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Old 04-30-2013, 04:57 PM   #1
flei OP
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Cry Help! F650GS won't start!

I apologize if i am needlessly starting a new thread, but my new-to-me 2010 F650GS (800 Twin) died today, and I am seeking answers. Re-direct me if appropriate.

I have ridden the bike on and off road for 1k miles since I bought it a month ago. Today i went for a ride, all was well, and i stopped after about an hour for about 5 mins., then tried to re-start it and it would not start. The starter engages, the engine spins, no inappropriate warning lights are lit, but it will not start. It acts like it is getting no gas (or i suppose no spark). It seemed to be running fine up til i stopped. It reads "65 miles til empty" on the "gauge", and i can hear gas slosh in the tank. i do not think it is the "kill switch" or side or center stand switches as the starter does "spin". I know it could be many things (inc. computer or FI which I am not in any position to deal with), but would appreciate some places to start looking.
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Old 04-30-2013, 05:54 PM   #2
ebrabaek
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Quote:
Originally Posted by flei View Post
I apologize if i am needlessly starting a new thread, but my new-to-me 2010 F650GS (800 Twin) died today, and I am seeking answers. Re-direct me if appropriate.

I have ridden the bike on and off road for 1k miles since I bought it a month ago. Today i went for a ride, all was well, and i stopped after about an hour for about 5 mins., then tried to re-start it and it would not start. The starter engages, the engine spins, no inappropriate warning lights are lit, but it will not start. It acts like it is getting no gas (or i suppose no spark). It seemed to be running fine up til i stopped. It reads "65 miles til empty" on the "gauge", and i can hear gas slosh in the tank. i do not think it is the "kill switch" or side or center stand switches as the starter does "spin". I know it could be many things (inc. computer or FI which I am not in any position to deal with), but would appreciate some places to start looking.
Leave it sit overnight...... Start it in the morning ( hopefully it will).....It will run rough...... but after a stable idle, ride to the nearest good gas station,,,, fill'er up...then over to O'riley, and give it 4 oz of techron....... Ride her up and down the freeway for a few miles...... Good to go. If that does not work.... then you might have a bad fuel controller/pump.
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Old 04-30-2013, 07:58 PM   #3
tah1800
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Listen closely when you turn the key to the start position and see if you hear the fuel pump pressurize. If you don't, run a wire directly from the battery to the fuel pump and see if it starts. If it does. replace the fuel pressure sensor.
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Old 05-01-2013, 04:10 AM   #4
GH41
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Have the battery checked. Just because it turns over doesn't mean it has enough juice to start and run. GH
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Old 05-01-2013, 06:23 AM   #5
Reaver
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For your problem, the 800 is the same as your 650.

Read this:

http://www.advrider.com/forums/showthread.php?t=879509

I know you're flustered and just want help rather than search the threads but this is the same scenario as yours and may be the same problem. Save us a lot of typing.

Good luck.
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Old 05-01-2013, 08:35 AM   #6
flei OP
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Thumb thanks!

Thank you everybody for all the advice (including the reference to the thread on the 800 with similar issues)! I did try a site seach and was overwhelmed by the number of posts on starting issues and had trouble narrowing it down to the F650 so started this thread. Won't have time to try your suggestions until this weekend but will post results.
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Old 05-04-2013, 05:58 PM   #7
flei OP
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Cool2 and the problem was.....

Quote:
Originally Posted by flei View Post
I apologize if i am needlessly starting a new thread, but my new-to-me 2010 F650GS (800 Twin) died today, and I am seeking answers. Re-direct me if appropriate.

