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Old 09-11-2013, 10:28 AM   #1
unclerichie OP
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Hard starting 1150 Adventure

My 04 Adventure (newish to me this summer) has been tougher to start lately. I bought it this spring and it has always taken a few seconds to fire but it's gotten worse.
I have to hold the starter for a total of 10 to 20 seconds to get it to catch. I try to do it 3-4 secs at a time to avoid cooking the starter.
-I put in a new oddysey battery in June so that shouldn't be the issue
-When I turn the key I hear the fuel pump kick on and it runs/idles normally after it starts so I don't think the fuel pump is the issue.
-I pulled the tank and replaced the fuel filter a few days ago thinking maybe the old one was getting clogged up. Didn't really help.
-I replaced the spark plugs when I did the fuel filter. The old ones didn't look too bad but the lower two were a little wet.
-I pulled off the starter and tore it apart. Everything looked OK so I cleaned and lubed and put it back together.
-Throttle body cables look fine and are seated correctly.

When I push the button the starter sounds like it is doing its job and turning the motor over. No weird noises or smells. The motor is just turning over though, it isn't struggling to start then dying. When finally starts it seems like it finally gets fuel to the plugs and it fires right up. It feels like it isn't getting fuel and then eventually fuel works its way to the engine and off we go like normal. It doesn't idle poorly, it doesn't surge/hesitate, it runs like normal once it is going.
If I try to start it right after I shut it off it will fire right up but if I let it sit for a few hrs we're back at square one. Fwiw the bike only has about 21,000 miles on it.
Any ideas from you wise men of the GSpot?

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Old 09-11-2013, 10:38 AM   #2
turbojugend208
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when is the last time the valves were set and throttle bodies synced?
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Old 09-11-2013, 10:40 AM   #3
pbrokaw
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Uncle:

Does it start any quicker with a little throttle??? The "choke" lever is actully a fast idle advance,nothing more.

i had noticed my RT would take longer in the crank cycle to fire off. A valve adjust and TB sync helped quicken the fire off.

OR
Perhaps your fuel pump or regulator is getting a little weak????

Perry
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Old 09-11-2013, 11:12 AM   #4
unclerichie OP
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Valves were done by me about 2k ago. If I remember correctly they were all pretty good except one exhaust valve was looser than I like.
Throttle body sync was supposedly done last summer but I haven't done it myself yet. I have a twinmax but I've never used it. I need to read up on the tb sync. It runs very smoothly so I figured they were good.
I usually start it with the "choke" lever pulled up. In between cranks on the starter I usually roll on the throttle a bit in an attempt to get fuel moving (if that is the issue).
What would it feel like if the fuel pump was going? Would it run rough at other times or just at start up?


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Old 09-11-2013, 11:57 AM   #5
roger 04 rt
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Sounds very similar to what I've got going: Slow Starting R1150.

I'm going to take a good look at the HES when I get back from some travel I'm in the middle of.

Slow start in the am they easy after the first time.
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Old 09-11-2013, 01:12 PM   #6
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Roger, I just read your thread. The problems do sound similar. I don't have to wait until morning, though, I get it when I leave work after 8hrs. It definitely is worse in the morning.
Keep me posted if you figure it out. My 02 1150gs fired right up every time. I don't think that our symptoms are "normal" oil head quirks. I once had to turn mine over for 45 secs before ignition!

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Old 09-21-2013, 04:17 AM   #7
shuby
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You guys should have a look at the starter. I just had a similar problem. It is a known fault, that when you try to start and the clock resets to zero, the starter is shortening out and therefore drawing too much power.

On mine it was somewhere in between. Not enough draw to reset the clock, but enough draw to kill the spark.

Kind regards
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Old 09-21-2013, 04:27 AM   #8
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Did you replace the rubber line between the pump and filter? The hose is resistant to fuel, but does eventually degrade and blocks flow.
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Old 09-21-2013, 05:42 AM   #9
unclerichie OP
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I haven't replaced the rubber line between the filter and pump. It looked like it was in decent shape when I had it apart but it might be worth a try.
I've been turning to key on and off 3 or 4 times before I start it to prime fuel pump a few times and the bike starts a lot better. Does that mean there's an issue with the pump?
I'm also in the middle of running a can of seafoam through a tank of gas to try to clean up the injectors a bit.

