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Old 04-23-2013, 10:39 AM   #1
Dan Alexander OP
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What's this car and is it a decent deal??

Looks like a Ural / Dneper but I don't know how to tell the difference. I'm going to see it this afternoon.

It's in French but if you click the top right it'll translate.


http://qc.kijiji.ca/c-autos-et-vehic...AdIdZ477338549
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Old 04-23-2013, 12:33 PM   #2
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Very little rust, just inside the rear compartment where some water collected, no perforations. It's got splined hubs on the wheels and rounded mounts that look like they are for a BMW /2 with the welded on ball mounts.

Can this work on my 1100GS without too much fussing? Would I sell the splined hubs and put more modern hubs with a brake on the thing.
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Old 04-23-2013, 01:52 PM   #3
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It is a Dnepr. Round fender, small step and a closed luggage compartment.
It will be a good match for a R1100GS.
Yes, a subframe is quite straightforward, but it depends on your skills, your tools, and your time.
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Old 04-23-2013, 01:56 PM   #4
Dan Alexander OP
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Any idea what year it is?

I'd probably buy a subframe ready made as my welding skill are non existent.

How about those splined hubs, are they of any value? Would I keep them or sell and put a GS rim on?

And the big question, is $850 decent
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Beemers Past and Present: 74 R90S, 77 R100RS, 85 K100RS, 2x 87 K100RS, 96 R1100GS (getting hacked), 99 R1100S, 2002 R1150GS, 2005 F650 Dakar
Plus the occasional Triumph, BSA, Yamaha, Honda, Suzuki and KTM but who's counting
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Old 04-24-2013, 06:44 AM   #5
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$850 is a fair deal. Splined hubs are for Dnepr rear or sidecar drive shaft gears- all the wheels are interchangeable. They work on the car- no need to sell them. I think you'd have to press in a different axle for a different wheel.
As for year, it could be 60s up to 90s- they went basically unchanged except for fenders and lights. First models had leaf springs, but those were very early. That one is probably off a late model MT-11. 80s or 90s. It's been painted and it's missing lights and seat.

here's what they look like new:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/NEW-Assemble...item35b98894be

You'll have to get someone to make a subframe with the ball mounts to use with the car, or else cut the frame and make new clevis type mounts.
BMWEuro, Claude, DMC, or some others can help you.


This subframe is from NitroMax's airhead, but you can see the ball mounts at either end.
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Old 04-24-2013, 01:33 PM   #6
Dan Alexander OP
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Thanks MJ, that price is ebay is plus shipping so $3k with taxes and all. Are parts easy to come by for these?

I suppose getting new mounts instead of the ball mounts would work better?
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Plus the occasional Triumph, BSA, Yamaha, Honda, Suzuki and KTM but who's counting
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Old 04-24-2013, 06:03 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dan Alexander View Post
Thanks MJ, that price is ebay is plus shipping so $3k with taxes and all. Are parts easy to come by for these?

I suppose getting new mounts instead of the ball mounts would work better?
YOW....if you're getting up to $3000.00 total you're getting pretty pricey.
My Bro. sold a never mounted "as new" 90's model Ural sidecar for $1500.00 not too long ago.

"Steals" come around from time to time.
My Buddy in AZ. found this at a farm for $175.00 a couple months ago.
A vintage "winged" Watsonian (? I think?)....looks like the fender is on "bass - ackwards" to me...maybe it was a "left side" rig at one point?

Whatever it is or was, it has definate possibilities.




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Old 04-24-2013, 08:06 PM   #8
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I agree 3k is getting into the "Are you nuts ? " catagory.
I bought a Dnper on E-bay a few years back that had been modded with a hydrolic disc and a car wheel for $675 and went to Pa. to pick it up.
In the shape the one in the pic is , now days I wouldn't go over 1k.
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Old 04-25-2013, 07:32 AM   #9
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Yowzaa- how'd it jump from $850 to $3,000? That's too much. $1600 tops, shipped.

I would keep the ball mounts on the car. You can get the male balls (cue Beavis & Butthead laugh) on EBay (search IMZ or CJ sidecar) or at places like Blue Moon Cycle (search Steib sidecar hardware) and have someone use them to make you a subframe. I have the ball mounts on my rig, which also has a Dnepr chair. It's easy on and off.

Here's one from Old Timer Garage in Poland:

http://www.oldtimergarage.eu/catalog...oducts_id=3200
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Old 04-25-2013, 02:57 PM   #10
Dan Alexander OP
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Sorry the $3k was for a sidecar that was linked in a ebay listing a couple of posts above. It is $1200 plus shipping from Europe or somewhere at $1200 or so plus any taxes or customs costs would make it around $3k.

