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Old 08-22-2013, 04:45 AM   #76
Boondox
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So less money is the fix, that should be easy.....
Less greed is the answer, which won't be easy at all.
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Old 08-22-2013, 06:19 AM   #77
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Why can't the US set up health care insurance like auto, life, and home owners insurance. Letting people shop around, should force some cost cutting.
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Old 08-22-2013, 07:01 AM   #78
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Just stinks that good ol' Government is going to tie health care into the tax records, on the premise that they'll be able to extract monies for health care through tax returns if needed. Given what the IRS has proved recently on the Tea-Party groups actions, I'm sure the IRS will be very interested in your health care needs too.

Or how about the new taxes for health care tied into the sale of your home (if over a certain dollar value). If you sell a home worth over a certin amount there is a percentage TAX applied taken out of your gains to go to health care.

I agree that everyone has a right to affordable health care, like the right to basics of clean water, etc. But as usual big ol' government will find a way to needle into our personal lives again.
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Old 08-22-2013, 07:09 AM   #79
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I agree that everyone has a right to affordable health care
There is no right to health care!!!!!
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Old 08-22-2013, 07:24 AM   #80
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There is no right to health care!!!!!


Jim
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Old 08-22-2013, 11:51 AM   #81
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Honestly, it isn't the fact that the health insurance is requiring it that bugs me, it is the fact that you don't have a real choice in your health insurance as your employer picks it.

One of the best things we can do is to decouple the choice from your employer and give it to the employee.
People that still get health insurance from their employers are lucky.

Part of what made that overall a good thing was that employers were able to negotiate cheap (or cheaper) rates for employees as a group than employees could get on their own. Employers have been cutting back since long before the ACA was passed, though.

From the perspective of insurance companies - they're in the game to make money. Period. If they can restrict high risk activities, they will, as anything that cuts down on payouts is more money.

Perhaps if insurance wasn't oriented around profit it would work differently, but that's how it is.
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Old 08-22-2013, 12:21 PM   #82
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I am not saying it would make things cheaper. Going through the employer's choice would most likely be the cheapest route being that they can likely use number to bring the priemiums down. My suggestion would be to just make more choices acalaible.
So you say that you don't care to pay $$$ more to choose the ins.co without this requierement so you don't have to spend $$$ on gear in return?


Well...if you so want to play the "freedom of choice" card to the bitter end, why don't you just choose your own insurer without waiting for your employer's contribution? You're free to pay 5x more after all.
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Old 08-22-2013, 02:25 PM   #83
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Originally Posted by ph0rk View Post
People that still get health insurance from their employers are lucky.

Part of what made that overall a good thing was that employers were able to negotiate cheap (or cheaper) rates for employees as a group than employees could get on their own. Employers have been cutting back since long before the ACA was passed, though.

From the perspective of insurance companies - they're in the game to make money. Period. If they can restrict high risk activities, they will, as anything that cuts down on payouts is more money.

Perhaps if insurance wasn't oriented around profit it would work differently, but that's how it is.
I didn't argue against that. After all I stated quite clearly that employers still keep the benefit. If one chooses to go another route, paying more or getting less is the risk they take on.

Quote:
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So you say that you don't care to pay $$$ more to choose the ins.co without this requierement so you don't have to spend $$$ on gear in return?


Well...if you so want to play the "freedom of choice" card to the bitter end, why don't you just choose your own insurer without waiting for your employer's contribution? You're free to pay 5x more after all.
I am ATGAT, so its not like it will be a reason for me to want to go else where because of a rule like. But the question comes, if your health insurance says that you can't ride a motorcycle, what are you going to do? Do you believe that if they are successful in reducing payout with this that it will stop there?

My suggestion just makes the ability easier, but certainly not with out loosing something. Most likely if my health insurance does something I am totally against, I will leave my company for another one along with a good number of others.
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Old 08-25-2013, 12:27 PM   #84
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So you say that you don't care to pay $$$ more to choose the ins.co without this requierement so you don't have to spend $$$ on gear in return?
Some employment-sourced health plans completely exclude motorcycle injuries.
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Old 08-25-2013, 12:29 PM   #85
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There is no right to health care!!!!!
There is no CONSTITUTIONAL right to health care. But some basic level of care ought to be a statutory right. But you've got your so you don't care?
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Old 08-25-2013, 04:23 PM   #86
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Originally Posted by viverrid View Post
Some employment-sourced health plans completely exclude motorcycle injuries.
A completely different story then.


Requirements and exclusions are really different.
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Old 08-25-2013, 08:04 PM   #87
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There is no CONSTITUTIONAL right to health care. But some basic level of care ought to be a statutory right.
Why?

Basic sustenance isn't.
Basic raiment isn't
Basic habitation isn't,
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Old 08-25-2013, 08:08 PM   #88
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A completely different story then.

Requirements and exclusions are really different.
Okay, I'll explain it to you again!

OP's employment-sourced insurance EXCLUDES motorcycle injuries that occur when not wearing minimum gear.

Neither the insurer nor the employer REQUIRE protective gear to be worn, they don't employ gear police to wait outside your house and follow you down the road.

They just EXCLUDE you from coverage if you are injured when not wearing it. OP is free not to wear any gear. He's just EXCLUDED from coverage.
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Old 08-25-2013, 08:15 PM   #89
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Why?

Basic sustenance isn't.
Basic raiment isn't
Basic habitation isn't,
You're wrong, our society has chosen to create a statutory right to food, that's why there are "food stamps".

We also supply public housing and homeless shelters.

Clothing would be part of "welfare", which indigent people have statutory rights to.

The poorest already have a statutory right to care under Medicaid. It's the rest of the folks who can't afford it, the working poor, the unemployed with too many assets to qualify for Medicaid, folks like that, who I worry about.

I've got mine, heck, I'm richer than 95% of the people of the US are. My opinion is that we should extend these statutory rights to include basic health care for everyone, because it is the humane & civilized thing to do. That's why. Not because of what a roomful of White land owners decided back in colonial times, not because of anything that your god says. But because it would be the right thing to do.
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Old 08-26-2013, 03:22 AM   #90
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Please define, basic health care? What type of care should and should not be covered?

I have always made sure I had health care coverage, I have turned down higher paying jobs because out lack of good health insurance.
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