ADVrider

Go Back   ADVrider > Riding > Ride reports
User Name
Password
Register Inmates Photos Site Rules Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Old 08-27-2005, 01:03 PM   #16
yater OP
Beastly Adventurer
 
yater's Avatar
 
Joined: Oct 2004
Location: Texas
Oddometer: 8,517
Quote:
Originally Posted by qwazimoto
Yater,real cool report man.Is there any way you could post your route.The heat has me thinking about heading out there for a while as well.
I don't think I can find my map on the net. I would try an atlas and gazateer OTHER than delorme. Basically, my trip north was divided into A)Ruidoso to Albequerque and B)Albequerque to Ojo Caliente/Taos. Try to put together a mostly gravel ride between these points and you'll recreate my route. Just remember, there is NO fuel between ruidoso and mountainair!
yater is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-27-2005, 03:03 PM   #17
slide
A nation in despair
 
Joined: Jul 2003
Location: NM, USA
Oddometer: 21,123
Yater,

Your history is a bit skewed. First, no church could be built 1300-1500 as the whites weren't around to build any churches then.

The round thing you thought was a water basin at Gran Quivera is an Indian religious construct called a kiva. Gran Quivera was abandoned due to drought and Apache raids. When it was occupied, there was a large lake NW of where you took your pix.

Much of the trade was for salt. If you went north of GC, you'd have hit the salt lakes which were mined from ancient times. Traveling salesmen from as far as the Hopi nation came to get salt and swap out their product.

Good writeup.
slide is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-27-2005, 03:19 PM   #18
yater OP
Beastly Adventurer
 
yater's Avatar
 
Joined: Oct 2004
Location: Texas
Oddometer: 8,517
Quote:
Originally Posted by slide
Yater,

Your history is a bit skewed. First, no church could be built 1300-1500 as the whites weren't around to build any churches then.

The round thing you thought was a water basin at Gran Quivera is an Indian religious construct called a kiva. Gran Quivera was abandoned due to drought and Apache raids. When it was occupied, there was a large lake NW of where you took your pix.

Much of the trade was for salt. If you went north of GC, you'd have hit the salt lakes which were mined from ancient times. Traveling salesmen from as far as the Hopi nation came to get salt and swap out their product.

Good writeup.
OOps...the second church near punta de agua would have began construction in the late 1500s. I guess I could have just looked at my pics of the sign.... The anglo-american influence wasn't present until the 1840s so christianity would have been a result of spanish influence, not "whites". Both of these churches are fanciscan missions. I said I thought the "round thing" was a grain storage...the water trap was located downhill and VERY apparent. Also, what does a kiva do? This "round thing" has a "chute" running from top to bottom and looks very similar to some of the grain storages I've encountered near cliff dwellings in canyonlands. I never pretended to know why it was abandoned but Apache raids make sense. I knew it was a trade center but wasn't sure what the product was...thanks for the history lesson

yater screwed with this post 08-27-2005 at 05:19 PM
yater is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-27-2005, 03:29 PM   #19
EricFoerster
Gnarly Adventurer
 
EricFoerster's Avatar
 
Joined: Oct 2003
Location: Jersey Village, Texas
Oddometer: 474
Quote:
Just remember, there is NO fuel between ruidoso and mountainair!
Well, there is some at one of the three or so stations in Carrizozo.

(just trying to be helpful to the travelers)
EricFoerster is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-27-2005, 03:31 PM   #20
yater OP
Beastly Adventurer
 
yater's Avatar
 
Joined: Oct 2004
Location: Texas
Oddometer: 8,517
Quote:
Originally Posted by EricFoerster
Well, there is some at one of the three or so stations in Carrizozo.

(just trying to be helpful to the travelers)
There is no dirt route through carrizozo that leads to mountainair. This was a dirtbike ride for the most part
yater is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-27-2005, 03:35 PM   #21
EricFoerster
Gnarly Adventurer
 
EricFoerster's Avatar
 
Joined: Oct 2003
Location: Jersey Village, Texas
Oddometer: 474
Just south or east of County Rd 12 or A12 or something like that there is. I was just on it a week or so ago.

Not busting the hump here, just trying to help.
EricFoerster is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-27-2005, 03:41 PM   #22
yater OP
Beastly Adventurer
 
yater's Avatar
 
Joined: Oct 2004
Location: Texas
Oddometer: 8,517
Without jumping on 380 or 54, I don't see a dirt route that heads northwest and crosses the malpais. Remember that I was trying to make it to Ojo....those roads northwest of carrizozo look like residential dead-ends to me.

