ADVrider

Go Back   ADVrider > Riding > The perfect line and other riding myths
User Name
Password
Register Inmates Photos Site Rules Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Old 08-29-2013, 07:51 AM   #16
390beretta
Beastly Adventurer
 
Joined: Oct 2009
Oddometer: 1,031
The one about leaving an escape route ie: stopping to the left or right side of a lane when at a stop light in case someone fails to stop behind you is one that I always do. However, I see so many riders who don't. They also put their bikes in neutral frequently while stopped, also negating their ability to maneuver. And very few watch their mirrors at a light. I'm never comfortable unless I have one or two vehicles who've stopped successfully behind me. Excellent article, however I have no idea what caused the 75 mph crash shown in the video. Anybody know?
__________________
I came into this world kicking, crying and covered in someone else's blood. I have no problem leaving the same way.
390beretta is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-29-2013, 09:14 AM   #17
orangebear
Beastly Adventurer
 
orangebear's Avatar
 
Joined: Aug 2010
Location: dumfrie scotland
Oddometer: 1,210
Quote:
Originally Posted by 390beretta View Post
The one about leaving an escape route ie: stopping to the left or right side of a lane when at a stop light in case someone fails to stop behind you is one that I always do. However, I see so many riders who don't. They also put their bikes in neutral frequently while stopped, also negating their ability to maneuver. And very few watch their mirrors at a light. I'm never comfortable unless I have one or two vehicles who've stopped successfully behind me. Excellent article, however I have no idea what caused the 75 mph crash shown in the video. Anybody know?

I was told to put the bike in to neutral in case you get rear ended while stop at a my at a red light. On my advance riding class. As on some roads there will be pavement to your left and oncoming cars to your right so there will be no place to go.
__________________
bmw r100gs i ride it all year round
bmw r100/7 x2 sold
road legal stomp pitbike sold
Klr650c the 1 I should not of wasted my money on
Honda xl125rc powered by a cg125 block fun wee bike
orangebear is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-29-2013, 09:21 AM   #18
KX50002
NooB, my ass
 
KX50002's Avatar
 
Joined: Mar 2012
Location: NEPA
Oddometer: 1,616
Quote:
Originally Posted by Red9 View Post
lol forget about it...
I guess that pretty much answered your question HUH??

__________________
SOTGMOTT Some Of The Gear Most Of The Time
KX50002 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-29-2013, 09:26 AM   #19
dwoodward
Beastly Adventurer
 
dwoodward's Avatar
 
Joined: Dec 2005
Location: Pacific NorthWet, Napa Valley North
Oddometer: 4,871
Dunno where that's from. Dunno if they're using recent numbers, or still re-hashing 30+ year old (Los Angeles centric- read large urban area) Hurt Study findings. Here's some fresh data from somewhere else (Oregon):



Single Vehicle- Motorcycle only. Hard to blame that on left-turning cars.

MC vs. Auto- That's the rider hitting a car, through no fault of the car. Typically, rear-end collision or hit oncoming car while trying to pass another, or ran wide in turn and hit oncoming car. Or- to show that "left turning car" doesn't always mean what you think it means- they're passing a car that slowed down and started a left turn into a side road. Guess what- that's not the driver's fault.

Auto vs. MC- OK, that one's their fault... but only about one in five.

More than 3/4 of motorcycle fatalities are the rider's own damn fault.

Alcohol is 33%-50% still. Slightly better than it used to be, but still a big problem.

Another notion from the Hurt Report is that "weather is not a significant factor". Um. The study was done where again?

Not to knock the Hurt Report, but it raised a lot of questions that still haven't been answered.

dwoodward screwed with this post 08-29-2013 at 09:51 AM Reason: more "or"
dwoodward is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-29-2013, 09:50 AM   #20
dwoodward
Beastly Adventurer
 
dwoodward's Avatar
 
Joined: Dec 2005
Location: Pacific NorthWet, Napa Valley North
Oddometer: 4,871
Quote:
Originally Posted by gravityisnotmyfriend View Post
The "gravel on the road" video looked more like a locked up front wheel to me. You can see his brake light come on and stay on through the corner. Looks to me like he was coming in too hot and on the brakes. Grabbed a little too much and slid the front wheel.
Wasn't too hot. Did apex a LOT early. Saw gravel, panicked and grabbed brakes, which turned a scary slide into a painful memory. (I'd say "lesson", but that would imply he learned any of "look further ahead", "apex later" or "don't grab brakes on gravel")

Quote:
Originally Posted by 390beretta View Post
however I have no idea what caused the 75 mph crash shown in the video. Anybody know?
Looks like he just grabbed a handful. Weight transfer for maximum braking isn't instantaneous.
dwoodward is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-29-2013, 10:20 AM   #21
Aj Mick
Studly Adventurer
 
Aj Mick's Avatar
 
Joined: Aug 2012
Location: Phuket, Thailand
Oddometer: 519
Quote:
Originally Posted by dwoodward View Post
Dunno where that's from. Dunno if they're using recent numbers, or still re-hashing 30+ year old (Los Angeles centric- read large urban area) Hurt Study findings. Here's some fresh data from somewhere else (Oregon):



Single Vehicle- Motorcycle only. Hard to blame that on left-turning cars.

