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Old 07-09-2013, 06:56 AM   #196
dwj - Donnie OP
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Originally Posted by JBird View Post
As a manufacturer I can tell you this is no excuse! If these outer edges of the tolerances don't work well together the tolerances are too broad!! No, ifs, ands , or buts. You bring that to a meeting and you can find another job.

Statistical process control can warn when tooling wear has moved the medium value and the process needs to be reset. This is what Demming taught the Japanese and they are so good at.

My career was also manufacturing and my experiences were the same. KTM was smart enough to not let their motos be used in Long Way Round, they need to be smart enough to copy a few examples of the problem parts from reliable motos. We called it "bench marking" in my business.
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Old 07-09-2013, 09:30 AM   #197
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I dont know about 990s but I saw a 950 enduro with 77k running like a mofo this weekend. Looked like it had been beaten with hammer everywhere and most of the paint was left behind.
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Old 07-10-2013, 07:10 AM   #198
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I have less pain today that I had yesterday, but I still could not ride the moto if it were ready. I talked with my insurance adjuster yesterday, so that is on track. I have full coverage on the KTM. The moto is in the shop of a father and son that have been working on and racing motos for over 50 years. He actually believes that he can repair the front wheel sufficiently to make it home. I will get permanent repairs and plastic replaced there. I would hope to leave here by Friday or Saturday. You would not believe the support I have received from Josephine's family and Hector. Other that the pain, this has really not been a problem And the pain reminds me to be more careful! The road was shut down a little while after I left and did not open for another couple days.
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Old 07-10-2013, 07:18 AM   #199
bigdon
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Hey Donnie, what happened to you and the Moto? I've been looking but can not find anything about a problem.
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Old 07-10-2013, 10:10 AM   #200
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Hey Donnie, what happened to you and the Moto? I've been looking but can not find anything about a problem.
I hit a hidden curb, bent the front wheel badly and the rear rim some. I went down and have severe bruises to my rib cage and back. The pain is much better now. I will be able to ride in another day or so.
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Old 07-10-2013, 10:17 AM   #201
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Glad your on the mend!
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Old 07-10-2013, 12:22 PM   #202
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dwj - Donnie View Post
KTM was smart enough to not let their motos be used in Long Way Round, they need to be smart enough to copy a few examples of the problem parts from reliable motos. We called it "bench marking" in my business.
While I will admit that KTM missed the media and marketing opportunity that was the 'Long Way Around,' I feel that it has nothing to do with the tolerancing of interfacing engine components or any other factor to do with the reliability of their motorcycles, be they 125cc 2-strokes or 1190cc V-twin 4-strokes.

I know personally of plenty of folks who have taken 950 and 990 LC8's literally around the world and/or well over the 80,000 mile mark with literally only valve adjustments and oil and filter changes. To assert or imply that any BMW built during the same timeframe of the 950-990 era is any more mechanically reliable is to reference oneself as remarkably uninformed at the very least...

EDIT: lastly, and in complete honesty, I challenge anyone to demonstrate that any equivalent bike(in terms of performance and 'fun factor') can carry on for as long as any 950 or 990 can in a reliable fashion while still retaining the badge of ability and versatility that they can. It simply does no exist int he motorcyle world - real, rally-able off-road ability with the same ability to be a street cruiser to many. Even if the lifespan, according to many, is ~50k miles, it's still a testament to how reliable it is withing that lifespan. While I respect other brands and models to be reliable, they simply will not ever deliver the same width of grin, as inevitably consistently, as the LC8 engine family and Adventure/SuperEnduro application has, to date...

The 1190 is an entirely new creature, it it remains to prove itself.

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Old 07-10-2013, 01:24 PM   #203
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I'll gladly accept...

