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Old 09-05-2013, 04:31 AM   #16
StevenD
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Air impact wrench and no lock is safe to take it off as that takes a lot more than 140nm. On with 140 should be no issue.
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Old 09-05-2013, 06:03 AM   #17
mbrick
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Originally Posted by imeny View Post
I also want to remove the alternator nut, but afraid to broke the TDC bolt that locking the crank. The is a way to approve that the 140 NM force that you apply on the nut won't break the TDC bolt?
I agree, the TDC lock bolt is probably not a great idea to hold it while loosening that nut.

I would suggest putting the bike in gear and using the rear brake to hold it. Then use an impact wrench.

I've also stuffed a rag between the main gear and clutch basket gear to lock the crank and use a big breaker bar. Both have worked.
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Old 09-05-2013, 06:16 AM   #18
Homerb
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Originally Posted by mbrick View Post
I agree, the TDC lock bolt is probably not a great idea to hold it while loosening that nut.

I would suggest putting the bike in gear and using the rear brake to hold it. Then use an impact wrench.

I've also stuffed a rag between the main gear and clutch basket gear to lock the crank and use a big breaker bar. Both have worked.
Ive got a jar of old pennys l use to lock up the gears on my honda. Theyre soft enough not to damage the gears. And be careful not to lose the woodruff key between the flywheel and crankshaft. The little buggers have a habit of dissapearing when you get to reassembly.
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Old 09-05-2013, 07:11 AM   #19
Kawidad
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I'm in too.
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Old 09-05-2013, 07:38 AM   #20
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Laugh Rags and Pennies

This is proper Heath Robinson.

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Old 09-05-2013, 07:04 PM   #21
tele-steve OP
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Quote:
Originally Posted by imeny View Post
Hi mate.

I also want to remove the alternator nut, but afraid to broke the TDC bolt that locking the crank. The is a way to approve that the 140 NM force that you apply on the nut won't break the TDC bolt?
I was following along with the Haynes manual on this one. They use the BMW TDC bolt to lock the crank and then take off the bolt. I made sure to buy the strongest bolt I could (grade 8 or something).
The first and best option would be to leave the rear swing arm, tire, and chain in place and use the method described above where you leave the bike in gear, have someone hold down the rear brake pedal to keep the engine from rotating over and then use a breaker bar to spin off the nut. I did not have that option because I lost my counter sprocket splines and had no way of stopping the motor from rotating.
The sequencing of the steps to dismantle the engine can vary in these first steps. It is easiest to get the clutch basket nut and the alternator nut off while the engine is still in the bike so you can use the weight and leverage of the bike to your advantage. Once this is done, you can then drop the engine.
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Old 09-06-2013, 02:26 AM   #22
imeny
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Thank you guys for the answers
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Old 09-08-2013, 07:41 PM   #23
tele-steve OP
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Moving forward

The bike is further apart than when I left all of you because I left my camera at the office and was impatient this weekend.
So... I got the clutch basket holder on Friday.



It was about $28 on line. A quick adjustment and I was able to grab the basket. I placed a 27mm socket on the retaining nut and with some effort, spun the nut off. I'm sure a basket of pennies or rags would do the trick, but for $28 I was willing to use the right tool and not F-up anything in the process.

Inspecting the clutch basket, I discovered something that I was hoping to find. When I first changed the oil after buying the bike (used), I found a small sliver of a spring attached to the magnetic end of the oil plug. I freaked out a bit because I had just purchase the thing and was thinking my motor was going to explode any minute. I took it to the dealer to have them look it over and they could not figure out where it could have come from. I crossed my fingers at that point and just tried to ignore it. Now with taking the engine out of the bike and cracking the case, I was hoping to find the source of the broken spring.
And low and behold... it was in the clutch basket.



It looks like it was a bad cast and there was just enough pressure on the end of the spring to snap it off. Here is what they should look like.



There is no real way to get to these springs as they are riveted into the clutch basket housing. So, I'm going to just be happy that I know where it came from.

With the clutch out, I started to remove the bolts that hold the left case cover on to gain access to the timing chain, etc. Well, it turns out that there are two bolts that you can't get too unless you remove the engine from the bike because they are covered by the frame.

I was at Napa Auto Parts earlier in the week and they had the deep 8mm hex socket I was looking for.



This well endowed socket gave me access to the lower engine mount bolts I was not able to get too earlier. I took out both lower bolts leaving the upper engine bolts (the one's on either side of the head) in place. I placed my jack under the engine to give it support while I released the two final upper bolts.
Now, the left side bolt is just another hex socket, so that was not a problem, but the right side has the dreaded castle nut. Not wanting to buy a $100 peg spanner from BMW, I took the route others had done and modified a deep socket to fit (in this case a 3/4). A quick tooling with an angle grinder and a file produced this.


It worked perfectly, but what I realized after I got the engine out was that it was completely unnecessary to do this part! YOU DON'T HAVE TO TAKE THE CASTLE NUT OUT TO REMOVE THE ENGINE. It is only used to adjust the play between the engine housing and frame. You only need to remove the two hex bolts on either side of the head to get the engine out of the frame. Trust me on this. The castle nut screws onto the other side of this thing.

