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Old 03-05-2014, 08:45 AM   #16
MotoTex
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I got one of those recently as well. I was coming up to the intersection as traffic was pulling away from a light. As I rolled up behind a semi the light was obscured. By the time I saw it again I was in the intersection.

Looking into the matter I was ready to fight it. Then came to find that it is no more a legal process than any other scammer sending a bogus bill in the mail.

Because the letter is not a summons, nor is it issued under the court system, it is essentially a scam perpetrated by the manufacturers of the cameras with revenue shared with the city that allows this foolishness.

The folks sending these don't have a legal leg to stand on and depend upon the sheeple knee-jerking out of ignorance of due process and paying the thing.

The mere fact that it was titled from a city in Texas, with a return address in Arizona and a billing address in Ohio was enough to convince me to just toss it.

Make it a real court matter, then we'll talk.

Many cities have outlawed this revenue stream and all should follow their lead.

Sgt Duster probably won't like this stance. Apologies in advance.
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Old 03-05-2014, 08:54 AM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tick-tock View Post
In my area (metro-Atlanta), some of the jurisdictions have set this scam up so that it is a civil penalty not a criminal one. The good news is that it won't go on your driving record but the bad news is that, if you don't pay it, they will send the bill to collections. Paying a small fine is better than having a ding on your credit report.
From what I have read this is not the case. The credit agencies won't care.

I also read how in some states these douchebags have arranged via statute to prevent online registration renewal if the matter isn't settled, but often you can still snail-mail the registration renewal, or walk into the courthouse and renew your registration. So, it really isn't much of a deterrent.
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Old 03-05-2014, 09:04 AM   #18
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If it didn't come from the courts - Toss it. How can they PROVE you received it to begin with?
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Old 03-05-2014, 09:12 AM   #19
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Originally Posted by Yossarian™ View Post
A parking ticket is not equivalent to a moving violation.
again, that depends on the jurisdiction
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Old 03-05-2014, 09:16 AM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tkent02 View Post
No, it actually doesn't. The laws are different everywhere
correct, laws are different, in my state, it means stop IF you can

and everywhere, it most certainly doesn't mean step on the gas to beat the light, like most people do
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Old 03-05-2014, 09:44 AM   #21
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Originally Posted by randyo View Post

and everywhere, it most certainly doesn't mean step on the gas to beat the light, like most people do
This part is true. But it's fun!
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Old 03-05-2014, 10:09 AM   #22
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Originally Posted by eric1514 View Post
I got a speeding ticket from a roadside camera in Phoenix once. I ignored it for the reason you cited. That was years ago. I've had dealings with the MVD and there seems to be no record of the ticket on file.
It's in collections. You'll find out if you ever apply for a mortgage. Ask me how I know.
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Old 03-05-2014, 10:10 AM   #23
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I understand how deadly running red light can be for us riders.

I was involved in a TC where driver took off after stopping briefly at a red light. had I not slowed and looked for cross traffic (even though I had green) she would have T-boned me. I braked but still collided but was still able to ride home.

However, most of these red light cameras are revenue generators. some of these lights have shorter than usual yellows to get drivers caught in the intersection on a red. I don't mind them catching blatant red light runners but majority of them are chicken shit tickets.
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Old 03-05-2014, 10:18 AM   #24
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When I was living in AZ, I was told by numerous people, including a Mesa PD officer, that if I received a mailed notice from one of the photo radar vans so prevalent around the Phx Metro area and didn't shred it on the spot, I was an idiot.

Again, what proof do they have of receipt? What about the whole thing about confronting your accuser? There's way too many Constitutional issues let alone logistical problems for them to enforce a photo ticket. The only reason these programs are effective is the sheeple that blindly pay the fine without due diligence.
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Old 03-05-2014, 10:23 AM   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fast4d View Post
I understand how deadly running red light can be for us riders.

I was involved in a TC where driver took off after stopping briefly at a red light. had I not slowed and looked for cross traffic (even though I had green) she would have T-boned me. I braked but still collided but was still able to ride home.

However, most of these red light cameras are revenue generators. some of these lights have shorter than usual yellows to get drivers caught in the intersection on a red. I don't mind them catching blatant red light runners but majority of them are chicken shit tickets.
This is true. IIRC, there was a major city in texas that was brought up on lawsuits (and lost) when it was determined that the yellow was purposely shortened in order to generate more revenue.