[QUOTE=hilslamer; I challenge anyone to demonstrate that any equivalent bike(in terms of performance and 'fun factor') can carry on for as long as any 950 or 990 can in a reliable fashion while still retaining the badge of ability and versatility that they can. It simply does no exist int he motorcyle world - real, rally-able off-road ability with the same ability to be a street cruiser to many. Even if the lifespan, according to many, is ~50k miles, it's still a testament to how reliable it is withing that lifespan. While I respect other brands and models to be reliable, they simply will not ever deliver the same width of grin, as inevitably consistently, as the LC8 engine family and Adventure/SuperEnduro application has, to date...[/QUOTE]

This is sooo easy.... HONDA TRANSALP. This was a twin based closely on the Rally version. This bike and it's predecessor Africa Twin were favorites in the Dakars during their run... proven suspension, proven power and proven reliability. For their time and even way after their prime, the bike offers up the fun factor. Granted we're now talking about a bike 30 years old, which still warrants itself in this very discussion. I still own mine and have put plenty of hard miles on it. And I still ride it. And it's still extremely fun, even with it's design.

This bike did not have the high heat properties and problems attributed to the Adventure and Super Enduro. No clutch slave problem, no VRR but outs, no fuel pump points corrosion, no engine overheating, no fuel lock, no battery leakage from the dash components, no throttle delay.

The only design problem which was corrected was the location of the CDI mounts.

The bike is easier to do simple maintenance without ever removing the fuel tank.

Don't get me wrong, I love my early 950 to death. It's the design evolution in long range performance of adventure riding. However, KTM is simply not as focused on long lasting minimal maintenance design. They prioritize their efforts on performance and don't have the infrastructure to worry about the infinite details of saving customers maintenance time and money. I get it, it's a tough world out there to try and make a buck being a little motorcycle company. But my 950 requires WAY more "lovin" in the garage then my Transalp ever did.

And I don't know if many other manufacturers would have green lit a twin cylinder dual sport without having the Honda XL600V and XL750V as a proven design example.

Do I win a prize?
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Old 07-10-2013, 03:05 PM   #204
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dwj - Donnie View Post
I hit a hidden curb, bent the front wheel badly and the rear rim some. I went down and have severe bruises to my rib cage and back. The pain is much better now. I will be able to ride in another day or so.
Bugger. Hope you're up and breathing easy and riding soon.
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Old 07-10-2013, 03:23 PM   #205
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Originally Posted by DesertSurfer View Post
This is sooo easy.... HONDA TRANSALP. This was a twin based closely on the Rally version. This bike and it's predecessor Africa Twin were favorites in the Dakars during their run... proven suspension, proven power and proven reliability. For their time and even way after their prime, the bike offers up the fun factor. Granted we're now talking about a bike 30 years old, which still warrants itself in this very discussion. I still own mine and have put plenty of hard miles on it. And I still ride it. And it's still extremely fun, even with it's design.

This bike did not have the high heat properties and problems attributed to the Adventure and Super Enduro. No clutch slave problem, no VRR but outs, no fuel pump points corrosion, no engine overheating, no fuel lock, no battery leakage from the dash components, no throttle delay.

The only design problem which was corrected was the location of the CDI mounts.

The bike is easier to do simple maintenance without ever removing the fuel tank.

Don't get me wrong, I love my early 950 to death. It's the design evolution in long range performance of adventure riding. However, KTM is simply not as focused on long lasting minimal maintenance design. They prioritize their efforts on performance and don't have the infrastructure to worry about the infinite details of saving customers maintenance time and money. I get it, it's a tough world out there to try and make a buck being a little motorcycle company. But my 950 requires WAY more "lovin" in the garage then my Transalp ever did.

And I don't know if many other manufacturers would have green lit a twin cylinder dual sport without having the Honda XL600V and XL750V as a proven design example.

Do I win a prize?

You win mine! I think many KTM owners, just as many BMW owners, are so drunk on the koolaid they can't view a situation in an un-biased manner. Even the gentleman you responded to ended up claiming if the moto only lasted 50,000 miles it would be worth it. Maybe in his world, not in mine! There are folks over on the GS board that will get very pissed at you if suggest there is a problem with their brand. Most of what I know about KTM is from this Forum and the many long distance rides I have followed with folks on KTMs. Based on that knowledge, I don't think KTM would have survived Long Way Round and thus, I think they made a smart decision not to allow their motos to be used. KTM markets the 990 as a long distance Adventure Touring Machine. Do you think it comes close to passing that test? Does it come close to equaling BMW in that respect? No question, it is a better dirt bike, but that is not really how they market it.

