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Old 05-22-2013, 10:44 PM   #616
PonyExpres
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Wicked Harleys got the nuts, Yamahas got the BOLTS...

I recently went on a ride with 7 guys from my neighborhood who ride Harleys. They asked me to ride at the back of the line since I was riding my Yamaha.

I said no problem, I'll just pick up the parts that fall off of your bikesas we go along.

When we got to the pub one of the guys said oh shit, what happened to my side cover. I said don't worry, I opened my saddle bag and handed it to him.
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Old 05-23-2013, 04:57 AM   #617
blk-betty
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Originally Posted by HondaFanatic View Post
Man, I envy you H-D guys. Riding Honda's all these years, there's always aftermarket support for looks/comfort/convenience items, but rarely anything (other than exhaust, air cleaners, tunes, etc) "off the rack" for performance. Mainly because the models/engines don't stay around as long.

No doubt lost of options. HD use to publish the Screamin Eagle line within their annual 850 page Parts and Accessories Catalog but most of the SE stuff is suppose to "for race use use only" which is really a joke as very few "race" HDs aside from drag racing and flat track if those guys are serious they will do bettewr with non-SE bolt on parts.

Anyway the SE catalog is now available online in pdf format because the modifications don't typically meet EPA emissions standards so they are now not as openly marketed.

Take a look at the SE catalog here... http://www.harley-davidson.com/en_US..._SE13_Full.pdf

and realize this is just the tip of the iceberg as the aftermarket companies and indepenent speed shops dominate sales and performace work.
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Old 05-23-2013, 05:02 AM   #618
Ritalin Boy
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Originally Posted by FlySniper View Post
I got a chance to see the Bolt in person today and I really don't think HD has anything to worry about. Side by side, the Sporty seems to be the better made, more finished bike. I care nothing about either one really and wouldn't buy either new. But if I were in the market for that type of bike, HD would get my money. Add in the weight of aftermarket... eh, there's no way I'd buy the Yamaha as there would simply be no compelling reason to do so.
FWIW, there is an 883 on the Bolt trucks. Apparently Yamaha has no problem with people doing side by side comparisons. Let me know when HD puts a Bolt on display.

After watching the reactions of people who ride both back to back I'd say the HD has plenty to worry about. Between Victory and Yamaha there are some wonderful alternatives to riding your grandfather's bike.
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Old 05-23-2013, 05:40 AM   #619
kraven
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Originally Posted by blk-betty View Post
I admit I don't know much about Yamaha OEM or aftermarket performance parts. Are there performace exhausts, air filters, EFI maps currently available for the Bolt? Kraven has mentioned one could have custom pistons made and custom cams ground. I can only imagine the cost for machining low volume custom parts would be very expensive relative to off the shelf performance parts that are readily available for HDs.

$3000? You can convert an 883 to 1200/1250 for under $1000 with kits from HD or aftermarket oufits like Hammer Performance if one is interested in performance http://hammerperf.com/xlbigborekits.shtml
Custom pistons are about $159 apiece + shipping.
Boring and recoating is about $350 for the pair.
So that's about $850 by the time you put new gaskets on it and get it back together.

2.5mm overbore will get you to 998cc.

After that, custom cams can be ground for about $400. Bolt comes with roller rockers, so no need to upgrade there. And they're good enough for the same company that puts the R1 on the street. So, they're better than most of the low rent junk you can buy through a catalog.

You have a little bit more difficulty, but you just have to get your head into it and do the math. But you also don't show up to a ride with the same kits everyone else has and the same hp/tq figures. And it all looks like a middle of the road 950 until you whack the throttle.

It's all mouth and swagger til some pirate cries because he lost his lunch money to a hipster like me.
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Old 05-23-2013, 05:47 AM   #620
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Let's also not forget that the Bolt has a stressed member engine. So, we might just see some of the other Yamaha/Star mills get bolted into a Bolt frame. No replacement for displacement.
Metric bike engines are only about a grand, on average, for a crashed bike takeout mill.
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Old 05-23-2013, 06:01 AM   #621
Ginger Beard
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Originally Posted by HondaFanatic View Post
I rarely "imply" anything even to someone as childish as yourself. I'm known as a much more "direct and to the point" kind of man. But since I'm on a privately owned forum, and can be made to leave at anytime, i try and keep my responses civil. Even though at times it's tough when complete strangers go out of their way to push buttons.

But what I will do is this...you have an open invitation to enjoy some "face to face" southern hospitality from a fellow biker in Georgia anytime you'd like. We're in neighboring states, and now that the weathers nice, you might actually enjoy making the trip. I know I would, "friend".

