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Old 07-13-2013, 05:36 AM   #1
Fundy Rider OP
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Idle Air Mixture Screw Access

Just took an eight hr trip to get the bike serviced. The idea was to get an lc8 tech. to do the valves, synch the carbs, set the tps and cure my somewhat rough idle that fluctuated maybe 50 to 100 rpm or so but ran great.

It's an 05.5 950 adv. with 26000kms

Everything in spec I was told. Left gassed up and after eighty miles or so I come to realize the idle is hung up around 2200 and then will fall to 1200.

Not very happy! Talked to tech and was told he blocked a couple vent lines from the sas that was previously removed may be causing the idle issue with a rich condition. Makes sense.

I am rambling so I will get to the chase. Do the carbs have to be removed to access the Idle Air mixture Srews?

Or can a tool be made?

Lesson learned keep wrenching yourself.
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Old 07-13-2013, 05:55 AM   #2
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You can adjust the screws with this tool by removing the triangle doors...
http://www.motionpro.com/motorcycle/partno/08-0119/

Hanging idle could be vacuum leak. Carbs not seated properly or vacuum ports not sealed off.
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Old 07-13-2013, 05:55 AM   #3
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Sounds more like the pilot jets small side holes are partially plugged . . . Try a strong dose of SeaFoam (when the tanks are very low) . . . Let it sit over night after running for a few miles first.

Ethanol fuels plug things up if the bike sits for very long.

Normally, OEM 2.25 turns out is the best for the idle mixture

http://www.ktm950.info/how/Orange%20...ing_index.html

Idle mixture screw settings, float level and idle air jet size are the primary sources of mixture delivery during 4000 rpm steady state cruise operation.
If lean surging is encountered, richen mixture screws (turn out) in 1/2 turn increments. Alternative idle air jets are can be installed if required.
Idle mixture screw settings, float level and idle air jet size also affect high-rpm, 0 to 1/8 throttle maneuvers. Too lean, will cause surging problems when the engine is operated at high rpm at small throttle openings! Opening the mixture screws and/or increasing idle air jet size will usually cure the problem.
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mcmann screwed with this post 07-14-2013 at 07:03 PM
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Old 07-14-2013, 12:31 AM   #4
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I have read it is between 1,75-2,5 turns out

You can hear it geting smoother as you tinker with it.
Cheers.
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Old 07-14-2013, 05:17 AM   #5
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I have ran the bike plenty after the winter and has been running fine since coming out of storage.

I also put star tron ethanol fuel treatment in the bike. A heavy few doses once out of storage for the winter and put some in every once in awhile during riding season.

The only changes made were the blocking of two vent lines that were from the sas system that have been removed since the bike had 2000 miles on it.

It makes total sense that the idle circuit would be rich now with those lines blocked.

Unless I am missing something or don't understand. Why would anything be clogged in the pilot circuit if the bike ran well the day before these two vent lines were blocked?

The tool from Motion Pro is something to be desired with tuning these bikes.

Thanks for the replies. I know this subject has been beat to death.

Any more insight would be appreciated but I plan on taking the IMS screws out a quarter turn then run the bike and repeat until the highest idle is achieved then will set the idle to its 1400 rpm.
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Old 07-14-2013, 07:03 AM   #6
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Pilot jets plugging would only effect the idle. Maybe the fuel treatment loosened up some crap in the carb . . . Which partially plugged the side holes . . . Or not??

#4 = low-speed jet (42)
#5 = main jet (155/160) with the main jet holder
#6 = starter jet (68)
#7 = idle-air mixture control screw(2 1/4 turns out)



Plan B . . . Spray carb cleaner through the top idle jet:

#1 = main air jet (40)
#2 = ACV (air cut valve) jet (80)
#3 = idle-air jet (50)

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mcmann screwed with this post 07-14-2013 at 07:20 AM
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Old 07-15-2013, 03:41 AM   #7
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Thank you all for taking the time to help with your pics and all the info.

I plan to start with the Idle air mixture screws after the tool arrives and if it doesn't cure the issue I will tear into it.

I always tell everyone I live on the border of Calais Maine in the town of St. Stephen New Brunswick Canada.

If Your heading to the East Coast of Canada wether it be Labrador Newfoundland or any of our Maritime provinces coming from the lower 48 states you will more than likely come through this border.

The door is always open and if you want a tire or something I have an address stateside and could pick it up for you and you could do the deed at my place with a place to crash.

Thanks again and I will let you all know how it goes once I have the tool.
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Old 07-15-2013, 05:57 AM   #8
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[QUOTE=Fundy Rider;21855362]
Not very happy! Talked to tech and was told he blocked a couple vent lines from the sas that was previously removed may be causing the idle issue with a rich condition. Makes sense.

