-turn guidance) and to my buddy for comms. However, it seemed that every time we approached a turn or key navigation point and one of us was about to say something important the GPS would cut in with instructions. It got so annoying that I finally unpaired the GPS and I just get guidance from it by looking at it, which seems to work just fine and we don't have our conversation interrupted.
Sorry, yeah - that's what I pictured. I didn't mean literally talking over the music, haha. Thanks!
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Old 04-02-2013, 05:18 PM   #72
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Just ordered a dual pack of smh10's today. Hope they're as good as I've read... :)
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Old 04-02-2013, 07:43 PM   #73
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Quote:
Originally Posted by workinboy View Post
I want to thank all you guys for posting some great information about these 2 devices. However, my priorities are a little different than most.

I'm looking at these communication systems for mainly bike-to-bike use. I'm part of a motorcycle club that is sanctioned by my university and every saturday and sunday we do group rides. Not only this, but we usually have 8, 10, 12 and upwards of 15 guys ride every time. Because of this, we are looking at communication systems.

We want something with a good range. Our ideal setup would be having the leader, the guy in the back and then 2 guys in the middle on the same chat. Obviously, at times where we are going a lot faster than the PSL, there will be distance between us. So our #1 priority is range and if disconnected, we want something that will reconnect us instantly (seems like SENA wins the connectivity, but Scala wins the range?).

Secondly, most of us ride listening to music (usually streamed from a phone). Do both of these systems allow for listening to music and then being able to talk over the music?

Thanks guys, look forward to your thoughts!
Autocom. You'll have one wire from the "brain box" to the helmet. It's a bit of a pain to get wired into the bike (sometimes), but once set up it works flawlessly. It's also the most expensive option.
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Old 04-02-2013, 08:18 PM   #74
BlueLghtning
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Quote:
Originally Posted by workinboy View Post
I want to thank all you guys for posting some great information about these 2 devices. However, my priorities are a little different than most.

I'm looking at these communication systems for mainly bike-to-bike use. I'm part of a motorcycle club that is sanctioned by my university and every saturday and sunday we do group rides. Not only this, but we usually have 8, 10, 12 and upwards of 15 guys ride every time. Because of this, we are looking at communication systems.

We want something with a good range. Our ideal setup would be having the leader, the guy in the back and then 2 guys in the middle on the same chat. Obviously, at times where we are going a lot faster than the PSL, there will be distance between us. So our #1 priority is range and if disconnected, we want something that will reconnect us instantly (seems like SENA wins the connectivity, but Scala wins the range?).

Secondly, most of us ride listening to music (usually streamed from a phone). Do both of these systems allow for listening to music and then being able to talk over the music?

Thanks guys, look forward to your thoughts!
Is it usually the same guys that ride every time or does it change out? When you start getting upwards of 10-15 bikes, that stretches things out a lot and its going to be hard for either system (including the Scala) to cover that range without one of the bikes in the middle being a bridge between the leader and the sweeper.

At first glance, an FRS/GMRS system would almost work the best just because you are dealing with such a large pool of riders, but you mentioned only having the leader, maybe 2 in the middle and the sweeper on the same chat, so that makes things a bit easier.

As was mentioned earlier, the Scala has the edge on being able to remember 8 riders and name them, but if that list is constantly changing each week, I don't know how difficult it would be to maintain or switch on the fly.

However from my own experience and reading reviews, it seems getting a 3+ way conversation going on the Scala's tends to be frustrating and the units don't always seem to be willing to "re-sync" when you go out of range frequently.

The Sena's as I mentioned, do a much better job of re-establishing that link when you come back into range and setting up the pairing before hand for that days ride really is very simple once you learn it. They also do a much better job of allowing a 3 or 4 way conversation. By making the guys in the middle the bridge and maybe spacing them out a bit too, I think you could easily cover the distance of 10-15 bikes with 4 riders overall being involved in the chat.

As mentioned for your music, both of the systems allow music, but any time you are in an intercom chat, the music is stopped and then will restart once the intercom conversation ends.

Either setup would actually support 4 riders all being paired together. The Sena SMH10's remember up to 3 other riders per headset and in their documentation up to 4 riders in conference, but that can be extended if you pair right. The Scala G9 remembers 8 people per headset and also allows 4 simultaneous in a conference. If you connected in the order that you are riding 1->2->3->4 then your range is greatly extended, and the two middle riders act as a "bridge" connection that allows the lead and sweep riders to be further apart then the "claimed" range. Your range effectively doubles each time you add in a bridge person between 2 connected headsets. In fact, it is possible on the Sena's for sure as people have verified it to extend that daisy chain out past 4 riders and actually have more riders connected and in conversation than just 4. If you pair and connect like this - 1->2->3->4->5->6, you can continually daisy chain out the connections. It becomes more of a technological challenge as you do, but it can be done. If one person in the middle drops though, everyone behind that rider is disconnected from the main group too. Getting more than 4 people to start an intercom int he correct order would be where either setup with more than 4 people could get frustrating, but if you leave everyone manually connected and they stay in line, you could keep everyone talking to each other at once.
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Old 04-02-2013, 10:11 PM   #75
burmbuster
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Originally Posted by MelissaToBeMe View Post

I'm starting to feel like a BlueRay salesperson talking to a group of proud VCR owners.

"Well, my VCR plays movies just fine, why would I use all that other stuff??"

"Ummm.....I'm sure it does. You're right sir; they do both play a movie."


Honest question, does the Sena offer anything even close to that? Like a visual representation of your unit? Or is it all through the "dial menu"? I know they both have menus for on the fly changes......but the ability to type in the FM stations I want (I think the Sena's just got FM....way to go!) , SEE who I'm paired with (all 8 of them), pair with people over the internet for a ride coming up on Sunday, upgraded my software, sync my changes, etc.; it makes that SMH10 look like something from a museum!

scala rider needs to add an earbud option baaaaaaaaad, because that seems to be one of the big key difference that's hard for anyone to see past.
Wow. What I see here are a large group of people giving great advise on systems that they actually own, namely Sena users, and an OP that's just enamered by a Scala Internet review somewhere. Color me surprised.
Be sure to let us know how the 4th generation of the piece of kit works for ya. Hope you don't have to push any buttons while riding.
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