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Old 12-04-2013, 08:57 PM   #16
vasculopath
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Question Sour grapes explained

The whole 9xo guys hating on the 1190 is really entertaining. As far as I can tell, it goes like this:

"The 990 was a big dirt bike, and the 1190 isn't, so it's shit"

Now everyone knows that any bike over ~350 lbs or so is not going to be good when you are talking about real dirt. That's why they have dirt bikes! Now why did they ever put a 9x0cc engine in a bike with off road pretentions anyway? Because we all know that those little dirt bikes we all love are shit when you're doing 300 mile plus days, be it asphalt, gravel, dirt, whatever, so they put a big honking twin in there to eat up the gravel roads and asphalt. The 1190 outdoes that and somehow that is bad? Did they forget that the bought a 9x0 because they may have to ride 200 miles of crappy asphalt and gravel roads to get to the dirt and then when they found an MX park that their bike was too freaking big to enjoy it?

KTM ups the ante by making it even better in getting you to the dirt, but adds all the things that 150rwhp with off road pretentions needs, and all hot modern superbikes over 1000cc have; traction control, ride by wire, etc. Then the 9x0 guys bitch about electronics, when they were already fuel injected and had ABS? KTM somehow has done a bad thing by giving you a hell of alot more power but making it user friendly?

I'm still waiting for a real objective review that pits say the 990 Baja against the 1190 R, where competent riders take both bikes off road, and they show us a trail that the 990 handles perfectly well, and the 1190 took a big dump and cried.
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Old 12-04-2013, 09:02 PM   #17
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Originally Posted by smitty141 View Post
Well, I stopped by the local stealership yesterday. I heard they had there demo on the floor. I pulled up in front of the dealer and there it was. a new 1190 standard. After walking around it for a few minutes, I am just scratching my head. If I wanted a street bike, I could buy a 1190, or a S-10, or a GS/GSA. It also had the ugliest trunk I have ever seen stuck on the back...

Not kicking any new owners in the nuts here, I just don't get it...

Does anyone else feel the same?? Looks like a nice bike, but I am glad I bought a left over 990 back in May.

Smitty
Dear Sir

The fact is as you said, ''you just walked around it for a few minutes''
hell why didnt you take it for a ride, yes the 1190 has a strong street bias and will be mostly used by guys to cover road and some small dirt riding.

However the 1190 Adventure R was pitched soleley at buyers who do most of their riding off road, the real tough stuff.
Both bikes have merit in their own right..
You also have a left over 990, aint nuthing wrong with that, however the 990 has nothing on the new 2014 1190
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Old 12-04-2013, 09:05 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vasculopath View Post
The whole 9xo guys hating on the 1190 is really entertaining. As far as I can tell, it goes like this:

"The 990 was a big dirt bike, and the 1190 isn't, so it's shit"

Now everyone knows that any bike over ~350 lbs or so is not going to be good when you are talking about real dirt. That's why they have dirt bikes! Now why did they ever put a 9x0cc engine in a bike with off road pretentions anyway? Because we all know that those little dirt bikes we all love are shit when you're doing 300 mile plus days, be it asphalt, gravel, dirt, whatever, so they put a big honking twin in there to eat up the gravel roads and asphalt. The 1190 outdoes that and somehow that is bad? Did they forget that the bought a 9x0 because they may have to ride 200 miles of crappy asphalt and gravel roads to get to the dirt and then when they found an MX park that their bike was too freaking big to enjoy it?

KTM ups the ante by making it even better in getting you to the dirt, but adds all the things that 150rwhp with off road pretentions needs, and all hot modern superbikes over 1000cc have; traction control, ride by wire, etc. Then the 9x0 guys bitch about electronics, when they were already fuel injected and had ABS? KTM somehow has done a bad thing by giving you a hell of alot more power but making it user friendly?

I'm still waiting for a real objective review that pits say the 990 Baja against the 1190 R, where competent riders take both bikes off road, and they show us a trail that the 990 handles perfectly well, and the 1190 took a big dump and cried.
^^^^ Thanks for clearing that up for the OP
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Old 12-04-2013, 09:11 PM   #19
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Please allow me to share the thoughts of Blake Conner in his review of the 1190

http://www.cycleworld.com/2013/02/06...t-ride-review/

--------------------------------------------------------------
Despite the tall, commanding riding position and long-travel suspension,
I occasional forgot that I was riding an ADV bike.

