ADVrider

Go Back   ADVrider > Riding > The perfect line and other riding myths
User Name
Password
Register Inmates Photos Site Rules Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Old 01-17-2014, 08:14 AM   #1
Qaz OP
Gnarly Adventurer
 
Joined: Mar 2012
Oddometer: 161
What attribute make a good/great ADV bike

I have been reading these builds for about a year and like everyone else, I think: Man that is a good idea or I wouldn't do that. Let's face it, the BMW GS is a street bike and although the old Yamaha DT 250 was hell of a trailbike, it was limited on the road! As you move up in size and cc there should be a point where it all balances. The Versys and V-strom are good starting points but the KLR with the 650 twin engine offers more.
My question is: If you were to build frankenstien, what would it include and why? I think we need some guide lines, it must be capable of 200+ miles on a tank of gas, comfortable enough to ride 600+ mile days strung together (ie. Touring), keep up with highway traffic, nimble enough to ride single track.
Qaz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-17-2014, 08:37 AM   #2
XC Rider
Motorcycle Vagabond
 
XC Rider's Avatar
 
Joined: Dec 2008
Location: Out in the country
Oddometer: 2,819
Quote:
Originally Posted by Qaz View Post
I have been reading these builds for about a year and like everyone else, I think: Man that is a good idea or I wouldn't do that. Let's face it, the BMW GS is a street bike and although the old Yamaha DT 250 was hell of a trailbike, it was limited on the road! As you move up in size and cc there should be a point where it all balances. The Versys and V-strom are good starting points but the KLR with the 650 twin engine offers more.
My question is: If you were to build frankenstien, what would it include and why? I think we need some guide lines, it must be capable of 200+ miles on a tank of gas, comfortable enough to ride 600+ mile days strung together (ie. Touring), keep up with highway traffic, nimble enough to ride single track.
The hard part to achieve is the "nimble enough to ride single track" along with all that preceded that.

Personally I'm a big fan of the modified Versys/Ninja, and I simply accept that due to the limitations of the bike and myself as a rider, this is not the bike for me to ride single track with.
__________________
XC Rider
"Motorcycles have put me in touch with wonderful people. As a result of that, I have an elevated idea about how good everybody in the world is." - Ted Simon
My Ride Reports.
SpotWalla: WHERE IS XC RIDER!?
XC Rider is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 01-17-2014, 08:46 AM   #3
sailah
Lampin' it
 
sailah's Avatar
 
Joined: Aug 2005
Location: Turning expensive metal into scrap
Oddometer: 5,264
I would build exactly what I built with the ninja 650 but I would change the following

Replace pds shock and swing arm with a linkage from a KTM 690. That gets rid of the tank mods. Probably. I would also run shorter travel. I have 300mm and I could get by with less.

Perhaps go custom on the tank, but that is beyond my skill level. My bike you can stand but the shape of the tank prevents it being comfortable for long distance.

I had also considered running the KTM 690 subframe and tank setup. This would get rid of huge ninja tank and replace with 3.2 gals. I would then augment with maybe a side tank opposite the exhaust. Now I could have a seat that goes all the way to the bars for better seating positions.

Probably would require a custom frame and a ton of work. I considered doing this as I have the parts to frame it up but I simply don't have the time or ambition to tackle another huge project right now. But it would be awesome

My bike is fuel injected, gets 40ish mpg. Has plenty of power, weighs 385 lbs and that is full of fuel. I don't know if I would want it I do a 600 mile day on it but I probably could. It will easily pull 75 all day long and rips past 100 when required.

To me the big thing is weight. It makes a huge difference. You know how fun it is to ride a 450 dirt bike. But adding 200lbs just kills the fun off-road. My ninja is pretty close to exactly what I would want but def needs another revision.

I will do it someday just can't dedicate the time.
__________________
We're not out here to rough it. We're here to smooth it . Things are rough enough in town.

Nessmuk
sailah is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 01-17-2014, 08:49 AM   #4
sailah
Lampin' it
 
sailah's Avatar
 
Joined: Aug 2005
Location: Turning expensive metal into scrap
Oddometer: 5,264
The more I have considered it, I think the KTM 690 with some mods would pretty much check all the boxes. I guess you might lose a little comfort on the road, but it sure makes up for it in performance and off road ability. And they have been around long enough to be within reach of most buyers. Building a bike is not cheap. Especially with fun bling components. Anyone who tells you different hasn't done one
__________________
We're not out here to rough it. We're here to smooth it . Things are rough enough in town.

