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Old 05-09-2013, 12:33 AM   #31
oz97tj
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Quote:
Originally Posted by brenter View Post
Wait 2-3 years and all the bugs will be gone. There will also be new improvements along the way. I am fine with keeping my '12 GSA for a few years and then stepping to the new model. Look at the improvements that were made to gsa in 2010, I look for that to happen again.
I bet the 2042 model bikes will be even better still. We should just all wait till then.



Or, we can ride whats available and enjoy them. All the crap about "wait a year" will ALWAYS apply. Problem is, if we continue to "wait a year" we will never buy a bike and will be overcome with worry instead of enjoying the ride.
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Old 05-09-2013, 12:49 AM   #32
madefrtv
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The dealer is having the parts sent from Germany. They'll get here when they get here. I'm not worried yet. If it was keeping me from riding I'd poop the bed, but its not. So, I won't
Quote:
Originally Posted by atg View Post
Madefrtv;

Eventhough I feel you should complain at your dealer and request that they exchange the complete left side switch setup, it is possible that your dealer may not have them in stock and even BMW in your country may be out of them as well. That's what happened in Brazil. My dealership agreed to exchange both left and right complete switch assemblies under warranty, however as they are not in stock at BMW Brazil they will have to be imported and the whole process wil take about a month. Eventhough they will be air shipped from Germany, the brazilian import process is quite bureaucratic.

My problem was with the high beam switch and after the dealer's warranty department authorized the exchange, upon my insistence, one of their mechanics and myself took apart the left side assembly to check if lubricating the switch wouldn't make it workable again.

It is not very ease to take it apart. Besides 2 torx #8 screws visible from underneath there is a plastic piece with 2 tabs that have to be pressed on 2 points and removed before the switch assemblyit will comes off. These plastic tabs are quite easy to break so if you decide to take it apart be very careful as not to break them.

Once you've opened the assembly you will notice that what we come to think as switches are nothing more than levers that when pushed in actuate the real, inside switches. These have a cilindrical shape and are rubber covered to make them waterproof. In fact, these rubber coverings switches are very similar, albeit in a somewhat smaller size, to the old, also inside built, switches of the oilhead and hexhead GS's.

If you play around with this inside switch, most likely it will return to its original (out) position; however if you press it in again it will, sooner or later get stuck in, again.

What I did on my unit was to carefully lift up the rubber protection (which works and looks like a micro black condom), and spray some silicon oil inside its internal workings. After that, it started to work perfectly, perhaps even better than new !

My feeling is that this switch is made with to much precision, very German like, and any movement to them that is not precisely aligned makes them stuck. If they were made with more play built in the problem most likely would never occur. Also, if upon assembly at the factory they were lubricated with some kind of waterproof grease the problem would not exist.

I am not positive, however, that the solution I have implemented will be trouble free throughout the time. On one hand I think that as they get used more and more they will tend to abrade any rough edges they may have and they should work more freely and ever more smoothly; on the other hand,personally, I am not very worried abou their longevity as they will be exchanged under warranty in a month or so.

I am sorry if my explanation is too long and perhaps too detailed but as I don't know if warranty repair will be awarded in your case at least you will have one possible solution to this problem.

Best of luck to you,

Andre
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Old 05-09-2013, 03:51 AM   #33
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Wait till the bugs are out is code for ...I don't have the money to buy one now.
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Old 05-09-2013, 04:33 AM   #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by oz97tj View Post
It was my bike and it was handled very well by both my dealer, BMW of Southeast Michigan, and BMW Motorad.
In good news, you were able to ride their demo GSA while they fixed you bike, which helped put miles on it so it could be sold to someone and picked up this weekend.
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Old 05-09-2013, 05:42 AM   #35
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Originally Posted by brenter View Post
Wait 2-3 years and all the bugs will be gone. .
Don't count on it.. ever since BMW switched to the new style switchgear touted as "wire-less, copper infused plastic" or some such, first used on the K1300 series, the switches have been unreliable. They are also used on the K1600 bikes with the same results: K1600 failed switches replaced repeatedly on some owners' bikes.. My K1600 had the right cluster replaced twice. Check out the K1600 forum for the latest switch failures.

In theory, the switch employing no wires just copper connectors sounds more reliable, but the execution is obviously flawed. The K1300GT came out in 2009 using those switches, and the supplier still can't get them to work reliably.

I'm one of those who preferred the old style turn signal paddles. The improvement needed was to eliminate the cancel switch. Push left to signal left, push again to cancel, like Harley's (or let the self cancel after 200 meters do its thing)
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Old 05-09-2013, 06:21 AM   #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GB View Post
Don't count on it.. ever since BMW switched to the new style switchgear touted as "wire-less, copper infused plastic" or some such, first used on the K1300 series, the switches have been unreliable. They are also used on the K1600 bikes with the same results: K1600 failed switches replaced repeatedly on some owners' bikes.. My K1600 had the right cluster replaced twice. Check out the K1600 forum for the latest switch failures.

In theory, the switch employing no wires just copper connectors sounds more reliable, but the execution is obviously flawed. The K1300GT came out in 2009 using those switches, and the supplier still can't get them to work reliably.

I'm one of those who preferred the old style turn signal paddles. The improvement needed was to eliminate the cancel switch. Push left to signal left, push again to cancel, like Harley's (or let the self cancel after 200 meters do its thing)
GB;

I would like to learn more about those switches but reallly don't know where to look for information. Perhaps you may suggest some internet links ?

Anyway from what I understood from your text it appears that the problem you mention is in the connection of the copper connectors to the switches. The problem I went through is on the switch itself as it grabs in the in position refusing, even under the internal spring's tension to return to its off position.