At times, I would have sworn that I was on a 990 Supermoto with a seriously massaged engine.

Front-end feel and grip far exceed what I expected of the 1190s 19-in. front wheel/tire combination. Turn-in felt crisp, while the WP suspension kept the bike from wallowing mid-corner.

With its stability-enhancing 61.4 in. wheelbase, the Adventure felt planted in sweepers, giving the rider lots of confidence. All helped, of course, by the 1190s 507-pound fully fueled weight, which is light for its category.

As you can see, the performance of this new KTM is pretty incredible.
In everyday use and in touring capabilities, the 1190 is a far better motorcycle than the 990 it replaces.
Protection provided by the adjustable windscreen was good, with virtually no helmet buffeting (an even taller option is available).

The riding position also can be altered, via a top triple-clamp that allows the handlebar to be set in two positions. The pegs are adjustable, too, while seat height can be raised 0.60 in.
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Old 12-05-2013, 03:29 AM   #20
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Originally Posted by KX50002 View Post
Looks like a street bike to me, do they perform well in the dirt?
The 990 looks more like a road bike to me... so much plastic.

Quote:
Originally Posted by smitty141 View Post
Well I guess this is the way Big Adventure bike are going, and KTM is just following the market. It is a shame they don't have a new, updated model to replace the 990. Something that leans toward the dirt side..
Following? The 1190 smokes its competition. Its leading the way. If you want something more dirt orientated, theres the 690. Nothing is needed in between.

Quote:
Originally Posted by GrenDesb View Post
All other manufacturers have a 1200 and a 800 in there "adventure" line up.

Makes sense to me that KTM built up a 1200 around an existing engine.

Would also make sens that they'd come up with an 800 in the future.
Why? The 1190 is better than all the 800's on the market currently. Go ride a tiger 800, f800 then the 1190. I know which one you'll buy.

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Old 12-05-2013, 03:34 AM   #21
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Originally Posted by Nerb View Post
The 990 looks more like a road bike to me... so much plastic.


Following? The 1190 smokes its competition. Its leading the way. If you want something more dirt orientated, theres the 690. Nothing is needed in between.


Why? The 1190 is letter than all the 800's on the market currently. Go ride a tiger 800, f800 then the 1190. I know which one you'll buy.
I concur. The 1190 R is pretty much everything I wanted in the Tiger 800 XC. Absolutely smokes it in every department except looks and its perhaps a fraction less nimble.
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Old 12-05-2013, 07:36 AM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vasculopath View Post
The whole 9xo guys hating on the 1190 is really entertaining. As far as I can tell, it goes like this:

"The 990 was a big dirt bike, and the 1190 isn't, so it's shit"

Now everyone knows that any bike over ~350 lbs or so is not going to be good when you are talking about real dirt. That's why they have dirt bikes! Now why did they ever put a 9x0cc engine in a bike with off road pretentions anyway? Because we all know that those little dirt bikes we all love are shit when you're doing 300 mile plus days, be it asphalt, gravel, dirt, whatever, so they put a big honking twin in there to eat up the gravel roads and asphalt. The 1190 outdoes that and somehow that is bad? Did they forget that the bought a 9x0 because they may have to ride 200 miles of crappy asphalt and gravel roads to get to the dirt and then when they found an MX park that their bike was too freaking big to enjoy it?

KTM ups the ante by making it even better in getting you to the dirt, but adds all the things that 150rwhp with off road pretentions needs, and all hot modern superbikes over 1000cc have; traction control, ride by wire, etc. Then the 9x0 guys bitch about electronics, when they were already fuel injected and had ABS? KTM somehow has done a bad thing by giving you a hell of alot more power but making it user friendly?

I'm still waiting for a real objective review that pits say the 990 Baja against the 1190 R, where competent riders take both bikes off road, and they show us a trail that the 990 handles perfectly well, and the 1190 took a big dump and cried.
I don't hate the bike, what's to hate... Looks like a $16,000. Vstrom to me..

