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Old 02-11-2014, 12:12 PM   #211
atypical1
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Originally Posted by tkent02 View Post
On a straight street maybe. Where I prefer to ride, give me quick and nimble handling any day over an overweight high-powered behemoth.
Why does high powered have to equal overweight? I think that perhaps you're looking at the wrong bikes.

Of course it depends on what you consider overweight. 450lbs? 600lbs?

james
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Old 02-11-2014, 12:17 PM   #212
tkent02
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Originally Posted by atypical1 View Post
Why does high powered have to equal overweight? I think that perhaps you're looking at the wrong bikes.

Of course it depends on what you consider overweight. 450lbs? 600lbs?

james
Why does light weight have to mean underpowered?

You keep implying we are slow riders, we are not.

Just don't care much for the 130+mph aspect of it on these particular bikes, would rather have the quick and nimble handling of a shorter wheelbase and a lighter motorcycle, most of the time..

If I wanted to ride 130+ for a long distance, I'd wheel out the bigger machine.

I rarely do.
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Old 02-11-2014, 12:28 PM   #213
Wraith Rider
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@tkent02
Why are you so completely clueless?
Why do you think somebody meant lightweight has to mean underpowered? No one said so.
Why do you think somebody meant you are slow riders? Riders are completely irrelevant when comparing bikes.
Why are you talking about 130+mph? No one else does. (Well, of course 130+ is fun, but it's not what is relevant in the discussion here.)

@klaviator
Since you've been a nice discussion partner most of the time, I'll give it another try.

Imagine you're behind a car, going 50mph. Maybe on your daily commute or on the way to your favourite road or whatever. Now imagine to instantly open up the throttle in second gear and dart out behind the car. Hit red line 2.3 seconds later at 87mph. That's what a powerful bike ADDs to the cornering.

e.g.
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Old 02-11-2014, 12:47 PM   #214
Paebr332
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Originally Posted by Wraith Rider View Post
Didn't you say we were talking about APPLIED power? Do you know what you're talking about?
You were the one who stated stated multiple times that gearing was unimportant and that engine power is what mattered. For example, in post 178 you stated

Quote:
Originally Posted by Wraith Rider
The possible amount of acceleration with a given power and mass is a physical fact. You can't betray physics by changing the gearing.
Gearing can PROFOUNDLY affect applied power at the drive wheel. Your utter refusal to acknowledge this fact speaks volumes about your understanding of the physics involved.

Do you understand the concepts of mechanical advantage and speed ratios regarding gear trains and how they effect power output for a given power input?
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Old 02-11-2014, 12:47 PM   #215
klaviator
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Originally Posted by Wraith Rider View Post
@tkent02

@klaviator
Since you've been a nice discussion partner most of the time, I'll give it another try.
There is no such thing as a perfect bike. I will agree with you that the ability to easily pass slower traffic is a big advantage to having more power. In a perfect world I would like a bike that is inexpensive, lightweight, comfortable, has a great suspension, and lots of power. While we're at it lets make it a perfect world and eliminate speeding tickets.

Since we don't live in a perfect world, I'll stick with small to mid sized and powered bikes.
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Old 02-11-2014, 01:17 PM   #216
S-TrackJunkie
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A bit moist, aren't we?

Holy shit....should have worn a wet suit to swim through this pissing match...good god guys, grip a fuckin grip!

The rider....ABSOLUTELY has to be part of the equation, period! To think otherwise is plain dumb, and there is no equation that will prove otherwise! I am 6'5" 275-300lbs. What seems big to some, is right in my wheel house, and therefore proves the rider is a major factor in THIS discussion! My "small" bike is an XR650R , that weighs around 325lbs. I can, and do, ride this bike anywhere. My "big" bike is a DL1000, and I have a damned good time on it too, but I have to keep it's limitations in mind at all times. I know not to get into mud or sand on it, or it is going to be a bit more of an adventure than I might want. I do not even consider them to be in the same realm in the dirt, and that is just plain common sense! Dirt riding to me is gnarly single track, and the more the better....I would never dream of taking my DL down any single track! Why, because it's not a good choice of bike for that type of riding, PERIOD! I do take it on some great dirt rides though. Exploring back roads in CO, camping off the bike, and basically treating the DL like a 2 wheeled Jeep. I love to load it up, and head out.

As had been said WAY too many times, it's up to your personal preference! When you start changing your mentality to gain acceptance of the masses, you lose out on the real prize....FUN!! Fun is why we all ride, isn't it? If it a fuckin mo-ped, then so be it, but there is no reason to bash someone for having their own opinion, and choosing to stick by it! I ride what I want, how I want to ride it.....if people can't wrap their heads around that, too bad for them! LOL!!
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Old 02-11-2014, 03:36 PM   #217
Vertical C
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Quote:
Originally Posted by atypical1 View Post
Why does high powered have to equal overweight? I think that perhaps you're looking at the wrong bikes.