Nessmuk
sailah is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 01-17-2014, 09:14 AM   #5
jdrocks
Gravel Runner
 
Joined: Jul 2007
Oddometer: 3,885
Quote:
Originally Posted by Qaz View Post
...I think we need some guide lines...
there are no guidelines, never will be either. the bikes are purpose built and tailored to satisfy the builder's criteria, not some other rider's notions of what "ideal" means, no matter the usage. riders can't even agree on the capability and usage of bone stock motos, how are they to set guidelines for custom builds?

if custom bikes happen to end up with some similarities, it's because the builders had similar goals and might have faced the same problems and constraints.

KLR with a ptwin offers more what, exactly? some great builds by some very talented guys, and that bike might offer more of what you're looking for, but certainly not more of what i'm looking for. see what i mean.

your money, your time, your skills, your ride...build whatever the heck ya want.
jdrocks is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-18-2014, 08:15 AM   #6
Navin
Unwounding
 
Navin's Avatar
 
Joined: Sep 2009
Oddometer: 6,737
Tonymorr is going to nail it with the Ninja 300 conversion. The engine is a doll of a motor. The torque is flat and useable, the gears are spread wide enough for one sprocket set to do trails and highway. Capable of big MPH numbers and smooth at high RPMs.

I rode/raced KTM Adv and/or a SE950 since 2003. Put this 300cc engine in a SE type frame and it would be a riot. In an Adv it would put the KLR out of business. No, it won't power wheelie in 3rd gear, but it would be nimble off road and do over 100 MPH.

Kawasaki needs to hire a few guys away from KTM and grow a set!
Navin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-18-2014, 03:00 PM   #7
dhallilama
Gnarly Adventurer
 
Joined: Apr 2012
Location: Portland, OR, USA
Oddometer: 208
guess it depends on the rider... for me, a GS would be an utter nightmare off road & i don't even like it on road. i like the idea of a ninja 300 motor in a capable chassis/suspension package. for me the closest thing to a great ADV bike out of the box is an XR650R. It's still on the heavy side for single track, but it does the wide open throttle boogie through the desert that i love so much.

otherwise... if i were building my version of an ADV bike... either a late suzuki RM... or KTM frame/suspension, wedge a ~450cc thumper in there... or maybe a big rotax 4 stroke...
__________________
current: '89 suzuki gsxr 750, '77 yamaha IT250, '67 harley xlh chopper, '59 harley xlch resto project, and mucho basket case projects
past: too many to list
dhallilama is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-18-2014, 03:23 PM   #8
AST236
Beastly Adventurer
 
AST236's Avatar
 
Joined: Oct 2009
Location: Lower Alabama
Oddometer: 1,949
Sit back and get ready for hundreds of answers to your question. Should be fun!

If I could just average my DR350 and my FJR1300, maybe I'd be close.

I actually liked the WeeStrom I had for a while. It was just so, SO ugly!

For me, a less ugly WeeStrom w/ laced wheels would take care of most of my riding needs.......YMMV
__________________
I usually run out of talent before I run out of horsepower.

I don't like sand.
AST236 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-19-2014, 04:50 PM   #9
Kommando
Grumpy Young Man
 
Kommando's Avatar
 
Joined: Nov 2006
Location: Spacecoaster FL
Oddometer: 6,455
Quote:
Originally Posted by Qaz View Post
I have been reading these builds for about a year and like everyone else, I think: Man that is a good idea or I wouldn't do that. Let's face it, the BMW GS is a street bike and although the old Yamaha DT 250 was hell of a trailbike, it was limited on the road! As you move up in size and cc there should be a point where it all balances. The Versys and V-strom are good starting points but the KLR with the 650 twin engine offers more.
My question is: If you were to build frankenstien, what would it include and why? I think we need some guide lines, it must be capable of 200+ miles on a tank of gas, comfortable enough to ride 600+ mile days strung together (ie. Touring), keep up with highway traffic, nimble enough to ride single track.
Pick up a beaten DR650SE and drag it through www.Procycle.us.