Smitty
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Old 12-05-2013, 07:37 AM   #23
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Originally Posted by FuzzyDunlop View Post
I concur. The 1190 R is pretty much everything I wanted in the Tiger 800 XC. Absolutely smokes it in every department except looks and its perhaps a fraction less nimble.
Same here. I still have my 2012 800xc and love it. The 1190 is better in pretty much everyway. I think it is more nimble as the weight seems much lower on the 1190 and through tight traffic it is less 'tippy' than the 800. The gearing on the 800 was way too high in first and too low in 6th. The 1190 is far better in first and 6th is overdrive. So far it is a far better bike for what I want.
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Old 12-05-2013, 08:16 AM   #24
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It is very obvious the OP hasn't ridden a 1190.
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Old 12-06-2013, 03:28 AM   #25
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Originally Posted by vasculopath View Post
The whole 9xo guys hating on the 1190 is really entertaining. As far as I can tell, it goes like this:

"The 990 was a big dirt bike, and the 1190 isn't, so it's shit"

Now everyone knows that any bike over ~350 lbs or so is not going to be good when you are talking about real dirt. That's why they have dirt bikes! Now why did they ever put a 9x0cc engine in a bike with off road pretentions anyway? Because we all know that those little dirt bikes we all love are shit when you're doing 300 mile plus days, be it asphalt, gravel, dirt, whatever, so they put a big honking twin in there to eat up the gravel roads and asphalt. The 1190 outdoes that and somehow that is bad? Did they forget that the bought a 9x0 because they may have to ride 200 miles of crappy asphalt and gravel roads to get to the dirt and then when they found an MX park that their bike was too freaking big to enjoy it?

KTM ups the ante by making it even better in getting you to the dirt, but adds all the things that 150rwhp with off road pretentions needs, and all hot modern superbikes over 1000cc have; traction control, ride by wire, etc. Then the 9x0 guys bitch about electronics, when they were already fuel injected and had ABS? KTM somehow has done a bad thing by giving you a hell of alot more power but making it user friendly?

I'm still waiting for a real objective review that pits say the 990 Baja against the 1190 R, where competent riders take both bikes off road, and they show us a trail that the 990 handles perfectly well, and the 1190 took a big dump and cried.
Your probably right, however I rarely go off road, bit of green laning and lots of touring, and I specificaly waited untill the 1190 was released before I bought a KTM, and really wanted to like it. Took it for a test ride and to be fair its about the best riding all round bike I have been on, quick, comfortable, handles fantastic. I had it all day then took it back and bought a 990 instead.
Like it or not, we all "DO" care about what a bike looks like, and to be honest for me the 1190 is ugly as hell, cant abide the exhaust, cant abide the OEM panniers, cant abide the tank fairing etc. its not for me.
+ I dont want and have no interest in, electronic suspension, fly by wire, ABS, and most of all CANBUS.
So I went for a 2007 990 with ABS (it was the best bike available) then took the ABS off.

It may not be as quick or handle as well or be quite as fuel efficient, however its a much more efficient design at using space to carry stuff for touring, and for me the better and better looking (that IS important to me) bike. No arguments that on paper the 1190 is better and on the road excels in all areas, just not the ones that matter to me or for what I want to use a bike for, and at the end of the day I still go out and just look at it and have a grin on my face, where as I look at the 1190 and just see missed opportunities to actualy make a great bike, it just misses the mark by miles for me.

Not going to bitch at anyone who gets one, have fun and enjoy, but I do think its a bit too much of a jump from the previous model to ever attract some.
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Old 12-06-2013, 05:38 AM   #26
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Originally Posted by Bowser View Post
Your probably right, however I rarely go off road, bit of green laning and lots of touring, and I specificaly waited untill the 1190 was released before I bought a KTM, and really wanted to like it. Took it for a test ride and to be fair its about the best riding all round bike I have been on, quick, comfortable, handles fantastic. I had it all day then took it back and bought a 990 instead.
Like it or not, we all "DO" care about what a bike looks like, and to be honest for me the 1190 is ugly as hell, cant abide the exhaust, cant abide the OEM panniers, cant abide the tank fairing etc. its not for me.
+ I dont want and have no interest in, electronic suspension, fly by wire, ABS, and most of all CANBUS.
So I went for a 2007 990 with ABS (it was the best bike available) then took the ABS off.

It may not be as quick or handle as well or be quite as fuel efficient, however its a much more efficient design at using space to carry stuff for touring, and for me the better and better looking (that IS important to me) bike. No arguments that on paper the 1190 is better and on the road excels in all areas, just not the ones that matter to me or for what I want to use a bike for, and at the end of the day I still go out and just look at it and have a grin on my face, where as I look at the 1190 and just see missed opportunities to actualy make a great bike, it just misses the mark by miles for me.