I'm thinking the car is going to get expensive. I'd like to pay $500 or $600 for it so I'll give it a week and see if it's still available.


That's an interesting website, had fun browsing around.
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Beemers Past and Present: 74 R90S, 77 R100RS, 85 K100RS, 2x 87 K100RS, 96 R1100GS (getting hacked), 99 R1100S, 2002 R1150GS, 2005 F650 Dakar
Plus the occasional Triumph, BSA, Yamaha, Honda, Suzuki and KTM but who's counting
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Old 04-26-2013, 01:41 PM   #11
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Had a car very similar (did not have the fin), all storage behind the seat, fiberglass and heavy duty frame. It turned out to be a copy of an English car that was often sold as a kit.

It was a lightweight car which was good for me as it was attached to my 1968 60/2. Provided a decent ride once I installed a new shock. Check for cracks around the welds. Mine was showing one but welded up again just fine.

Have fun!
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Old 04-26-2013, 02:19 PM   #12
gspell68
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dan Alexander View Post
Any idea what year it is?

I'd probably buy a subframe ready made as my welding skill are non existent.

How about those splined hubs, are they of any value? Would I keep them or sell and put a GS rim on?

And the big question, is $850 decent
Definitely made between 1958 and 2000!
All KMZ/Dnepr sidecars all almost identical. It's not a Ural, because it has no trunk lid. The only give away to a year of manufacture on yours is that it has (well, had) sidecar marker lights from the Dnepr MT series of bikes and not the KMZ K series of bikes.
So the oldest it'd probably be is about 1970-ish.
The wheels are from an M-72 or a CJ-750.
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Old 04-26-2013, 04:06 PM   #13
Dan Alexander OP
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Wow, all these abbreviations no idea what most of them mean.

I sure have a lot to learn about these but I always love exploring something new

Thanks for the help.
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Beemers Past and Present: 74 R90S, 77 R100RS, 85 K100RS, 2x 87 K100RS, 96 R1100GS (getting hacked), 99 R1100S, 2002 R1150GS, 2005 F650 Dakar
Plus the occasional Triumph, BSA, Yamaha, Honda, Suzuki and KTM but who's counting
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Old 04-26-2013, 04:12 PM   #14
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OK, I put my thinking cap on .... funny how they don't fit if you don't wear them very often

CJ 750 = Chang Jing

KMZ = ?

Ural I know

750M = Military?

Rims are from a 2 wheel drive because of the splines
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Beemers Past and Present: 74 R90S, 77 R100RS, 85 K100RS, 2x 87 K100RS, 96 R1100GS (getting hacked), 99 R1100S, 2002 R1150GS, 2005 F650 Dakar
Plus the occasional Triumph, BSA, Yamaha, Honda, Suzuki and KTM but who's counting
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Old 04-27-2013, 01:49 AM   #15
gspell68
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dan Alexander View Post
OK, I put my thinking cap on .... funny how they don't fit if you don't wear them very often

CJ 750 = Chang Jing

KMZ = ?

Ural I know

750M = Military?

Rims are from a 2 wheel drive because of the splines
KMZ = Kiev Motor Works = Dnepr Factory in Kiev, Ukraine near the Dnepr River.

IMZ = Irbit Motor Works = Ural Factory in Irbit, Russia in the Ural Mountains.

KMZ made K-750's, M72's, M-72N's, MB-750's and then lastly some MB-650's and K-650's. These were all made on an older style frame usually with the big teardrop tank. Then they started calling the bikes Dnepr and made MT-12's, MT-11's, MT-9's, MT-10's, MT-16's, etc.

K-750M...not military!!! M-72M...not military!!! MB = military.

Actually, the rims are from a 1WD and probably never would've come from the factory on a 2WD. KMZ/Dnepr never used those wheels again after they discontinued the 1WD only M-72's in the late 1950's before their first 2WD rigs. IMZ/Ural probably never used them because they changed to their modern wheel about the same time they added their first 2WD rigs.
You gotta remember. The spare has to be interchangeable with ANY wheel on the rig, therefore, they're ALL splined in case any have to be used in the pusher position.
Plus, they don't appear to be castellenated (bottle cap) hubs. This would suggest pre-1957-ish M-72 wheels or Chinese CJ-750 wheels.
It appears, too, that the installed wheel is on backwards; probably to prevent rubbing. Additionally, it has an extended spare tire rack that carries not just one, but two spare tires!!!
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gspell68 screwed with this post 04-27-2013 at 01:55 AM
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