I have ridden the bike on and off road for 1k miles since I bought it a month ago. Today i went for a ride, all was well, and i stopped after about an hour for about 5 mins., then tried to re-start it and it would not start. The starter engages, the engine spins, no inappropriate warning lights are lit, but it will not start. It acts like it is getting no gas (or i suppose no spark). It seemed to be running fine up til i stopped. It reads "65 miles til empty" on the "gauge", and i can hear gas slosh in the tank. i do not think it is the "kill switch" or side or center stand switches as the starter does "spin". I know it could be many things (inc. computer or FI which I am not in any position to deal with), but would appreciate some places to start looking.
It was the fuel pump. Replaced free under warranty. I have no clue how this kind of fuel pump works! It seems strange that the bike ran fine while on the road but then would not start after a brief stop; does that mean the fuel pump died when the bike was turned off?
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Old 05-04-2013, 06:01 PM   #8
GB
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The fuel pump was replaced or the fuel pump CONTROLLER? the latter has been known to have a shaky reliability record.
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Old 05-05-2013, 02:52 AM   #9
flei OP
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Quote:
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The fuel pump was replaced or the fuel pump CONTROLLER? the latter has been known to have a shaky reliability record.
It was the PUMP; the controller checked out ok. Still unclear how a fuel pump dies when the bike is NOT running....
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Old 05-05-2013, 07:39 AM   #10
ebrabaek
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It was the PUMP; the controller checked out ok. Still unclear how a fuel pump dies when the bike is NOT running....
The aluminum part of the pumps inerts, corrode with the usage of ethanol in the fuel. Those flakes goes down stream, and plug the injectors. Same exact symptoms as you had. Many have had the same go over as you just did, with the dealer replacing the pump, only to find them self in round two with now plugged injectors. I don't mean to make you nervous, but just to be aware of this. I don't know how the pump can fail sitting, unless the dealer slung a pump at it, and it somehow unplugged the injectors. Hopefully that was it..... Happy trails.
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Old 05-05-2013, 08:01 AM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ebrabaek View Post
I don't know how the pump can fail sitting, unless the dealer slung a pump at it, and it somehow unplugged the injectors. Hopefully that was it..... Happy trails.
Hows work on the CF unpluggable injectors going?

I don't know about the US, but in Canada there's a limit on paid time allowed for warranty troubleshooting. Often they just throw parts at bikes till the customer stops coming back, esp in the busy summer season. Or the Jr tech replaced the whole gas tank when it was just empty then the Manager was too embarassed to admit it. Bit of a stretch but I've seen similar things like that happen.
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Old 05-05-2013, 08:02 AM   #12
JRWooden
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What was your fuel level when this happened?

The pump is cooled by being immersed in the gasoline...
but once level in tank gets done to ... mmmmmmm something like 3/8 the pump is no longer submerged for cooling ...

When you turned the bike off it could have gotten even a bit hotter since fuel is now no longer flowing thru the pump either ... then seized....

That's all I've got....
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Old 05-05-2013, 08:40 AM   #13
ebrabaek
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Reaver View Post
Hows work on the CF unpluggable injectors going?

I don't know about the US, but in Canada there's a limit on paid time allowed for warranty troubleshooting. Often they just throw parts at bikes till the customer stops coming back, esp in the busy summer season. Or the Jr tech replaced the whole gas tank when it was just empty then the Manager was too embarassed to admit it. Bit of a stretch but I've seen similar things like that happen.
LOL..... Haven't gotten to that yet...... That scenario is what I was referring to, as delicate as I could be. I have read so many storries, where they slung a pump at it, but more was needed. At the very least I would ring it out on the freeway, after a Techron ( BMW F/I cleaner) treatment.
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Old 05-05-2013, 09:08 AM   #14
MitchG
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When the pumps corrode they start to "drag" due to internal friction. Under normal conditions, the electric pump motor has enough torque to keep it running when the "dragging" gets to that "magic level", but on restart after shutdown, the pump requires an additional amount of startup torque to overcome the "dragging" which it can't supply. Hence the no start after shutting it off and attempting a restart. Tapping the bottom of the fuel pump area will sometimes impart enough vibration to free it enough for a restart, then run for home and don't shut it off.
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Old 05-05-2013, 10:18 AM   #15
JRWooden
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There was a video on youtube where a guy was fixing fuel pumps
(who knows how long this would last) by jogging the motor back and forth to get it unstuck then letting it pump WD-40 or some other light lubricant in a closed loop for a while to work out the crap ....

On one of the many other threads there have been comments of the fuel filter getting plugged to the point that the FPC is having to run the pump much harder than "normal" to overcome the restriction of the filter....
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