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Old 03-28-2013, 07:13 AM   #16
Snarky
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I don't actually mind the oil threads. For the wetheads it'll be the same, but with one slight alteration.

1. Take the chart in your bikes manual. Make a list of the oils that are compatible. Generally it's large range of weights, and an certification that generally specifies an oil made in the last 20 years.

2. Go to the store, pick an oil that speaks to you. Marketing plays a big role in the oils people pick. All of those test results? Also marketing. Pick the one you like. I usually go for the one with the most bullshit on the bottle.

3. Cross reference the oil that you like with the oil list just to make sure it fits. Buy a gallon of it and enjoy.

I would say that if you have the new R1200 LC with the wet clutch, you might want to buy an oil that is compatible with a wet clutch, though not all people do that, and it generally works out fine. If you have the old R1200, it doesn't really matter, but you might want those extra friction modifiers they put in there for cars, because why the hell not?
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Old 03-28-2013, 10:42 AM   #17
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OK, I'll ask a question that's been bothering me for a while. The oils with the low number after the "W" are recommended for cooler ambient temperatures. Why do the ambient temperatures matter if the working temperature inside the engine is much higher?
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Old 03-28-2013, 10:50 AM   #18
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Originally Posted by DGraham View Post
Seems to me that even BMW is saying it really doesn't matter. Case closed.

I'd want to see the wethead manual in German to make sure it wasn't a translation error.




(this one should add about 30 posts to the thread)
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Old 03-28-2013, 10:56 AM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by genka View Post
OK, I'll ask a question that's been bothering me for a while. The oils with the low number after the "W" are recommended for cooler ambient temperatures. Why do the ambient temperatures matter if the working temperature inside the engine is much higher?
Because the working engine temperature depends on the ambient temperature.
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Old 03-28-2013, 11:30 AM   #20
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On the liquid cooled engines the temperature is fairly stable.
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Old 03-28-2013, 12:07 PM   #21
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I have survived oil threads in a multitude of forums and found no universal answer in any of them. There are some facts to consider: #1 most bikes are crashed or sold before oil plays ANY factor in your oil selection. #2 there is NOT any scientific evidence on actual wear or engine destruction published where us mere mortals can make an educated decision as to one oil being better than another. Now for a question, do you know for a fact that a particular oil (at least close to manufacturer's spec) was the absolute cause of an engine failure? Let me make that CHRYSTAL clear. Use of non-synthetic 10W40 Bluto Oil rated at SA caused a main bearing to fail due to lack of lubrication and generation of heat. This does not mean the moron didn't change oil for 250,000 miles or even checked his sight glass.

The only meaningful thing I see is that when you buy your tea kettle you should consider the fact that the transmission is going to cause more molecular shearing and the wet clutch could slip or put junk in the oil.
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Old 03-28-2013, 09:58 PM   #22
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How about someone puts together a chart that shows:

  • What year bike you have
  • How many miles are on it
  • What oil you use
  • How many miles you have been using said oil
  • Mileage between oil changes
  • What filter you use
  • How many miles you have been using said filter
  • Any notes

This would be similar to Jim's oil filter compatibility chart or the 100 threads post. It would be updated regularly to show new data. That way someone could quickly see what oils are being used and how long they have been used. Any of you web programmers have a way to put that together? I'll buy you a case of beer.
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Old 03-28-2013, 10:36 PM   #23
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Originally Posted by configurationspace View Post
Fresh oil tends to work better than broken, used or contaminated oil. But even some used oil can be okay. This is what my research is telling me.
A friend also discovered through exhaustive experimentation that a quart of oil in the engine was better than a quart of oil in the tank bag.
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Old 03-28-2013, 10:41 PM   #24
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Originally Posted by tagesk View Post
I'll write 5w-40 API SL in the FAQ for now.
Not to be nit picky or anything, but you probably want to add the "JASO MA2" part, also. JASO MB and bikes with a wet clutch really don't go together.
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Old 03-29-2013, 02:25 AM   #25
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Originally Posted by genka View Post
OK, I'll ask a question that's been bothering me for a while. The oils with the low number after the "W" are recommended for cooler ambient temperatures. Why do the ambient temperatures matter if the working temperature inside the engine is much higher?
At start-up you are not at working temp. My understanding is that the majority of engine wear occurs at start-up and during warm-up for the average Joe. So it is important to pump oil from the sump to the upper reaches of the engine ASAP. Thin oil moves thru the engine faster.

