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Old 02-25-2014, 03:51 PM   #16
eakins
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If the picture above is the path they are indeed on, then expect a 500+ lbs bike. Sorry 125hp is NOT needed off road. KTM has 100hp off-road mode for their 1190 because they KNOW above that it's too much and counter-productive. 60-80 hp with alot of torque down low is needed. That's why thumpers work! That's why the 650 strom motor works in the dirt (even with a poor suspension package). Tune the 700 twin that way for the win.

Quote:
Originally Posted by sweetlou View Post
Sign me up for 1, oh and my ninja 1000 will be traded it. Yes, yes, yes.

It's a lighter, more powerful tiger 800 with Yamaha refinement? Are you kidding me? This bike would put the tiger 800 out of business!! Oh, bump hp to 125 and squeak out a few more ft/lbs please.

I want a "adventure" bike that I can absolutely rip in the canyons but will survive offroad, with that awesome triple, right at 450lbs with 125hp. Oh, get it in under 11500 like normal motorcycles USED to be priced. I'll buy 2 (I'll finance the 2nd one)

So excited... Come on Yamaha!!

Lou
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eakins screwed with this post 02-25-2014 at 03:58 PM
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Old 02-25-2014, 06:07 PM   #17
GrahamD
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eakins View Post
If the picture above is the path they are indeed on, then expect a 500+ lbs bike. Sorry 125hp is NOT needed off road. KTM has 100hp off-road mode for their 1190 because they KNOW above that it's too much and counter-productive. 60-80 hp with alot of torque down low is needed. That's why thumpers work! That's why the 650 strom motor works in the dirt (even with a poor suspension package). Tune the 700 twin that way for the win.
Agree Eakins, but there is this thing called the consumer, that gets a pitter patter going about HP and Stuff. So YAMAHA should give them what they want, first. They could even try and force the engine to be good off road. (Of course a bunch of people will have whinge about that stupid map they put in)

They should really make both. I'll take the 700 if they can commit to a short run well targeted Light DualSport Tourer with actual big range but there are a lot of people that want the comfort and all day-edness and practicality, will opt to go for the gnarly adventure lookalike and not get too gnarly, so for them a light weight, easily broken not great in the rough stuff is in the "real life" need envelope while still looking like they have some "cred".

It's like a very small percentage of Harley riders are the 1%ers, but people like to imagine they are super bad-ass, rather than actually being super bad-ass, otherwise the whole lifestyle thing wouldn't work would it? And even the 1%ers are doing it to fit in these days because then they wouldn't conform to the group. No one remembers why the original 1%ers used to ride Harleys. Then there are other that really just don't know much where they just want a duck and they'll just buy something with webbed feet and feathers, cause there are a lot of people buying ducks so there must be something to it right, so they'll just have what he's having?

I bet one target group outnumbers the others.



And now a bunch of insulted people will go all black and white thinking and assume I was taking about 100% of bike riders of one brand.

It's amazing that people used to ride around on 15HP 1/4 ton motorbikes everywhere, but these days you "need" an Adventurised GP bike.

Marketing has never been about "sensible". Plenty of people ride/drive around in ridiculous machines. Sensible usually only works in hindsight and that's where sales are at Zero. But at least whatever it is (700 or 800) it may be a bit less ridiculous than going to 1300cc for the next "ADV" bike, and I think that consumers may just be sensing that, Step 1 on the road to sensible. Lets hope the ADV segment continues for long enough that the designs finish that journey.

But in the other hand, the photo chop looks a bit "soft road". There is no reason that a lighter bike couldn't be a bit more gnarly, with a few maps etc thrown in for good measure and we are yet to see what really happens.
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GrahamD screwed with this post 02-25-2014 at 07:26 PM
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Old 02-25-2014, 07:05 PM   #18
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Originally Posted by eakins View Post
If the picture above is the path they are indeed on, then expect a 500+ lbs bike. Sorry 125hp is NOT needed off road. KTM has 100hp off-road mode for their 1190 because they KNOW above that it's too much and counter-productive. 60-80 hp with alot of torque down low is needed. That's why thumpers work! That's why the 650 strom motor works in the dirt (even with a poor suspension package). Tune the 700 twin that way for the win.
I certainly agree. A 70-80 hp bike is enough. I've got a 650 GS thumper that works well in gravel/dirt, and does well on the road, but a little more road worthiness is attractive, without adding weight.
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Old 02-26-2014, 02:57 AM   #19
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how about the 700 in this design:

a XT660Z design from Nicolas Vontobel (could had been Jaumev's design as well)
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Old 02-26-2014, 05:43 AM   #20
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Do you mean sticker kit?
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Old 02-26-2014, 06:36 AM   #21
sweetlou
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eakins View Post
If the picture above is the path they are indeed on, then expect a 500+ lbs bike. Sorry 125hp is NOT needed off road. KTM has 100hp off-road mode for their 1190 because they KNOW above that it's too much and counter-productive. 60-80 hp with alot of torque down low is needed. That's why thumpers work! That's why the 650 strom motor works in the dirt (even with a poor suspension package). Tune the 700 twin that way for the win.

Ktm tunes the motor down to 100 but you still have the 150 for on road, which is where this bike will spend 95% of it's time with 95% of it's owners.

Yes. The parallel twin will perform better off road. But it's also the most boring, antiquated motor on the market and not a selling point for a new motorcycle, so when I spend the majority of my time ripping in the canyons, I want that sweet triple sound and performance, not the lame jane nursing home feel of a F800GS

Someone said it above - they will not build to the 1%. If you want an enduro bike, go buy one. IMO, the majority of the market wants a road based "adventure" that can handle offroad, not an offroad bike that can handle the road.

Lou
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Old 02-26-2014, 07:26 AM   #22
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Thumb

Like!

Make mine red and white.
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Old 02-26-2014, 07:33 AM   #23
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If Yamaha can build this triple 1) without de-tuning the motor in any way and 2) without gaining much weight, I will haul ass to the dealer to buy one. that would be a great great bike.

sadly, they will probably show up with 75HP and 500 pounds
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Old 02-26-2014, 09:18 AM   #24
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Originally Posted by whipit1k View Post
If Yamaha can build this triple 1) without de-tuning the motor in any way and 2) without gaining much weight, I will haul ass to the dealer to buy one. that would be a great great bike.

sadly, they will probably show up with 75HP and 500 pounds
I hope they can also , or if possible offer the bike in two configurations like Triumph, for my purposes the 800 Roadie does what I need, but it would be better if it had the power of my Street Triple, and the suspension(working on an upgrade)were adjustable. A sport tourer with this engine coming in under 500lbs and making similar power to the FZ would be a nice addition also.
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Old 02-26-2014, 09:29 AM   #25
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Originally Posted by whipit1k View Post
If Yamaha can build this triple 1) without de-tuning the motor in any way and 2) without gaining much weight, I will haul ass to the dealer to buy one. that would be a great great bike.

sadly, they will probably show up with 75HP and 500 pounds
Why must they always detune? I'm a big boy, I can handle the middle-weight, not-at-all overly powerful, mildly aggressive tune that currently exists Dumb it down with some over-price ride mode selection that 80% of us could do without.

My traction control, like my self enjoyment, is done through my right wrist

Lou
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Old 02-26-2014, 08:39 PM   #26
itsatdm
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There you have it folks. We don't agree on what we want, we just want one.
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Old 02-26-2014, 09:35 PM   #27
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Originally Posted by JBMorse View Post


Looks great. I wonder what it would cost? I wonder if it could achieve a similar on/off road balance to my old Transalp?
Hmmm, that could be a great bike! I hope designers take note of how sensible looking this concept is.
I like that a lot..
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Old 02-27-2014, 09:51 AM   #28
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There you have it folks. We don't agree on what we want, we just want one.
.... With a much larger fuel tank. Thank you!

Paul
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Old 02-27-2014, 11:33 AM   #29
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Originally Posted by sweetlou View Post
I want a "adventure" bike with that awesome triple, right at 450lbs with 125hp. Oh, get it in under 11500 like normal motorcycles USED to be priced.

So excited... Come on Yamaha!!

Lou
With Yamaha's history of building heavy adventure bikes, this dream of a 450 lb triple 125 hp version of one is just that, a dream.

Even their 660cc single cylinder Tenere weights 460 lbs.
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Old 02-27-2014, 01:24 PM   #30
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Sick!
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