Of course it depends on what you consider overweight. 450lbs? 600lbs?

james

Good Power
Light Weight
Cheap

Pick two.
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Old 02-11-2014, 03:55 PM   #218
markk53
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Originally Posted by klaviator View Post
It has been a real long winter, even here in Alabama.

It always amuses me when people argue about which bike is the fastest when real world experience shows that the rider is much more important than the bike.

It's like the guy who can't keep up with his buddies so he gets a faster bike instead of learning how to ride.

Sounds pretty gravy compared to up here in Ohio with the exception of you guys' lack of snow removal and road salting equipment. We have had ten straight days under zero lows. Going toward record snow fall which I think is approaching 5 feet total. But hey, we're tough, we can take it. It's just extra cold, we're used to the snow and ice on the roads... and we're wimps compared to those further north!

Fact is most of us can drive on snow covered roads no problem - now ice is another story, nothing does too well on that.
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Old 02-11-2014, 04:24 PM   #219
SteelJM1
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This thread makes me want to get a TU250 as a work commuter!
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Old 02-11-2014, 04:27 PM   #220
scootrboi
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Originally Posted by markk53 View Post
Sounds pretty gravy compared to up here in Ohio with the exception of you guys' lack of snow removal and road salting equipment. We have had ten straight days under zero lows. Going toward record snow fall which I think is approaching 5 feet total. But hey, we're tough, we can take it. It's just extra cold, we're used to the snow and ice on the roads... and we're wimps compared to those further north!

Fact is most of us can drive on snow covered roads no problem - now ice is another story, nothing does too well on that.
Most of the vehicles off the road during icy conditions here are 4wd. They don't understand, it doesn't help on ice. And the high center of mass is a severe disadvantage.
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Old 02-11-2014, 07:37 PM   #221
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I have had one for 3 years and 20,000+ miles and love it.
Sold the 1200 and 650, I have not had as much fun on a motorcycle since I was 15 (56 now).

The new bike usually wears off, but it has not with this bike.
No ride is too short, or long enough.



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This thread makes me want to get a TU250 as a work commuter!
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Old 02-11-2014, 07:51 PM   #222
klaviator
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Quote:
Originally Posted by markk53 View Post
Sounds pretty gravy compared to up here in Ohio with the exception of you guys' lack of snow removal and road salting equipment. We have had ten straight days under zero lows. Going toward record snow fall which I think is approaching 5 feet total. But hey, we're tough, we can take it. It's just extra cold, we're used to the snow and ice on the roads... and we're wimps compared to those further north!

Fact is most of us can drive on snow covered roads no problem - now ice is another story, nothing does too well on that.
I have lived in OH, MI, CT, MD, and ME so I know what winter is all about. I have done more riding in the snow while living in GA, and AL than I ever did up North. However, I'm turning into a wimp in my old age,. We got a little snow today and I didn't even pull out one of my bikes to get a snow riding pic.
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Old 02-11-2014, 09:13 PM   #223
Kommando
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Quote:
Originally Posted by scootrboi View Post
Most of the vehicles off the road during icy conditions here are 4wd. They don't understand, it doesn't help on ice. And the high center of mass is a severe disadvantage.
4WD CAN help on ice. One just has to know how to use it, and apply that knowledge. It also helps to have appropriate tires. Most people I've seen with 4WDs don't have the skill or tires to fully take advantage of it.

Many "4WDs" are also not truly 4WD.
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Old 02-11-2014, 09:20 PM   #224
tkent02
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Originally Posted by Kommando View Post
4WD CAN help on ice. One just has to know how to use it, and apply that knowledge. It also helps to have appropriate tires. Most people I've seen with 4WDs don't have the skill or tires to fully take advantage of it.

Many "4WDs" are also not truly 4WD.
Most idiots with FWD use it to easily go way too fast. Those of us who don't go just fine on ice.

+1 on the not FWD thing, spinniing one front and one rear wheel isn't much better the spinning two rears.
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Old 02-12-2014, 08:37 AM   #225
Wraith Rider
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Originally Posted by Paebr332 View Post
Do you understand the concepts of mechanical advantage and speed ratios regarding gear trains and how they effect power output for a given power input?
It's not possible to get a higher power output than power input through gearing. That's why the highest possible acceleration is given by the power of the bike, no matter the gearing.

Quote:
Originally Posted by markk53 View Post
now ice is another story, nothing does too well on that.
4wd is great fun on ice and waaaaaay better controllable than 2wd.
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