Andre
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Old 05-09-2013, 06:41 AM   #37
oz97tj
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Originally Posted by jdmetzger View Post
In good news, you were able to ride their demo GSA while they fixed you bike, which helped put miles on it so it could be sold to someone and picked up this weekend.
Lol. Good for you. Nice bike.
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Old 05-09-2013, 08:16 AM   #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GB View Post
I'm one of those who preferred the old style turn signal paddles. The improvement needed was to eliminate the cancel switch. Push left to signal left, push again to cancel, like Harley's (or let the self cancel after 200 meters do its thing)
I agree. This is one of the only things I dislike about the new LC GS.
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Old 05-09-2013, 09:54 AM   #39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by atg View Post
GB;

I would like to learn more about those switches but reallly don't know where to look for information. Perhaps you may suggest some internet links ?

Anyway from what I understood from your text it appears that the problem you mention is in the connection of the copper connectors to the switches. The problem I went through is on the switch itself as it grabs in the in position refusing, even under the internal spring's tension to return to its off position.

Andre
I don't know what the problem is other than the new style switch gear has been failing since they were introduced in 2009 and have continued to fail on K1600 bikes, even after a recall on the switch gear on the K1300GT.

'Kromberg & Schubert developed a process whereby the plastic of the injection-molded inner switch body is filled with a small percentage of copper nano particles. After popping from the mold, the inner switch body is laser-etched to expose copper in appropriate areas, which can be plated to create a three-dimensional circuit board to which sealed and ergonomically delightful switching elements can be robotically placed and wave-soldered.'

http://www.kromberg-schubert.com/
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Old 05-09-2013, 10:22 AM   #40
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Originally Posted by marty hill View Post
Wait till the bugs are out is code for ...I don't have the money to buy one now.
Boy, You got that right. Last year I was all set to purchase the LC as soon as they started hitting the showrooms. However, finance issues and now rumors of layoffs at my work have me delaying the upgrade to an LC. Gives me the chance to say "I'll wait til the bugs are out", but in reality I can't take the chance of dropping over $20,000 on a motorcycle right now. Things aint too bad though, my old 2007 12GS with 119,000 miles just keeps chugging along and the switch gear works as good a day one.
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Old 05-09-2013, 01:06 PM   #41
mrt10x
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I truly believe that if enough people complain with the dealers and request that the defective parts are exchanged under warranty, BMW will do something about it !

As always, the human's body most sensitive part is always the wallet...

André
Just like they did with the fuel sensor strips
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Old 05-09-2013, 03:25 PM   #42
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GB View Post
I don't know what the problem is other than the new style switch gear has been failing since they were introduced in 2009 and have continued to fail on K1600 bikes, even after a recall on the switch gear on the K1300GT.

'Kromberg & Schubert developed a process whereby the plastic of the injection-molded inner switch body is filled with a small percentage of copper nano particles. After popping from the mold, the inner switch body is laser-etched to expose copper in appropriate areas, which can be plated to create a three-dimensional circuit board to which sealed and ergonomically delightful switching elements can be robotically placed and wave-soldered.'

http://www.kromberg-schubert.com/
GB;

Thanks a lot for the information. I've researched the suggested website and found some pictures of the BMW's grips.

http://www.fed.de/downloads/laser-ba...Dirk_Bcker.pdf

see items 50 and 51

From whta I understand this company specializes in manufacturing the "wired circuit" where the switches are soldered.

On my bike at least there is no problem ata all with the wiring, only with the switches themselves. Do you know if the same company manufactures the switches ?

Thanks again,

Andre
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Old 05-09-2013, 05:37 PM   #43
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Quote:
Originally Posted by atg View Post
Went to BMW's shop today and their vereduct is to exchange both left and right switch consoles ! Unfortunatelly there are none available in Brazil and they will have to be imported from Germany which should take 20 to 30 days.

Once warranty was aprooved for an exchange, we had it opened and spray some WD 40 inside the switches and they all came to life again !

The mechanics do not know the reason for this type of filure but suspect that it may be water related. Pesonally I don't beliebve so as the "grab effect" seems to be purely mechanical. In any event they did advise me that, prior to the exchange i would better cover them with a plastic foil before washing the bike.

It also seems that they had similar problems with the K 1600 that use similar switches.

Andre
WD -40 is junk throw it away !!! it will corrode metal and thicking in the cold
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Old 05-09-2013, 05:47 PM   #44
GrahamD
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GB View Post

'Kromberg & Schubert developed a process whereby the plastic of the injection-molded inner switch body is filled with a small percentage of copper nano particles. After popping from the mold, the inner switch body is laser-etched to expose copper in appropriate areas, which can be plated to create a three-dimensional circuit board to which sealed and ergonomically delightful switching elements can be robotically placed and wave-soldered.'
Lasers, nano particles...three-dimensional circuit board....Ooooh and ahhhh...

I might have to buy one now..Well at least some switches...
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Old 05-13-2013, 05:47 PM   #45
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I had a similar but much more dangerous problem with the switch. Last Saturday near the end of the a 500-mile ride, the reduce-speed switch on the cruise control first stopped working, then after my repeated attempts to reduce cruising speed when the highway approached a busy town, it began to increase speed instead of decreasing speed! My 1st reaction was that it was likely my delusion maybe I was just tired. Later when there's little traffic again, I turned on the cruise control and YES no matter whether I pulled up or pushed down the speed control, it always accelerated!

This coming weekend I'm going to test it again on an empty toll highway.
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