QUOTE]

Just went back and reread the original post. The above doesn't make sense to me. Never had a hanging idle caused by rich mixture. When you get the tanks off and remove the triangle doors, check that the carbs are seated all the way before messing with the fuel screws.
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Old 07-15-2013, 06:26 AM   #9
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For sure with the carb boots.

The hanging idle when the throttle is blipped is due to the vacuum and after a few seconds that is used up causing the idle to fall.

I may be mistaken but there could be so many variables.

Plan of attack is to start with the easy stuff and go from there.
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Old 07-17-2013, 03:55 PM   #10
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Well I went at it today and it turned into one of those frustrating days at working on our beloved bikes.

The tool from Motion Pro was too long and then tried to make a tool but couldn't really see what I was doing and finally came to the conclusion I am going to have to take the carbs off to do this properly.

Went online and found a few threads but I didn't feel too confident and felt they were missing a few things.

Loosened up the top of the boots and looked around and thought man I need a female Asian hands to get at some of that stuff.

Thought maybe I can gain some access if I manage to get them off the boots. The right side seemed quite cramped with wires and such. Thinking the tps was there so to be honest it intimidated me a bit.

I read a few times that the cables tps and enricher can remain on. That would be ideal not having to mess with them.

So I was wondering if any of you could help me out with a step by step to get the carbs off. After the carbs are exposed with just the bottom part of the airbox on and the two triangle doors open.

I almost wanted to go to the dealer but another five hr ride and that would be taking the easy way out. I should know how to do this. I don't want to give up.

Thanks again in advance.
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Old 07-17-2013, 04:47 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fundy Rider View Post
...
So I was wondering if any of you could help me out with a step by step to get the carbs off. After the carbs are exposed with just the bottom part of the airbox on and the two triangle doors open.
...
Not many steps left at that point.

You should be able to reach in through the right-hand triangle to loosen the clamps on the carb boots- loosen only the top clamps.

Disconnect the fuel line on the left side, below the airbox.

Pull up with a rocking motion on the carb assy.



I have found that a little silicone grease on the boots helps ease reseating the carbs. And, yes the hoses and idle-speed adjuster can be a pain to rethread through their holes in the airbox.



After you have done it a couple of times, it is a pretty easy job, but is still time consuming.
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Old 07-17-2013, 04:50 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fundy Rider View Post
Well I went at it today and it turned into one of those frustrating days at working on our beloved bikes.

The tool from Motion Pro was too long and then tried to make a tool but couldn't really see what I was doing and finally came to the conclusion I am going to have to take the carbs off to do this properly.

Went online and found a few threads but I didn't feel too confident and felt they were missing a few things.

Loosened up the top of the boots and looked around and thought man I need a female Asian hands to get at some of that stuff.

Thought maybe I can gain some access if I manage to get them off the boots. The right side seemed quite cramped with wires and such. Thinking the tps was there so to be honest it intimidated me a bit.

I read a few times that the cables tps and enricher can remain on. That would be ideal not having to mess with them.

So I was wondering if any of you could help me out with a step by step to get the carbs off. After the carbs are exposed with just the bottom part of the airbox on and the two triangle doors open.

I almost wanted to go to the dealer but another five hr ride and that would be taking the easy way out. I should know how to do this. I don't want to give up.

Thanks again in advance.
Once you have loosened one of the boot clamps on both carbs, grab the end of each carb and yank. Sometimes it works to rock one out before the other. Bend the sides of airbox out of the way as necessary to get the carbs past the lip. Now just twist the carbs over onto the sides and adjust the IMS screws. When putting the carbs back, MAKE SURE that you get the carbs fully seated on the boots.

Finally, put the left tank back on, hook up the fuel line, and check to see how she runs. Repeat as necessary.

And, go out and get yourself a set of FlexJet 2s so that you don't have to do this in the future: http://www.ktm-parts.com/RDFJ2.html#.UectqBY-I70

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Old 07-17-2013, 09:45 PM   #13
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Just a thought

Make sure your throttle cable are not hanging up. Happened to me once.
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Old 07-18-2013, 06:14 AM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fundy Rider View Post
The tool from Motion Pro was too long and then tried to make a tool but couldn't really see what I was doing and finally came to the conclusion I am going to have to take the carbs off to do this properly.

My apologies for the tool not working. I know mine is a real tight fit but it's a few years old,,, maybe MP changed them.
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Old 07-18-2013, 10:21 AM   #15
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My apologies for the tool not working. I know mine is a real tight fit but it's a few years old,,, maybe MP changed them.
No problem. A honest mistake.

Would the tps have to be set after things are sorted out again and if so how do you manage to get the voltmeter prongs up in the connector.

It was set at the service but after messing with it I wonder if it will be out again.
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