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Old 02-14-2014, 10:53 AM   #76
tkent02
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Originally Posted by slartidbartfast View Post
That's why I quoted "failures". However, stating that a bike ran past an intersection because of ABS failure sounds fishy to me. Seems like any time he screws up his braking he blames it on the ABS. I have BMWs ABS2 on my 1100GS. This is acknowledged as one of the most trouble-prone systems and most likely to release brakes when on gravel (if it releases on a slick manhole cover, etc., then it's functioning as intended.) However, I can honestly say that in around 50,000 miles of riding in all conditions, I have never once had the ABS cause me to not stop where I intended (on the street.)

If he said it was on gravel I'd understand.
I haven't had it make me not stop, it has made me turn the key off to be able to stop, or to steer over to smoother pavement to stop. This on moderate braking, not anywhere near the limits of available traction. I went around the block to do it over and over, got a similar result each time. On that particular place, stopping distance with the ABS off was MUCH shorter. It is very interesting if you know about it. If you first learned when someone pulled out in front of you, or a light just turned yellow at the last minute, or when you just realized you overcooked a corner a little bit, interesting might not be the right word.
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Old 02-14-2014, 11:09 AM   #77
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Originally Posted by tkent02 View Post
a light just turned yellow at the last minute
Sounds like the problem is not with the ABS.
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Old 02-14-2014, 11:20 AM   #78
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Originally Posted by tkent02 View Post
I haven't had it make me not stop, it has made me turn the key off to be able to stop, or to steer over to smoother pavement to stop. This on moderate braking, not anywhere near the limits of available traction. I went around the block to do it over and over, got a similar result each time. On that particular place, stopping distance with the ABS off was MUCH shorter. It is very interesting if you know about it. If you first learned when someone pulled out in front of you, or a light just turned yellow at the last minute, or when you just realized you overcooked a corner a little bit, interesting might not be the right word.
I am familiar with the little skip you get occasionally when braking over tar snakes or seams but have not braked hard enough on bad surfaces to experience the issue you describe. Maybe I'm just a wuss, or maybe I'm better at reading the road surface, or maybe they just have better roads where I ride You do say you only found one place where it was a repeatable phenomenon. What about the other places where there is a wet manhole cover or invisible patch of diesel and the ABS helps you stay on the brakes and stop shorter or saves you from a butt-pucker or worse?

I must say I admire your practiced skill at turning the key off, requiring you to brake hard while riding one-handed and deal with having no control over 100% engine-braking all at the same time. I think I would prefer to keep both hands on the bars, pick my line better and brake earlier if I anticipated a dodgy road surface ahead. Also I tend not to overcook corners with poor traction and if I do, I don't react by getting on the brakes hard enough to activate ABS. I would suggest that for someone facing that issue, the possibility of ABS "failure" would be the least of their problems.
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slartidbartfast screwed with this post 02-14-2014 at 12:49 PM
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Old 02-14-2014, 11:32 AM   #79
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Well that first sentence actually tells everything about your point of view. You just don΄t want it, period. And that΄s fine, we all have a freedom of choice. You will soon have trouble to find a new bike without ABS,
How is THAT freedom of choice? All the whiny, sniveling do-gooders get their way and force their will on people that don't want or need their protection.

It should be left as an OPTION
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Old 02-14-2014, 11:42 AM   #80
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Originally Posted by slartidbartfast View Post
So you have experience of multiple ABS "failures" that resulted in having no (or less) brakes than you would have had without ABS. You are a statistical freak. Go buy a lottery ticket.
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Originally Posted by tkent02 View Post
No he's actually not a freak. It happens quite often. So often it's in the owner's manual.

It's not a failure, it's just how the ABS works. Sometimes wonderfully, almost as good as ABS on a car. Sometimes not very well at all.
I am with tkent02 on this. I have had several instances where the ABS system was tricked and turned off my brakes when I needed them ON. Fortunately it did not end badly in any of them (but it could have) when I ended up in the intersection. Ride smart. Ride aware, and never treat the public roads as a race track... That way when things do go wrong you have a little buffer to readjust what you are doing.

