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Old 07-25-2013, 08:35 AM   #16
motobene
Motoing for 43 years
 
Joined: Mar 2013
Location: Wichita Mountains SW Oklahoma
Oddometer: 1,013
Quote:
Originally Posted by Twin-shocker View Post
Bar position does make an awful lot of difference, and in many cases moving the bar mounts themselves forward a little will improve a bike enormously.

The stock position is a compromise, and means its often necessary to move the bars forward to help improve control. Factory riders have bar mounting position adjusted to suit them perfectly, but this is something thats relatively easy to do, if you use S3 adjustable clamps.
I used to cut the angled back TY350 mounts and re weld them pointing up in a much more modern position. It was a huge help to the steering.

Hold a 1" cylinder rod in the hands with your arms hanging down and you will see a natural up angle toward the outside. When the bars are rotated too far back the bar ends are too flat or even angled down, which is contrary to the natural hand grip axis. That's very uncomfortable, and it pushes the body mass back too far. I call it the floppy-eared effect, whereas trials is more an upright and alert-ears sport. A bad experience for me is to hop on a typical fast off road rider's bike with bars rotated back, bar ends angled dawn, and levers angled down. I feel like a lead blanket is smothering me down and back on the bike. It's exhausting to ride that way. For them it is normal because they tend to ride glued to the seat all the time.

The important thing is the position AND compound angle of the grips relative to the rest of the bike and your particular body. How you get there is less important than where the bars are mounted. Where they are mounted - how backward or forward on the triple clamp - is simply an enabler to get to your ergonomic goals at the grips.

I'm tall and have long arms. For me the typical modern bar bends and standard triple clamp handlebar clamp positions work out well. If I were to slide the bar mounting forward, I'd lose up angle at the bar ends when the grips are where they should be.

And then there is that last bit about clutch and brake lever in-out position and angle. For me, once the grips are where they should be, I end up with a slight down angle to the levers, but more up angle than the reservoir caps being level with the ground. All of it together is complicated. A picture is worth a thousand words. The following shows the 280 Econo's ergos. Too many angles and positions to be captured in a photo, but it's perhaps helpful to see what works for me.

https://docs.google.com/file/d/0B9eL...it?usp=sharing

motobene screwed with this post 07-25-2013 at 08:52 AM
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Old 07-25-2013, 08:44 AM   #17
mud
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Joined: Apr 2003
Location: Roseville, MN
Oddometer: 1,668
Quote:
Originally Posted by Twin-shocker View Post
Bar position does make an awful lot of difference, and in many cases moving the bar mounts themselves forward a little will improve a bike enormously.

The stock position is a compromise, and means its often necessary to move the bars forward to help improve control. Factory riders have bar mounting position adjusted to suit them perfectly, but this is something thats relatively easy to do, if you use S3 adjustable clamps.
Be careful with this one. I have ridden both trials and dirt bikes that have their bars forward on the clamps for more room and they don't handle right. Yes, they are comfortable, but you get the bars to much forward of the steertube and the bars have to swing instead of turn. It looses its neutrality.

If your bars are much higher and/or forward of the factory boys, think twice....
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