You can have a smooth-running DR790 with 400+ miles of range, a comfy seat, luggage racks, and suspension with fully-adjustable damping. Then fab some brackets to lower your passenger pegs and add touring pegs, and shop for some soft luggage bags with some PacSafe mesh bags around them. It'll run singletrack. It'll run slab for days at a time.
__________________
'8yrs in the Marines, 'almost a decade of knocking heads in the service industry, I took a ride out to visit family and friends for Thanksgiving at 41yrs old, and my mom confiscated my bike.

Kommando is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-19-2014, 05:44 PM   #10
concours
WFO for 41 years
 
concours's Avatar
 
Joined: Dec 2008
Location: Kensington, NH USA
Oddometer: 5,124
what kind of ADVENTURE will you be doing?
__________________
Too much is just barely enough.....
concours is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-19-2014, 07:36 PM   #11
Wraith Rider
Beastly Adventurer
 
Wraith Rider's Avatar
 
Joined: Feb 2012
Location: Germany
Oddometer: 1,043
Reliability! Most important is reliability.
So it should be an as stock as possible Honda.
__________________
"Why not stay in disguise all the time? You know, look like everyone else."
"Because we shouldn't have to."
Wraith Rider is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-19-2014, 07:48 PM   #12
DAKEZ
Beastly Adventurer
 
DAKEZ's Avatar
 
Joined: Mar 2007
Location: OR
Oddometer: 19,485
An "Adventure bike" is (or should be) one with a 19" front wheel chain, shaft or belt final drive and long suspension.

A Dual Sport Bike should be lighter, have a 21" front wheel Chain final drive and Long suspension.

__________________
“Watch out for everything bigger than you, they have the "right of weight"
Bib
DAKEZ is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-19-2014, 08:12 PM   #13
larryboy
Paint it black.
 
larryboy's Avatar
 
Joined: Jan 2005
Location: Über Alles,Ca
Oddometer: 13,656
Quote:
Originally Posted by Qaz View Post
My question is: If you were to build frankenstien, what would it include and why?

I think we need some guide lines, it must be capable of 200+ miles on a tank of gas, comfortable enough to ride 600+ mile days strung together (ie. Touring), keep up with highway traffic, nimble enough to ride single track.

1. Wide ratio 6 speed transmission with a low first gear.

2. Air cooled.

3. Minimum engine size of 350cc.

4. 40 RWHP, true HP, not Dynojet.

5. 300 pounds fully fueled.


How I would achieve that list;

1. TY350 transmission.

2. TY350 engine.

3. TY350 engine.

4. Turbo and fuel injected.

5. 7 gallons of fuel, nav tower, oil tank for pre-mix, integrated soft luggage should get me to 300 pounds which is the magic number for me in my experience. I want a little weight for good highway manners, yet light enough for single track.


Stay tuned to the 'Built, not Bought' section and I'll make it a reality.
__________________
Be sure the safest rule is that we should not dare to live in any scene in which we dare not die. ~Lewis Carroll~
larryboy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-19-2014, 08:22 PM   #14
BanjoBoy
Studly Adventurer
 
BanjoBoy's Avatar
 
Joined: Mar 2009
Location: Northern CA
Oddometer: 872
What attribute make a good/great ADV bike?

ADV ain't in the bike, it's in the rider!!!

__________________
2007 FJR1300
2007 FZ6 (Dirt bike)
BanjoBoy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-19-2014, 11:10 PM   #15
CanadianLifeGuard
Adventurer
 
Joined: Jan 2013
Location: Victoria, BC
Oddometer: 17
For me that bike would be easy to make. Take a KTM dirt bike frame, with well sorted suspension components. Drop in the 375cc thumper from the new duke 390, with a good wide range 6-speed gearbox. Add a 20L(ish) fuel tank for some good range and a rally style fairing for some wind protection along with a good seat. Boom you have a a bike thats punchy (40-45rwhp depending on what you read), has good range, would be comfortable on the highway and capable in the dirt. Keep it all around, preferably under, 300lb ready to ride and with an MSRP of around $10,000 and it would sell like hotcakes in my opinion.
CanadianLifeGuard is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Share

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

.
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On

Forum Jump


Times are GMT -7.   It's 03:44 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.5
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright ADVrider 2011-2014