I'm all about throwing the book at blatant red light runners and speeders in residential areas. 30 in a 25 is one thing, but I often see idiots blasting down my street at 50+. Kids and people walking dogs abound.
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Old 03-05-2014, 10:26 AM   #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Motomedic View Post
When I was living in AZ, I was told by numerous people, including a Mesa PD officer, that if I received a mailed notice from one of the photo radar vans so prevalent around the Phx Metro area and didn't shred it on the spot, I was an idiot.

Again, what proof do they have of receipt? What about the whole thing about confronting your accuser? There's way too many Constitutional issues let alone logistical problems for them to enforce a photo ticket. The only reason these programs are effective is the sheeple that blindly pay the fine without due diligence.
I wonder if a person gets enough of these it'll warrant a process server or LE to serve notice in person.
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Old 03-05-2014, 10:29 AM   #27
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Originally Posted by MotoTex View Post
Sgt Duster probably won't like this stance. Apologies in advance.
Your story isn't the same thing his wife's.

You had a valid case but basically nowhere to fight it.



I don't know how it works in every states I must admit.


But if someone run a light with no "mitigating circumstances" and just toss the ticket away because of a "technicality", yes, I think it's unfair and kinda hypocritical.


Especially when the question comes from a rider and the alleged and punished action is very dangerous for us riders (not only for us but you got the point I guess).
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Old 03-05-2014, 10:31 AM   #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tick-tock View Post
In my area (metro-Atlanta), some of the jurisdictions have set this scam up so that it is a civil penalty not a criminal one. The good news is that it won't go on your driving record but the bad news is that, if you don't pay it, they will send the bill to collections. Paying a small fine is better than having a ding on your credit report.
That is my understanding of how it works in WA, but the collections thing might be a scare tactic to get you to pay.

I am totally against these thing for many reasons, but here's my story.

About a year ago, I received a photo radar ticket for a local city I never go to. After I examined the photo, it wasn't my car's make/model and the license plate was off by one digit. I was so pissed at their incompetence, you should have see the letter I wrote I called them on thier lack of reading ability and suggested that whoever read the plate and issued the ticket needed either a new pair of glasses or to go back to school

We also have a State Legislator where I work, and I let her know my thoughts on the whole money making scam that I don't agree with.

What a bunch of bs these things are. Most of them are run completely by a 3rd party, and all the municipality has to do is cash the checks. I can see why they like them, and safety has nothing to do with it...
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Old 03-05-2014, 11:27 AM   #29
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Most of the drivers I see are shit. They're speeding, they're in a big hurry, they're distracted, they have complete disrespect for the other drivers, they don't give a shit about that red light.

The two red-light-running-camera-tickets I've been involved with, the runner was as guilty as could be. No ifs ands or buts.

Every single one of us has run an "orange light". Man up - admit it! All this hiding behind constitutional issues is valid, of course, but at the end of the day, I believe EVERY one of us, at many points, deserved a ticket we didn't get. Yeah, everyone also has a story about the unfair one that dinged 'em, but I suspect the "orange lights" that we DIDN'T get outweigh the unfair ones we get by a huge margin.

Money making scam? I have no real problem with it. You're a shitty enough driver to run red lights? Fuck you - society DESERVES to profit from your ass-hattery.

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Old 03-05-2014, 11:30 AM   #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SteelJM1 View Post
This is true. IIRC, there was a major city in texas that was brought up on lawsuits (and lost) when it was determined that the yellow was purposely shortened in order to generate more revenue.

I'm all about throwing the book at blatant red light runners and speeders in residential areas. 30 in a 25 is one thing, but I often see idiots blasting down my street at 50+. Kids and people walking dogs abound.
about 20years ago, I got a redlight ticket in Concord, NH, yes, I saw the light turn red as I entered the intersection

I went to court prepared with measurements and timing, proving that there was no time to stop nor time even to completely pass thru the wide intersection

the next comment for the judge was " I have noticed yellow lights are short myself"

needless to say, I was found not guilty, and now the yellow lights in Concord are at least 3 times as long as they used to be
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