As far as the many folks that have taken their 990 more than 80,000 miles with no more than valve adjustments and oil changes, where are they? I am not trying to question the gentleman's integrity, but as someone that plans on putting a lot of miles on my 990, I would love to hear from folks that have done it. It would certainly make me rest easier!

I have read of a number of cases where the 950/990 engines are dis-assembled to repair failures. without exception the owners brag about how un-worn the engine appears. Have they forgotten that the engine had to be taken apart because it no longer operated or not correctly. Yes, the orange koolaid is very strong and I admit I like the taste of it myself! But, I am a high mileage rider and in the end anyone's koolaid will eventually turn to piss!
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Old 07-10-2013, 05:01 PM   #206
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Compare a Transalp with a KTM 950 is like compare apples with oranges,i have boths and i never use the Trans...the Honda has less parts that can fail but both has problems as any bike that was used hard
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Old 07-11-2013, 01:49 AM   #207
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I haven't got the kms to back it up but it's a 1k cc vtwin putting out a lazy 105hp I don't know what all the worry is about. Pick a bike that makes you smile and get back to it.

Where are the many folk riding there 950/990s at 80000miles?? My guess is they are too busy out riding
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Old 07-11-2013, 03:01 AM   #208
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DesertSurfer View Post
This is sooo easy.... HONDA TRANSALP. This was a twin based closely on the Rally version. This bike and it's predecessor Africa Twin were favorites in the Dakars during their run... proven suspension, proven power and proven reliability. For their time and even way after their prime, the bike offers up the fun factor. Granted we're now talking about a bike 30 years old, which still warrants itself in this very discussion. I still own mine and have put plenty of hard miles on it. And I still ride it. And it's still extremely fun, even with it's design.

This bike did not have the high heat properties and problems attributed to the Adventure and Super Enduro. No clutch slave problem, no VRR but outs, no fuel pump points corrosion, no engine overheating, no fuel lock, no battery leakage from the dash components, no throttle delay.

The only design problem which was corrected was the location of the CDI mounts.

The bike is easier to do simple maintenance without ever removing the fuel tank.

Don't get me wrong, I love my early 950 to death. It's the design evolution in long range performance of adventure riding. However, KTM is simply not as focused on long lasting minimal maintenance design. They prioritize their efforts on performance and don't have the infrastructure to worry about the infinite details of saving customers maintenance time and money. I get it, it's a tough world out there to try and make a buck being a little motorcycle company. But my 950 requires WAY more "lovin" in the garage then my Transalp ever did.

And I don't know if many other manufacturers would have green lit a twin cylinder dual sport without having the Honda XL600V and XL750V as a proven design example.

Do I win a prize?
Quote:
Originally Posted by southernADV View Post
Compare a Transalp with a KTM 950 is like compare apples with oranges,i have boths and i never use the Trans...the Honda has less parts that can fail but both has problems as any bike that was used hard
Understandable If we motorcyclist were all clinical emotionless wise-men we might all be riding Transalps, but I to faced with several choices in my garage (one of which being a Honda) find myself seated on my 950 thumbing the starting and riding off into the distance yet again

Motorcycling in essence is about passion else we may as well all drive cars on our Adventures
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Old 07-11-2013, 03:27 AM   #209
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Donnie...

