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Old 06-29-2013, 04:15 PM   #1
Michelangelo OP
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How to: find TDC on KTM 450 XCF?

Just picked up a 2009 KTM XCF (dual cam of course) 450 and need to check valves. For a company which has amazing bikes and engineering, their service manuals are absolute garbage, worthless.

I cannot find TDC, after 30 mins of turning the crank end and sticking a zip tie in the spark plug hole and looking for the mark on the cam chain gear. A few questions which may help you help me.


1. To find TDC should I be rotating the wheel forward or the crankshaft bolt counterclock wise...correct?

2. The 6mm bolt that is supposed to hold engine in TDC from the hole in the lower front of the engine: how far in is it supposed to thread in once I got it at TDC? (I can get it to thread all the way in until it keeps spinning but it doesn't stop or engage anything.)

3. When I'm at TDC are the cam lobes on both cams supposed to be facing away from eachother or towards eachother or directly up?

4. As mentioned my cam chain gear has just one indented mark on it. Whenever I get it to the top, where one would assume the engine should be close to TDC; the ziptie is never at it's highest and the cam lobes are neither facing directly at eachother or directly away from eachother!

I know, I know I could be on the wrong stroke but I've turned that engine over a hundred times and I can't get anything to line up: If I get the cam chain gear mark on top, the zip tie isn't at it's peak or the lobes are facing every which way or vice versa. I'm stumped.

I ended up just turning until I got the intake cam lobes facing straight up. Then check intake clearances. Then I turned until I got the exhaust cam lobes straight up, and checked the exhaust clearances.

But I'd sure like to know how to get it to TDC so I can take the cams out and replace shims.
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Old 06-29-2013, 05:29 PM   #2
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Here's the procedure
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Old 06-29-2013, 05:30 PM   #3
Michelangelo OP
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Thanks for the link but it won't let me into KTM Talk.
I got banned a year ago for criticizing the nazi like way the moderator ran things there. jerk.
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Old 06-29-2013, 05:34 PM   #4
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Ive found top dead center using the bolt system several times,it took about 3 minutes. Your doing something wrong.
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Old 06-29-2013, 05:36 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Foot dragger View Post
Ive found top dead center using the bolt system several times,it took about 3 minutes. Your doing something wrong.

Yes, I KNOW. That's why I'm posting, asking for how to do it correctly.
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Old 06-29-2013, 05:58 PM   #6
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I know on the RFS the bolt gets removed, copper washer taken off then it's rethreaded in the hole, mine tightened up and didn't continue to spin. I was also able to shine a light up the hole and confirm the notch in the crankshaft before threading it in.

Turn the motor over in the dir of rotation, just after the intake closes, monitor the piston location as it comes to the top (tiewrap or visual through the sparkplug hole) and once it reaches the top, you are at TDC.
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Old 06-29-2013, 06:01 PM   #7
Michelangelo OP
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Maybe I'm putting it in the wrong hole? LOL

So I took the bolt out of the right side of the engine. Then am trying to stick it in the hole that is in the front lower of the engine. Is that the correct sequence and location?
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Old 06-29-2013, 06:05 PM   #8
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Don't bother:

Adjust the intake when the exhaust is opening.
Adjust the exhaust when the intake is closing.
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Old 06-29-2013, 07:19 PM   #9
jar944
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There are no marks on the cam gear or cam.

When the flats of the cams are parallel lock the crank with the lock bolt...
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Old 06-29-2013, 08:37 PM   #10
RideFreak
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FakeName View Post
Don't bother:

Adjust the intake when the exhaust is opening.
Adjust the exhaust when the intake is closing.
doesn't work that way on this motor, cams are removed and the shims are changed.

on the RFS the TDC locating bolt resides, is stored in the same hole used to lock the crank, a washer is removed to allow the bolt to extend into the motor enough to pin the crank. Not sure if yours is the same though.
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Old 06-29-2013, 08:40 PM   #11
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Ok I tried your method of getting the slots on the camshaft lined up parrallel and then inserted locking bolt. I tried this two times, both times with the zip tie inserted into sparkplug hole so I can see that the piston was at or close-to TDC.

Then I inserted locking bolt and not sure what next? I could get the bolt to insert and thread to the point where it would just rotate and rotate and not lock all the way into the hold. I think i ran out of thread on the bolt before anything. I even tried rotating the engine over to make sure it was locked AND...I could still rotate it over so i can only assume the bolt didn't lock it into TDC like it's supposed to.

How far should the locking bolt be into the hold to assure me I have it at TDC and inserted correctly?
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Old 06-29-2013, 08:48 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RideFreak View Post
doesn't work that way on this motor, cams are removed and the shims are changed.

Just to check? Should be able to get the lobes out of the way, check 'em, rotate until the other set is clear, then check those. No need to find TDC IMHO?
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Old 06-29-2013, 08:50 PM   #13
Michelangelo OP
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Yeah I was able to check clearances by rotating lobes to the top. But I want to know the trick on locking it at TDC so I can remove cams and change shims.
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Old 06-29-2013, 08:53 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Michelangelo View Post
Yeah I was able to check clearances by rotating lobes to the top. But I want to know the trick on locking it at TDC so I can remove cams and change shims.

Why? I guess I don't get it? Getting close and taking out the tensioner won't work?
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Old 06-29-2013, 08:58 PM   #15
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Just googled and found a great article:

http://www.dirtrider.com/features/pr...p_end_rebuild/
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