Once you have the hex bolt out, the engine should slip down past this point.

Anyways, with all of the bolts out of the frame, I started to lower the engine, but it was not drop down. It was stuck on the upper rear frame bolt location. I looked at the micro fiche to see if I was missing something, but could not see anything obvious.
I poked around the frame with a screwdriver, hit it with a plastic hammer, etc., but it would not budge. On closer inspection I could see a small shaft/sleeve between the engine and lower frame. Reluctantly, I realized that I now had to remove the cast exterior lower frame elements to get the engine out. I jacked up what was left of the bike to slacken my hanging straps, moved them up the frame, and took off the lower frame elements.
Here is the lower frame element with the short sleeve from the engine that does not allow you to drop the engine without COMPLETELY dismantling the bike.


Sleeve on the engine case that keeps you from lowering the engine without taking the frame apart.



So now, the bike it pretty much completely taken apart.











For the electrical connections, I started placing labels with tape so I remember where they plug into.



The bike itself is a little intimidating to work on, but I'm feeling more and more comfortable with it. It is beautifully engineered, but my god, they completely reinvented every damn thing about a dirt bike frame. No wonder they could not afford to keep producing these things.

I've got an extended shopping list of bits and pieces I'll need for the replacement of the output shaft (gaskets, seals, etc.). I plan on placing the order this week, but don't expect the parts to come in very fast as I can't imagine many output shafts sitting around on shelves waiting to be placed into one of these bike.
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Old 09-09-2013, 04:21 AM   #24
Niedz
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great thread, i feel like i'll be prepared for when my shift shaft breaks off!
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Old 09-09-2013, 10:26 AM   #25
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Originally Posted by tele-steve View Post
It is beautifully engineered, but my god, they completely reinvented every damn thing about a dirt bike frame. No wonder they could not afford to keep producing these things.
Can you give me a little more details?
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Old 09-09-2013, 11:49 PM   #26
tele-steve OP
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complexity and order

Quote:
Originally Posted by Johnnyboxer View Post
Can you give me a little more details?
  • Start with the offset swing arm mounts; one is threaded, the other is not.
  • The 'frame' is actually made up of 5 distinct parts consisting of 3 types of construction: cast aluminum (lower main frame), extruded and welded aluminum (upper main frame), front lower sub-frame (aluminum tube, bend and welded), rear shock mount (cast aluminum).
  • The rear lower main frame components are really complex and asymmetrical right to left to compensate for the location of the output shaft. and is why the swing arm has to mount the way it does (I'll take more detailed photos as I get further along).
  • You have to take apart all of these elements apart to remove the engine using a pretty good spread of tools.
It is a complete mess of parts that when looked at individually has no resemblance to being connected to or part of a motorcycle, yet when they are all combined and connected it makes for one of the best adventure touring bikes ever made.
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Old 09-10-2013, 12:11 AM   #27
Johnnyboxer
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tele-steve View Post
  • Start with the offset swing arm mounts; one is threaded, the other is not.
  • The 'frame' is actually made up of 5 distinct parts consisting of 3 types of construction: cast aluminum (lower main frame), extruded and welded aluminum (upper main frame), front lower sub-frame (aluminum tube, bend and welded), rear shock mount (cast aluminum).
  • The rear lower main frame components are really complex and asymmetrical right to left to compensate for the location of the output shaft. and is why the swing arm has to mount the way it does (I'll take more detailed photos as I get further along).
  • You have to take apart all of these elements apart to remove the engine using a pretty good spread of tools.
It is a complete mess of parts that when looked at individually has no resemblance to being connected to or part of a motorcycle, yet when they are all combined and connected it makes for one of the best adventure touring bikes ever made.
Thanks for the insight, never had one apart

Seems like they built a pretty good frame around the Rotax motor
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Old 09-10-2013, 05:31 AM   #28
Niedz
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yes when i serviced my rear swing arm bearings i was pretty blown away at the pivot construction. unusual but effective (i suppose).
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Old 09-15-2013, 05:43 PM   #29
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I am somebody that swore I would never consider a BMW because they are too heavy, too complicated and break too much. This thread and this bike has me simultaneously convinced of how right and wrong I am. The engine in that xchallenge will do 100k miles before a rebuild (only dual sport single that WILL do it with decent maintenance), its lighter than my DR, it makes good power and Colebatch has proven it will run on shit gas. I agree it has to be one of the best adventure touring dirt bikes ever made, and it is no doubt in my mind the most underrated BMW adventure machine ever made. But god does it look complicated..

I really would like to know- why do you think the shaft shit itself as it did? I dont really understand what would cause that. Just a defective one that wasnt hardened properly from the factory?

I ask because I am honestly considering purchasing one for a RTW mount. I cant believe im saying that

Subscribed and look forward to seeing the internals
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Old 09-15-2013, 05:50 PM   #30
tbarstow
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Originally Posted by GSF1200S View Post

I really would like to know- why do you think the shaft shit itself as it did? I dont really understand what would cause that. Just a defective one that wasnt hardened properly from the factory?
I think it is because the shaft isn't heat treated correctly, or the sprocket guys are hardening the wholes sprocket instead of just the teeth for the chain. I've had two of them do this now, and the second one has only seen BMW sprockets.
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