Here's the deal; I simply do not understand the mentality of bagging on ANY brand or model in order to make another brand or model appear better. Using a magazine article to try and make your opinion appear to be factual just makes the effort all the more ridiculous. That also goes for the HD crowd that refers to Jap cruisers as clones.


I am also quite direct and do my best to sensor myself on this forum out of respect for what it means to it's members and the riding community in general. I'm not going to get into some "I'm tougher than you and will kick your ass!!" keyboard commando back and forth with you. If you feel the need to act in a violent or hostile manner over some internet post telling you to stuff something in your pie hole well then, that says more about you than it does me. If you think that I was singling you out in order to push your buttons then I offer you an apology as that was not my intent.


And to keep this on topic...



I have a buddy looking at a new HD Iron. I told him to check out the Bolt before he buys the HD. If the reviews are even close to accurate ,my circle of riding friends may include a Bolt very soon....




.
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Ginger Beard screwed with this post 05-23-2013 at 06:14 AM
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Old 05-23-2013, 06:04 AM   #622
skysailor
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Originally Posted by kraven View Post
Custom pistons are about $159 apiece + shipping.
Boring and recoating is about $350 for the pair.
So that's about $850 by the time you put new gaskets on it and get it back together.

2.5mm overbore will get you to 998cc.

After that, custom cams can be ground for about $400. Bolt comes with roller rockers, so no need to upgrade there. And they're good enough for the same company that puts the R1 on the street. So, they're better than most of the low rent junk you can buy through a catalog.

You have a little bit more difficulty, but you just have to get your head into it and do the math. But you also don't show up to a ride with the same kits everyone else has and the same hp/tq figures. And it all looks like a middle of the road 950 until you whack the throttle.

It's all mouth and swagger til some pirate cries because he lost his lunch money to a hipster like me.
Sounds like the theme from the Six Million Dollar Man. The bike is inadequate. But we can rebuild it. We have the technology. We can make it stronger. We can make it faster. But, it will always be UGLY!
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Old 05-23-2013, 06:10 AM   #623
Ginger Beard
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Originally Posted by kraven View Post

It's all mouth and swagger til some pirate cries because he lost his lunch money to a hipster like me.
You ought to have seen the reaction I got from a a guy with a 110ci bagger when I drag raced him on my Sporty after he called my bike a girls bike. Probably would be even more fun shitting on that type with a "not a real bike" bike.
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Old 05-23-2013, 06:20 AM   #624
kraven
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Originally Posted by Ginger Beard View Post
You ought to have seen the reaction I got from a a guy with a 110ci bagger when I drag raced him on my Sporty after he called my bike a girls bike. Probably would be even more fun shitting on that type with a "not a real bike" bike.
Every guy with a big twin eventually learns to listen to the exhaust note before he craps on a Sportster rider.

Having said that about the Bolt parts, I have lots of respect for what a 1250 equipped bike can do. You can actually feel the frame and swingarm wriggling around under power. It's a load of torque and peak power.

And I'm not convinced yet that the oil pump and other assorted parts can take a lot of power in the Bolt engine.

Sportster is definitely easier for people who don't want to blaze their own trail and experiment, but still want to squeeze more power out of a sporting twin.
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Old 05-23-2013, 06:24 AM   #625
kraven
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Originally Posted by skysailor View Post
Sounds like the theme from the Six Million Dollar Man. The bike is inadequate. But we can rebuild it. We have the technology. We can make it stronger. We can make it faster. But, it will always be UGLY!
I wouldn't say it's inadequate. But if you want more power, you can get it without too much trouble.
I find the stock power level to be probably right on point for most riders anyway. After the usual pipe n' jet, it'll pick up some power and do fine. The bigger 950 models pick up luggage and a pillion and walk them down the road just fine. On a solo bike it should be more than fine.

For a guy like me who can't leave anything alone (I'm already looking for a TVS Eaton blower for my wife's beetle convertible), it's a good base. In my brain, it's already on the way to doing land speed runs with the stock displacement. I think the motor has a lot of potential and it's a fun mental exercise.

If you think it's ugly, that's your perogative. I'm not your mama.
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Old 05-23-2013, 06:33 AM   #626
Ginger Beard
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Originally Posted by kraven View Post
And I'm not convinced yet that the oil pump and other assorted parts can take a lot of power in the Bolt engine.