MC vs. Auto- That's the rider hitting a car, through no fault of the car. Typically, rear-end collision or hit oncoming car while trying to pass another, or ran wide in turn and hit oncoming car. Or- to show that "left turning car" doesn't always mean what you think it means- they're passing a car that slowed down and started a left turn into a side road. Guess what- that's not the driver's fault.

Auto vs. MC- OK, that one's their fault... but only about one in five.

More than 3/4 of motorcycle fatalities are the rider's own damn fault.

Alcohol is 33%-50% still. Slightly better than it used to be, but still a big problem.

Another notion from the Hurt Report is that "weather is not a significant factor". Um. The study was done where again?

Not to knock the Hurt Report, but it raised a lot of questions that still haven't been answered.
Thanks for this..... I have always had a hunch that the most common cause of motorcycle accidents is the riders not being aware of what is going on around them and/so not riding to the conditions.

Out on the mean streets you may encounter some crazy beaviour, and people may want to invade "your" space. But in the end, the buck stops with you, the rider.
__________________
there are old motorcyclists and bold motorcyclists
but you seldom meet an old, bold motorcyclist

Aj Mick screwed with this post 08-29-2013 at 08:57 PM Reason: tidy up a typo
Aj Mick is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-29-2013, 10:44 AM   #22
SgtDuster
Beastly Adventurer
 
SgtDuster's Avatar
 
Joined: Feb 2010
Oddometer: 2,992
Quote:
Originally Posted by KX50002 View Post
I guess that pretty much answered your question HUH??

Don't waste your time feeding a troll.
__________________
2010 Buell Ulysses
1984 Suzuki GR650 "Tempter"
SgtDuster is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-29-2013, 12:25 PM   #23
viverrid
not dead yet
 
Joined: Jan 2004
Location: Western Mass
Oddometer: 30,482
Shorten to this:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Aj Mick View Post
..... I have always had a hunch that the most common cause of motorcycle accidents is the riders.
__________________
Advanced pancreatic cancer found 04/2010. Have outlived +/- 97% of patients with this diagnosis, but 08/2013 cancer now in liver, vascular system and lungs with 20+ lung tumors. Sick/weak sometimes, not riding much. No more treatments & now under Hospice care.
viverrid is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-29-2013, 01:04 PM   #24
KX50002
NooB, my ass
 
KX50002's Avatar
 
Joined: Mar 2012
Location: NEPA
Oddometer: 1,616
Quote:
Originally Posted by SgtDuster View Post
Don't waste your time feeding a troll.
Trolls need to eat too

Single vehicle motorcycle accidents? Don't these guys know... Always tell the cop a dog ran out in front of you!!
__________________
SOTGMOTT Some Of The Gear Most Of The Time
KX50002 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-29-2013, 04:51 PM   #25
Aj Mick
Studly Adventurer
 
Aj Mick's Avatar
 
Joined: Aug 2012
Location: Phuket, Thailand
Oddometer: 519
Quote:
Originally Posted by viverrid View Post
Shorten to this:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Aj Mick View Post
I have always had a hunch that the most common cause of motorcycle accidents is the riders
Agree
__________________
there are old motorcyclists and bold motorcyclists
but you seldom meet an old, bold motorcyclist
Aj Mick is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-29-2013, 05:14 PM   #26
Barnone
Beastly Adventurer
 
Barnone's Avatar
 
Joined: Mar 2007
Location: WNC SWFL
Oddometer: 3,793
Quote:
Originally Posted by Aj Mick View Post
Thanks for this..... I have always had a hunch that the most common cause of motorcycle accidents is the riders not being aware of what is going on around them and/so not riding to the conditions.

Out on the mean streets you may encounter some crazy beaviour, and people may want to invade "your" space. But in the end, the buck stope with you, the rider.
Does seem to me that most of the crashes around here in WNC are single bike.
__________________
Vince @ SWFL or WNC 2001 Kawasaki W650
2012 Dong Fang DF250RTB hard tail bobber
2014 Sky Team ST125-8A Z50 clone monkey bike
2014 Ice Bear PBZ110-1P Z50 clone monkey sidecar
2014 Sky Team MC-D34 CT70 clone
Barnone is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 08-29-2013, 05:32 PM   #27
henshao
Bained
 
henshao's Avatar
 
Joined: Jun 2013
Location: The Commonwealth
Oddometer: 547
they should have greatly expanded on the braking crash at 75mph. Do not use four fingers worth of brakes on a modern sportbike! Start with one finger and then two if you are finding one to be insufficient. Dual six pot calipers on that front wheel means a fuckton of braking power for very little effort.
henshao is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-29-2013, 06:42 PM   #28
khager
Studly Adventurer
 
Joined: Sep 2007
Location: Granbury, TX
Oddometer: 781
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vertical C View Post
, braking the front widens the line not the other way round?