Also, this guy was asking about MY route...that's why I warned him
yater is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-27-2005, 03:46 PM   #23
EricFoerster
Gnarly Adventurer
 
EricFoerster's Avatar
 
Joined: Oct 2003
Location: Jersey Village, Texas
Oddometer: 474
Well you may be right come to think of it. I stopped at the ruins and went north on 55 to Tajique where I get my crushed peppers. I know you can get from Carrizozo to the ruins after that I don't know.
EricFoerster is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-27-2005, 05:26 PM   #24
yater OP
Beastly Adventurer
 
yater's Avatar
 
Joined: Oct 2004
Location: Texas
Oddometer: 8,517

A kiva at the Gran Quivira ruins, with the pueblo ruins in the background. While only one or two kivas remain at each of the other two mission in the monument, this mission still has several kiva. The kiva were underground rooms used for religious ceremonies by the Pueblo Indians. When the missionaries arrived at this pueblo in the seventeenth century, they had opposed the religious practices using the kivas. Unlike the other missions in the national monument, the missionaries here did not try to incorporate the Indians' religious beliefs into the church ceremonies. Eventually, the Indians and their kivas outlasted the missionaries.


It looks like the "chute" I pointed out could have been a fireplace for their ceremonies. I wish I had known what a kiva was while I was looking at it. I stole the above text from another site
yater is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-27-2005, 06:11 PM   #25
brecchi
Gnarly Adventurer
 
Joined: Jan 2005
Oddometer: 361
yater, what's up? ben here. cool report. i'll be out your way in september to get the katana. enjoy the rest of your trip and stay safe.
brecchi is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-27-2005, 06:55 PM   #26
yater OP
Beastly Adventurer
 
yater's Avatar
 
Joined: Oct 2004
Location: Texas
Oddometer: 8,517
Quote:
Originally Posted by brecchi
yater, what's up? ben here. cool report. i'll be out your way in september to get the katana. enjoy the rest of your trip and stay safe.
Hey Ben,

The katana is safe. I guess I should get a brake lever on it and get that carb thing figured out before you get here and ride it back. Good to hear from you
yater is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-27-2005, 11:17 PM   #27
arroyoshark
Needing some space
 
arroyoshark's Avatar
 
Joined: Oct 2003
Location: Fin del Sendero, NM
Oddometer: 2,130
Quote:
Originally Posted by yater

Andy in the high country..yes, that's an overstuffed wolfman alfa on the back of his klx. It did great on the trip and survived a couple of diggers

Me too


Yater, this area is known as Cisneros Park. I have successfully hunted elk both a few miles north of this park, as well as a few miles south of your location, along whats known as the Tusas Ridge. The big round mountain to the behind your buddy, on the horizon is a volcanic uplift or dome, called Cerro San Antone, or San Antonio mountain. This a a beautiful area in northern New Mexico.
arroyoshark is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-28-2005, 12:51 PM   #28
yater OP
Beastly Adventurer
 
yater's Avatar
 
Joined: Oct 2004
Location: Texas
Oddometer: 8,517
Quote:
Originally Posted by arroyoshark
Yater, this area is known as Cisneros Park. I have successfully hunted elk both a few miles north of this park, as well as a few miles south of your location, along whats known as the Tusas Ridge. The big round mountain to the behind your buddy, on the horizon is a volcanic uplift or dome, called Cerro San Antone, or San Antonio mountain. This a a beautiful area in northern New Mexico.
This WHOLE area of national forest was beautiful. I stood on the pegs as I rode wide open through some of those alpine meadows up there....could only hear the wind. New Mexico has got to be one of the best states to dual sport. That said, next time I go to ruidoso, I'll ride west from there into Az. I can't wait
yater is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-28-2005, 02:03 PM   #29
slide
A nation in despair
 
Joined: Jul 2003
Location: NM, USA
Oddometer: 21,123
As a further note, the Indians kept their religious practices underground. They profited from the white's presence in many ways, but hardly in all ways. Still it made good sense for them to superficially adhere to the whites' religious demands. Also there is the standard philisophical problem all primative folks had to come to terms with when they first came into contact with whites.

Today the Indians' rites are again practiced somewhat in the open. By open, I mean they are open to tribal members, but tribes vary from one to another how much non-tribal people can even KNOW about their practices.

I work on a contract for perhaps the most secretive tribe in NM (the world?). From time to time all non-tribal people (even reds) are kicked out of the area with no notice or explanation.
slide is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-28-2005, 04:47 PM   #30
Hayduke
///SAFETY THIRD///
 
Hayduke's Avatar
 
Joined: Jun 2004
Location: Salida, coloRADo
Oddometer: 43,571
Ojo Caliente is nice. My wife and I ride there a couple of times a year. Be quiet, though. Last year we stayed in the cabins, and someone complained about our loud bike pulling in at 7 pm. I ride a stock ST1100....
__________________
"What these people need is some mental psychology."-Bonnie Abbzug

Hayduke is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Share

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

.
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On

Forum Jump


Times are GMT -7.   It's 09:16 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.5
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright ADVrider 2011-2014