Judging by how quiet the Bolt is and from what I have seen of the Vstar 950 engine in other bikes, I am willing to bet that there is at least a 12-14% power gain to be had with just an exhaust and tune. Still waiting to see a Bolt completely done up Brat style.
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Old 05-23-2013, 07:14 AM   #627
Dranrab Luap
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Has anyone bought this imposter and abomination yet?
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Old 05-23-2013, 07:16 AM   #628
Super Sneaky Steve
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Originally Posted by PonyExpres View Post
I recently went on a ride with 7 guys from my neighborhood who ride Harleys. They asked me to ride at the back of the line since I was riding my Yamaha.

I said no problem, I'll just pick up the parts that fall off of your bikesas we go along.

When we got to the pub one of the guys said oh shit, what happened to my side cover. I said don't worry, I opened my saddle bag and handed it to him.
This deserves to be in the thread of Awesome!

If it were me, those friends who asked me to be in the back because of my bike wouldn't be my friends anymore.
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Old 05-23-2013, 08:15 AM   #629
mikejjmay
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Originally Posted by Dranrab Luap View Post
Has anyone bought this imposter and abomination yet?

Yep, pick it up next week.

In regards to all these other posts....

These threads seem to drop quickly into a debate over which bike is better and for what reason. While we can write all the facts down, opinions are always something that will belong to an individual.

Is the bolt better than the harley? Is the bolt an imposter? I have no idea. I think it kind of arrogant to say that i know what is better for someone other than myself (not saying the post I quoted is doing that, no offense intended, i hope you were kidding about abomination). All i know is that I test drove the bolt, and it made me smile, and want more. I test drove the Harley, and it was a wonderful and beautiful bike, but it just didn't speak to me. It was a gut thing, not based on fact or any perceived weakness or lack of something on either bike.

Ultimately, I buy a bike for me and for the enjoyment I get from it, not so that i can project my opinions to say "my bike is better than yours". Thats why I have 2 hacks as well. Not really practical to have two, but I enjoy them both, and I will be riding them, so thats my choice.

To get it back on track, I would like to inform on my experince with the extended test drive on the bolt, just in case anyone has head about some of the concerns.

1) the Guage visibility in the sunlight - yep, it does get a little harder to see. Was it a deal changer for me - no. On of the first accessories they have is a nice looking brass shade that mounts on the guage to help shade it. Its around $35 if memory serves. Also, some people have swapped the bulbs to a more powerful bulb, and stated that it fixed the problem completely, so there is hope.

2) heat on the legs - the left leg in contact with the top of the motor did not get hot. In fact, i took my bare hand and set it on the head and it was just fine after 30 mins of riding. The right side did have heat coming off the exhaust and engine, most noticible of course when stopped. It was about 65 degrees, so no problem for me. It will likely be more noticible on a hot day, but there is no more heat than average for a motorcycle of this size and style. Therefore, its not really a "bolt specific" issue.

3) positioning - some people have stated that they have to bow their legs out to sit proper on it. This is a completely individiual preference. Coming from a v strom and KLR background, it was an adjustment. However, after about 20 minutes of riding I found I was quie comfortable. The 3 gallon tank and 50 mpg will also make sure you take a break every now and then, so im not seeing it as a reall issue, but of sourse everyone will be unique on this one.

4) the brake pedal - some stated the brake pedal gets in the way to comfortably rest their foot on the pegs. This is true, however they are easily adjustable to lower the pedal. While I could not do this on the demo bike, I made sure to take a close look and ensure that it would be moved out of the way when adjustmet - which it will.

5) valve adjustments at 4,000 miles - this was incorrectly stated in a review. The interval is 15000 miles, and they are screw in type adjusters, so it should be very easy

6) oil filters and parts - shares many parts with the 950 V stars and other yamaha cycles and Rhino's, so parts are readily available. The filter is easily accessable, and is a quick spin on. No issues here.

I look forward to sharing my experiences when I pick mine up and put some real miles on it. Hope this helps anyone with any questions they have about the bolt. We are all here because we love riding, and because we are looking for information, so lets just enjoy our common interest and keep it civil eh?
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Old 05-23-2013, 08:36 AM   #630
Randy
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Originally Posted by mikejjmay View Post

...and it made me smile... It was a gut thing, not based on fact or any perceived weakness or lack of something on either bike.... Ultimately, I buy a bike for me and for the enjoyment I get from it, not so that i can project my opinions to say "my bike is better than yours".

And THAT, IMO, is what matter most! .

No two people have the exact same "buttons". Finding something that pushes YOURS is a very good thing. Ride for yourself and for the simple joys it can bring, and care not for the opinions of others.... This applies to life in general, IMO....


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