For someone who has ridden so many miles, your trip has sure been a cluster f...
I offended you at the beginning of this post about your credibility regarding how many miles you were averaging per year. I'm back to offend again......how about you slow down on your bike, forget about how long a "Moto" will last, and become a rider and not some sort of mileage hound. By your ride reports it sounds like you have no direction, no plan, no objective. IMO, you are putting yourself in danger. Chill out man, grieve for your losses for awhile, sell the house, then hit the trail better prepared. You will have to admit that for someone who was planning on living on the road you hurried your departure and the results thus far have proven you were not ready for this particular adventure. I'm happy that your injuries are not too bad, count yourself lucky there are no fractures or lacerations requiring medical attention.
Use this as a wake up call....unless you have a death wish or like putting yourself in harms way.
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Old 07-11-2013, 04:53 AM   #210
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For someone who has ridden so many miles, your trip has sure been a cluster f... This is the way I travel.
I offended you at the beginning of this post about your credibility regarding how many miles you were averaging per year. I'm back to offend again......how about you slow down on your bike, forget about how long a "Moto" will last, and become a rider and not some sort of mileage hound. I'm not a mileage hound as you put it, it is simply that to go the places I want to go the miles accumulate. It is a matter of perspective. You probably come from a dirt bike back ground while I came from a Touring back ground. Our perspectives of a normal mileage day will be very different. Neither is more correct or more wrong. By your ride reports it sounds like you have no direction, no plan, no objective. IMO, you are putting yourself in danger. You have correctly observed that I do not plan, that is what makes my trips so enjoyable! There is no daily requirement! Having the time to "get where you get" as my late wife and I called it is absolutely wonderful!Chill out man, grieve for your losses for awhile, sell the house, then hit the trail better prepared. You will have to admit that for someone who was planning on living on the road you hurried your departure and the results thus far have proven you were not ready for this particular adventure. This is just a 30 day ride while I wait for the house to sell. But, I won't do much planning when I hit the road,. I don't have to and I find the trip so much more enjoyable when I have no schedules. I lived by schedules for many years. My career was manufacturing where the difference between success and failure at times was as close a few tenths of one percent. I'm happy that your injuries are not too bad, count yourself lucky there are no fractures or lacerations requiring medical attention. Thanks for your concern!
Use this as a wake up call....unless you have a death wish or like putting yourself in harms way.
I do a lot of wandering traveling. Do you ever go out close to your home and just wander around? Maybe turn down roads that you have never been down before and maybe you don't know exactly where it goes. I do the same thing, but it is often in a different country.

I did not arrive at this travel method over night, it took years to develop. First in the US and later on down south. If you had told me 10 years ago that I would be traveling down south the way I do now, I would probably have thought you were as crazy as maybe you think I am now. Most of our friends thought Sheryl and I were crazy to do the traveling the way we did. But as you travel, as in just about anything else, you stretch your boundaries and in time, what was once extremely rad becomes normal.

As far a my accident. I believe very firmly if you ride, you are going to fall down. I was in circumstances prior to my accident that I did not want to be in, but that is the nature of traveling. It ain't always easy.

I almost forgot to address the longevity issue. Traveling full time. be it around the world and around South America, for me would accumulate about 35,000 miles per year. Sure there would be 500 mile days, but there would be a lot of days with near 0 miles. Using motos with a reliable life span of 100.000 miles means a change in less than three years. When I say reliable life span, I don't mean that the moto is worn out, but that it has become un-reliable for touring in more desolate areas. BTW. I am 29 days into this trip and there have been 13 days with less than 10 miles per day. Living on the road, which I am not doing yet, does not mean riding every day.

One other comment and I mean no offense with these comments. You have a manner that you enjoy riding. I am sure that it is within a window that you feel you have control and comfort. I have no doubt that you enjoy your rides as much as I enjoy mine. But, you should not assume that the only proper way to ride is the same way that you ride. Different folks have different comfort levels. Some folks like dirt, some don't. Some folks who have had the opportunity to travel more on their motos might be more comfortable in certain circumstances than others. If you went to some of the places I go down south, assuming you have little or no experience there, you may be putting yourself at risk. If I rode my 990 in some of the places in your area that I am not accustomed to, I may be putting myself at risk. The level of risk is directly related to the experience of those involved.

dwj - Donnie screwed with this post 07-11-2013 at 05:36 AM
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