Not going to bitch at anyone who gets one, have fun and enjoy, but I do think its a bit too much of a jump from the previous model to ever attract some.
Well said....

Smitty
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Old 12-06-2013, 06:07 AM   #27
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We get it Smitty and Bowser.

To each his own. Personally i think the 990 is ugly but that is subjective.So let's stop bashing each others choice and take OrangeV's advice and go for a ride. I've got four thousand dollars worth of accessories sitting here in my shop waiting to bolt on. Your not going to change my mind and I couldn't be bothered trying to change yours . We get it Smitty and Bowser. Move on, there is nothing here to see.
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Old 12-06-2013, 07:12 AM   #28
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"To each his own" is so true. I for one can't wait to sell my '13 990adv and finally get that 1190R that I originally wanted. I finally got the chance to demo the '14 1190adv (actually a standard '13 euro model). Very impressive powerband and good suspension

I am now compelled to place a deposit for a 1190Adv R and dump that Baja990........................................in 2016 after KTM resolves several issues, the obese/vulnerable exhaust, the weird sidestand, dust in the airbox to name a few.

Truthfully, I have one of the best dual-sport bikes but I look forward to 2016.

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Old 12-06-2013, 07:19 AM   #29
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Originally Posted by Bowser View Post
Your probably right, however I rarely go off road, bit of green laning and lots of touring, and I specificaly waited untill the 1190 was released before I bought a KTM, and really wanted to like it. Took it for a test ride and to be fair its about the best riding all round bike I have been on, quick, comfortable, handles fantastic. I had it all day then took it back and bought a 990 instead.
Like it or not, we all "DO" care about what a bike looks like, and to be honest for me the 1190 is ugly as hell, cant abide the exhaust, cant abide the OEM panniers, cant abide the tank fairing etc. its not for me.
+ I dont want and have no interest in, electronic suspension, fly by wire, ABS, and most of all CANBUS.
So I went for a 2007 990 with ABS (it was the best bike available) then took the ABS off.

It may not be as quick or handle as well or be quite as fuel efficient, however its a much more efficient design at using space to carry stuff for touring, and for me the better and better looking (that IS important to me) bike. No arguments that on paper the 1190 is better and on the road excels in all areas, just not the ones that matter to me or for what I want to use a bike for, and at the end of the day I still go out and just look at it and have a grin on my face, where as I look at the 1190 and just see missed opportunities to actually make a great bike, it just misses the mark by miles for me.

Not going to bitch at anyone who gets one, have fun and enjoy, but I do think its a bit too much of a jump from the previous model to ever attract some.
...IMHO...I've got the '13 R version and the looks grow on me everyday, plus the chicas seem to like it too:)).
In regards, to the ABS, TCS...I used it now on the track and it made me brake later than any amateur road bike out there. I yank on the brakes as hard as I can on the last moment swaying the rear and a bit, without worrying to lock the front and I makes up for not having 190Hp:) Off road it works EXTREMELY well going down slippery technical trails and not having to worried about locking up and in traffic yanking the brakes on the wet when some idiot in a car cuts me off is not a issue anymore. You just react like you would in a car. It's saved my ass twice now.
I wouldn't feel safe without it anymore. If they electronics wouldn't help I would go traditional too but here the safety factor increases a 100 fold!
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Old 12-06-2013, 07:31 PM   #30
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To each his own. Personally i think the 990 is ugly but that is subjective.So let's stop bashing each others choice and take OrangeV's advice and go for a ride. I've got four thousand dollars worth of accessories sitting here in my shop waiting to bolt on. Your not going to change my mind and I couldn't be bothered trying to change yours . We get it Smitty and Bowser. Move on, there is nothing here to see.
Guy's, I didn't start this tread to bash anyone new ride, or to try and change anyone's mind. It was just a simple observation on my part. My thought was simple. I was just thinking if someone wanted this style bike, they would have been riding a BMW, S-10 or other for years now. But KTM came out with one and its the best bike ever...When the snows clears, I will find time to ride one. Maybe I will think differently, maybe not...

You guys enjoy your new ride, and I will do the same...

Smitty
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