So when there is snow on the ground, would you rather be pumping STP viscosity oil or thin oil to lube your cam?

Here's a link to explain it all..

http://www.kewengineering.co.uk/Auto..._explained.htm
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Old 03-29-2013, 07:06 AM   #26
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Originally Posted by TuefelHunden View Post
I have survived oil threads in a multitude of forums and found no universal answer in any of them. There are some facts to consider: #1 most bikes are crashed or sold before oil plays ANY factor in your oil selection. #2 there is NOT any scientific evidence on actual wear or engine destruction published where us mere mortals can make an educated decision as to one oil being better than another. Now for a question, do you know for a fact that a particular oil (at least close to manufacturer's spec) was the absolute cause of an engine failure? Let me make that CHRYSTAL clear. Use of non-synthetic 10W40 Bluto Oil rated at SA caused a main bearing to fail due to lack of lubrication and generation of heat. This does not mean the moron didn't change oil for 250,000 miles or even checked his sight glass.

The only meaningful thing I see is that when you buy your tea kettle you should consider the fact that the transmission is going to cause more molecular shearing and the wet clutch could slip or put junk in the oil.
There's some good advice here.

You'd be hard-pressed to go on any car, truck, or motorcycle forum and find a single case of oil-related engine failure. It just doesn't happen any more. There's a small minority that keeps and uses their vehicle past 100,000 miles. There's a small minority of that small minority that does it with a motorcycle.

I've done exhaustive used oil analysis, and I've come to the conclusion that as long as you change your oil regularly and keep the level correct, you're never going to have an oil-related issue.
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Old 03-29-2013, 07:43 AM   #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by billdonna View Post
At start-up you are not at working temp. My understanding is that the majority of engine wear occurs at start-up and during warm-up for the average Joe. So it is important to pump oil from the sump to the upper reaches of the engine ASAP. Thin oil moves thru the engine faster.

So when there is snow on the ground, would you rather be pumping STP viscosity oil or thin oil to lube your cam?

Here's a link to explain it all..

http://www.kewengineering.co.uk/Auto..._explained.htm
Oil performance at low temperatures is determined by the number before W and the linked article mostly deals with it.
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Old 03-29-2013, 07:51 AM   #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by marchyman View Post
Not to be nit picky or anything, but you probably want to add the "JASO MA2" part, also. JASO MB and bikes with a wet clutch really don't go together.
This is about providing correct and unbiased information in the GSpot FAQ; your suggestion is a good one.
Considered it taken into account!

Thank you!

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Old 03-29-2013, 08:05 AM   #29
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Originally Posted by def View Post
If I had one of those wetheads, I would use 5-40 HDEO...cheap and available and used in diesel engines 'round the world. As for brands, Shell Rotella, Mobil Delvac or Chevron DELO here in the colonies.
+1, run the break in oil in it for 600 miles or whatever they recommend, let the dealer do the first oil change with their suggested/recommended brand, then at 6000 mi or next recommended service, Rotella T 15/40.

If it is cold let it idle for a minute to get the golden juices flowing and then
the wheels off it and at the end of the day with a on your face.
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Old 03-29-2013, 10:05 AM   #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by marchyman View Post
Not to be nit picky or anything, but you probably want to add the "JASO MA2" part, also. JASO MB and bikes with a wet clutch really don't go together.
That is correct but there are plenty of oils that are not JASO rated at all that are excellent for motorcycles. Oil manufacturers have to pay for that API rating AND for JASO. If you get a quart/liter of oil and it does not have the ILSAK starburst, "Energy Conserving" in the API bulls eye, and DOES NOT HAVE the JASO rating, it still is most likely good enough for government work. It is definitely OK in an air cooled GS. To beat a dead horse to death , if it makes you feel good to spend $10 a qt for mc only oil that says JASO MA2 on it, go for it.
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