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Old 09-21-2013, 06:01 AM   #10
lumpy749
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starter

Thats interesting shuby. My 04 1150GSA has been in my care for 3 and 1/2 years and has 52k on the clock. Twice in the time I have owned it I felt like it had a flat battery. One of those times I had to jump start it. But then it is fine and starts right up no problem. Battery load tests ok. Spooky thing is the clock intermitantly resets itself. Has done it quite a few times just sitting in the shed and both times when it sounded like the battery was struggling to start.
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Old 09-21-2013, 08:16 AM   #11
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An 04 bike means you have a twin spark engine.

Are your main coil sticks working ? A very common part to fail.

To check pull off the HT leads on the lower plugs and see if the bike runs on just the main plugs which use coil sticks.
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Old 09-21-2013, 11:47 AM   #12
def
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Quote:
Originally Posted by roger 04 rt View Post
Sounds very similar to what I've got going: Slow Starting R1150.

I'm going to take a good look at the HES when I get back from some travel I'm in the middle of.

Slow start in the am they easy after the first time.
I seem to have a similar situation however, not as pronounced as yours. Mine is more; er..er..er..chug. Er..er..er..chug..chug..idle. After the first cold start, subsequent starts are; er..er..idle...sometimes if hot; ping (like someone hit the piston with a metal hammer)..er..idle.

If all else is in spec, I would send the FIs out for a cleaning, leakage and flow test. Of course, my '01 GS is OE Motronic, OE fuel pressure and OE lambda sensor and I use Mob1 15w-50.

Following this with interest....
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Old 09-23-2013, 06:02 AM   #13
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My bike is the twin spark so I probably have a different problem. The simplest way to explain my situation is that the bike runs great and starts easily except first time. Since I have the LC-1 and GS-911, I can see three things:
1. The sensors all seem to be giving the Motronic the inputs expected.
2. The LC-1 was showing very lean combustion for the first 20 sec.
3. For about 20 sec. The spark advance hangs a zero degrees. Then it goes to about 6 degrees. Then things are fine. I believe the Motronic is waiting for the engine to be smooth after start to advance the spark timing.

I replaced the lower plugs and now it is only 10% leaner than normal during the start.

I've been through the fuel system, 100%. Also given the HES a careful test, rotating the engine from the front pulley. HES seems to trigger very consistently. Fuel pump turns on with each sensor, top and bottom.

The stick coils are next on my list and are now the prime suspect. I believe I had a fouled lower plug. And now with the lower (and then upper) plugs replaced the lower plugs are helping hide a weak stick coil.

Each stick coil will fire a 3/16" gap but when idling. Pulling the low voltage connector seems to affect one side more than the other. Also, over the past year I've had to reseat the low voltage connector on the left twice to get smooth idle (early warning on the stick?). The stick coils "look" fine.

I will try starting today with the lower plugs disabled and see if it will start on the uppers.
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Old 09-23-2013, 03:44 PM   #14
puncar thogoole
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lumpy749 View Post
Thats interesting shuby. My 04 1150GSA has been in my care for 3 and 1/2 years and has 52k on the clock. Twice in the time I have owned it I felt like it had a flat battery. One of those times I had to jump start it. But then it is fine and starts right up no problem. Battery load tests ok. Spooky thing is the clock intermitantly resets itself. Has done it quite a few times just sitting in the shed and both times when it sounded like the battery was struggling to start.
My 03 had exactly the same thing, it was the flat metal seal in the starter motor that keeps the grease in the planetary gears, this had moved and sometimes would touch the windings of the motor dead shorting them, that's when the clock goes to zero.

I stripped the motor (needed to drill some rivets out if I remember correctly) & fixed it securely back in place, 5 years later no problems.



The grease shield with clear signs of arcing against the armature windings.




Possibly your problem?
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Old 09-23-2013, 04:10 PM   #15
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"Pulling the low voltage connector seems to affect one side more than the other."

the one that's not affected is the one to check.... the 2nd plug isn't making any difference (because its not working right)
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