A bit of luck is always good too.
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Old 02-14-2014, 11:58 AM   #81
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It's not a failure, it's just how the ABS works. Sometimes wonderfully, almost as good as ABS on a car. Sometimes not very well at all.
I agree with that. I have experienced the momentary loss of braking on both cars and bikes. However, abs will save you more often than it causes any problems. Way more often. Actually I haven't seen any test where an experienced rider outperforms abs in anywhere else than on a perfect stretch of asphalt after multiple trials. Only situation where abs fails systematically is when you are leaned over trying to steer and scrub speed with a rear brake slide.
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Old 02-14-2014, 12:18 PM   #82
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How is THAT freedom of choice? All the whiny, sniveling do-gooders get their way and force their will on people that don't want or need their protection.

It should be left as an OPTION
your barking at the wrong tree. I only stated a fact, that it will soon be standard, and I do not decide, how motorcycles are equipped in the future.
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Old 02-14-2014, 12:22 PM   #83
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Originally Posted by Wraith Rider View Post
Sounds like the problem is not with the ABS.
Sounds like you are even more clueless than I thought you were.
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Old 02-14-2014, 12:32 PM   #84
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Originally Posted by tkent02 View Post
Sounds like you are even more clueless than I thought you were.
Since thinking isn't your strength, that means nothing.

A case where ABS fails that hard that one gets in trouble because of a traffic light turning yellow is not heard of.
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Old 02-14-2014, 12:48 PM   #85
tkent02
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Originally Posted by Wraith Rider View Post

A case where ABS fails that hard that one gets in trouble because of a traffic light turning yellow is not heard of.
just because you won't hear it does not mean it has not happened.
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Old 02-14-2014, 12:52 PM   #86
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Originally Posted by DAKEZ View Post
I am with tkent02 on this. I have had several instances where the ABS system was tricked and turned off my brakes when I needed them ON. Fortunately it did not end badly in any of them (but it could have) when I ended up in the intersection. Ride smart. Ride aware, and never treat the public roads as a race track... That way when things do go wrong you have a little buffer to readjust what you are doing.

A bit of luck is always good too.
Hi Dakez. Is it possible that you might have been riding over a slick surface and the ABS actually saved your butt, preventing you from locking the front wheel and crashing? If the surface was rough enough to "trick" the ABS, surely you should have seen that coming?
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Old 02-14-2014, 01:12 PM   #87
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just because you won't hear it does not mean it has not happened.
You don't understand. It's not about what I heard of, it's about what was heard of at all.
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Old 02-14-2014, 01:30 PM   #88
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Originally Posted by Wraith Rider View Post
You don't understand. It's not about what I heard of, it's about what was heard of at all.
It is actually about what you've heard of.. I've seen that very report on this forum in the last 2 weeks (not "I heard about", but actual first hand experience according to the poster).

I've seen the same complaints on several other forums, although I'm not sure a yellow light was the instigator.
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Old 02-14-2014, 01:51 PM   #89
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It is actually about what you've heard of.. I've seen that very report on this forum in the last 2 weeks (not "I heard about", but actual first hand experience according to the poster).

I've seen the same complaints on several other forums, although I'm not sure a yellow light was the instigator.
I'm coming down on the same side of a disagreement as Wraith Rider for the first time ever.

If you overshoot into an intersection at a yellow light there are NO F***ING EXCUSES!! You screwed up and blaming your brakes is never going to change that.
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Old 02-14-2014, 02:05 PM   #90
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I've seen that very report on this forum in the last 2 weeks
[...]
I've seen the same complaints on several other forums, although I'm not sure a yellow light was the instigator.
Did you see that very report (link?) or are you not sure if it was that very report (yellow light + failing ABS as in not allowing any braking at all, not even the 3...5m/s² needed for traffic lights)?
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