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Old 12-26-2014, 02:13 PM   #1
jconly OP
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Transmission inspection procedure?

Hey guys, wondering if anyone knows of any write-ups on removing the transmission to inspect gears? Haven't been able to find anything other than complete engine tear downs and wondering about the easiest way to go about this.

Been having some VERY hard, notchy shifts between first and second, that have only gotten worse, and the bike now likes to pop into neutral under high RPM's and downshifts, when in first or second.

Always been hard on the engine breaking, especially from 3rd to 2nd, so suspect this may be a culprit. Clutch discs are good, basket not badly notched, ramp seems within spec.

Thanks!
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Old 12-26-2014, 02:59 PM   #2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jconly View Post
Hey guys, wondering if anyone knows of any write-ups on removing the transmission to inspect gears? Haven't been able to find anything other than complete engine tear downs and wondering about the easiest way to go about this.

Thanks!

Since getting to gearbox you need to split engine so it pretty much a complete tear down you are looking at.

EDIT: What you can check quite easily is if the gear selector has any pins that have started working their way out, lay bike on left side, preferably in a way that you can still shift gears, open up oil screen cover and remove screen and you can see in and locate a round thing checked mine and one pin seemed to have moved out slightly so got a screwdriver in and hamered it a few times to stop it moving any more:



Doubt that is the problem but worth checking since it so easy.



/Johan
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Old 12-27-2014, 04:21 PM   #3
DELTATANGO
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I think auto parts stores rent little cameras that you could look up in there with.
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Old 12-28-2014, 02:12 AM   #4
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Originally Posted by DELTATANGO View Post
I think auto parts stores rent little cameras that you could look up in there with.
Have not split any LC8 engine so not entirely sure how the internals look so might be some hole you can fit an inspection camera through? Doubt you will be able to see if a shift fork is worn or slightly bend, missing cogs will be seen.

You can buy an inspection camera for not that much these days.

/Johan
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Old 12-28-2014, 03:33 AM   #5
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Plenty of things that can be checked without draining the oil by draining coolant and removing the inner clutch cover and clutch assembly.
Loose shift drum star pins as mentioned above
Loose shift drum star allen screw
Worn shift drum star
Loose rivet on sliding plate on end of shifter shaft
Loose locking lever
Collapsed bearing on locking lever
Also look up the screen hole for damage to the shift drum, the side of the roller path can beak off, but I think that affects higher gears.

Swap the waterpump seal while the cover is off

If they are all OK it's time to drain the oil and take the engine out.....
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Old 12-28-2014, 05:09 AM   #6
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Could it be as simple as a loose shift arm?

Had that happen and it felt strange a few shifts but quickly it was impossible to change, luckily I still had shifter and bolt so it was just to tighten and keep going.

Have similar problems on the 950 if being sloppy when shifting these gearboxes seems to prefer a distinct firm shift.

/Johan
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Old 12-28-2014, 07:08 AM   #7
DELTATANGO
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Make sure the clutch is working.

I would pull the right side cover off first.
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Old 12-28-2014, 01:10 PM   #8
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I think there was a thread in the basement about checking out trannies.
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Old 12-30-2014, 10:18 PM   #9
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^^^ what they said. All good ideas.

Can you repeat it on the centerstand with the engine off? Your hand can feel stuff the foot can't.

Common for the shifter to just be loose on the shaft.
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Old 03-09-2015, 04:36 PM   #10
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Thanks for the responses guys!
Sorry I'm only getting around to this now.
It's been a cold winter, but finally making it back into the garage.

Just took the bike out for a light spin today. No hard engine breaking or down shifting, but the hard clunkiness between 1st and 2nd gears is still there.

At times, it's almost as if the bike fights the shift, without additional force.
I realize 1 -> 2 is a harder shift than other gears, but it's harder than it has ever been. This is the case with fresh, warm oil and a clean jet.

Took a look through the filter slot, no pins seem out of place, but while shifting it looks like the ridges between 1-N-2 are a bit more rounded than the others. Guessing this is the shift star your mentioning. I'll inspect closer with the cover removed, but I'm assuming this would explain why sometimes I'm slipping into N under a hard downshift to 2nd @ high RPM's.

I suppose the star and the other items you've mentioned are behind the basket though. I'll need to order up the clutch holder tool to get the booster and basket off huh?

Been meaning to get a closer look at that booster, and I'm about 3k behind on checking the spec of those discs anyway.
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Old 03-10-2015, 02:38 AM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jconly View Post
I'll need to order up the clutch holder tool to get the booster and basket off huh?
NO.

High gear, luggage strap through wheel and secured around center stand mount.

Be aware nut can be really hard to get loose.

First time on 950 getting it loose I had tried impact tools, both electric and air powered (suitable for car wheels so no monster size stuff, no go).

Yes I tried heating also.

Ended up with a long pipe on hand tool and since bike was on its side I had to lay on the floor and hold my feet agains to stop entire bike spinning.

Sound was like a gunshot and I was sure the wrench snapped in half but it was the nut coming undone.

Torqued to spec with loctite after that and never any problem.

That was on an -04 950, -11 990R was no problem first time around.

Good luck

/Johan
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Old 03-10-2015, 08:39 AM   #12
gefr
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A friend's bike cannot go in 6th gear.

Is it usually difficulty to engage 6th gear a sign of problem in the shift forks or shift drum, while dificulty to switch between 1st and 2nd showing loose shift drum star pins?
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Old 03-10-2015, 09:25 AM   #13
jconly OP
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Thanks Johan, I did some more extensive searching last night, and found this technique. Also so,e other great links and photos you and others had posted. My shift star might not be as worn as I initially thought.

Gefr, I discovered those threads on 6th gear shift drum damage. Scary stuff. Fortunately no, sixth is smooth. It's an 07 990, FYI. I think they updated the drums eventually?

My main problem is that 1st and 2nd. I didn't see any pins out of place when I looked through the reservoir. We'll see what happens when I pull the cover.

I was also looking at the Factory Pro spring install instructions.
They mention removing the ignition gear (47mm nut?) to install, and lost it before removing basket. Any need to pull this first? Don't recall the service manual mentioning that for removing the booster.
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Old 03-10-2015, 12:19 PM   #14
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The booster that and inner clutch parts you can remove easily.

If you want to get the outer clutch basket out best is to line up so that the missing tooth on the igntion timing wheel (held by big nut) is towards clutch basket.

Then you need to gett bearing out, I used 2 magnets and wiggled the basket around some to get it out, that will create enough space so you can get basket out.

Take care and make sure small sprocket that sits behind clutch basket is in place when reassemble (drives oil pump).

Bad video of me removing bearing:

(embedding will not work for some reason):

http://youtu.be/-auVCjW7OcI

/Johan
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Old 03-10-2015, 01:29 PM   #15
MortimerSickle
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Someone mentioned tightening the shift lever. I thought this might be a good time to mention the following:

Quote:
From the H.O.W
Speaking of loose shift levers:
Mortimersickle: I don't know whether you have already covered this, but a couple of times now, I have seen posts on Advrider.com saying to use Loctite 648 on the little bolt that holds on the shift lever. The parts manual does specify 648 in the picture with the lever, but I believe it is an error. The list of torque specs in the service manual calls for Loctite 243 for the same bolt. I believe this is correct. Loctite 648 would probably cause the bolt to break upon removal unless first heated. Loctite's website specifies 250C heat to remove, which might be too much to use in this situation.
http://www.advrider.com/forums/showp...6&postcount=11
Maybe people should be cautioned about this probable mistake in the parts book?
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