Why use brakes to steer anyway that is the most stupidist thing I have read. You steer using handlebar input.

Well decreasing speed (more brake) = tighter turning radius right?

Just like more throttle increases it.
khager is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-29-2013, 07:05 PM   #29
slartidbartfast
Love those blue pipes
 
slartidbartfast's Avatar
 
Joined: Dec 2003
Location: Southern Louisiana or Southern England or ...
Oddometer: 4,791
Quote:
Originally Posted by dwoodward View Post
Dunno where that's from. Dunno if they're using recent numbers, or still re-hashing 30+ year old (Los Angeles centric- read large urban area) Hurt Study findings. Here's some fresh data from somewhere else (Oregon):



Single Vehicle- Motorcycle only. Hard to blame that on left-turning cars.

MC vs. Auto- That's the rider hitting a car, through no fault of the car. Typically, rear-end collision or hit oncoming car while trying to pass another, or ran wide in turn and hit oncoming car. Or- to show that "left turning car" doesn't always mean what you think it means- they're passing a car that slowed down and started a left turn into a side road. Guess what- that's not the driver's fault.

Auto vs. MC- OK, that one's their fault... but only about one in five.

More than 3/4 of motorcycle fatalities are the rider's own damn fault.

Alcohol is 33%-50% still. Slightly better than it used to be, but still a big problem.

Another notion from the Hurt Report is that "weather is not a significant factor". Um. The study was done where again?

Not to knock the Hurt Report, but it raised a lot of questions that still haven't been answered.
Good info. Thanks!
__________________
MSF Ridercoach IBA: 35353 95 R1100GSA, 93 GTS1000, 85 R80RT, 93 DR350/435, 99 RX125, 78 DT100
January 2010 New Zealand South Island ride
Summer 2009 UK to Alps ride
Summer 2008 UK End-to-End ride
slartidbartfast is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-29-2013, 08:25 PM   #30
DAKEZ
Beastly Adventurer
 
DAKEZ's Avatar
 
Joined: Mar 2007
Location: OR
Oddometer: 19,528
This is SHIT advice.

"A Car Turns Left In Front Of You
The most common motorcycle accident. A car fails to see you or judges your speed incorrectly, turning in front of you at an intersection. Blame inattention, distraction, blind spots and even psychology; a driver looking for cars perceives merely an absence of cars, not the presence of a motorcycle.

How To Avoid It: Simple, you just need to see it coming. Part of your job as a motorcyclist is to develop a precognitive sixth sense. Look for signs that could indicate someone may turn in front of you: a car is at an intersection waiting to turn, there’s a gap in traffic near an intersection, driveway or parking lot. In either situation, slow down, cover your brakes and get ready to take evasive action. Yes, you do need to take something as innocuous as a car waiting in a turn lane as a major and immediate threat to your life. You also need to account for objects outside of your vision. Gaps in traffic indicate the possibility of someone coming through that gap, even if you can’t see them. Again, MAJOR THREAT, PREPARE FOR EVASIVE ACTION.

And once you’ve identified said threat, you can work it through levels of severity. Is the driver clearly able to see you, without obstruction from their window pillars, trees or signs? Is that person actually looking? Are they looking at you? How are they situated in the road? What is their speed? Where are their wheels pointing?

Look at their wheels, not the car, they’ll give you the first clue of movement. During all this, also be aware of what’s behind and to your side. Should you need to take evasive action, you’ll need to know your routes of escape. It’s no good braking in time to avoid a turning car, only to be swatted from behind by a tailgating SUV. What’s the road surface like? Is it going to be able to handle the full force of your brakes or are you going to lock them? You do know how to use the full ability of your brakes, right?"






It doesn't matter if the car is at fault 84% of the time. IT is the RIDERS responsibility to cater to how human vision works!

Any rider that rides straight down the road is NOT catering to how HUMANS see things and is ASKING for a collision!


You want to be seen. Lateral Motion is THE BEST WAY to be seen.


__________________
“Watch out for everything bigger than you, they have the "right of weight"
Bib
DAKEZ is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Share

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

.
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On

Forum Jump


Times are GMT -7.   It's 10:33 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.5
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright ADVrider 2011-2014