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Old 03-30-2014, 11:12 AM   #16
FJ_Kevin OP
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OK, so almost up to date with some of the previously posted material. Next are the comments brought over from the other thread. Sorry if this is repetitive for some but over the long run it should be more helpful to have all this in the same thread.

From WFOPete:

Kevin, Gotta agree there is something "right" looking about a twin shocker. A few years ago I bought a 81 KTM GS250 for Cross Country/MX duty. The GS had been sitting for several years but I had seen it perform and I new the motor ripped. I had about 2 weeks to whip it into shape. I entered a AHRMA ISDT Qualifier and the bike worked super until I stuck the motor. So I had less than one day on the bike and I killed it.

This is what the bike looked like when I first brought it home:



Since then I've had the motor rebuilt, frame painted and the Fox Shocks restored. So this spring is the assembly and hopefully a new life for the old girl. While not as sexy looking as a Husky, the bike is a performer even with me at the controls.

==================

From GreatestGeneration:

vintage Husqvarna that is stuck can be a bit scary. They had Magnesium cases and they are known to get Gut Rot bellow the Crank if Moister has been sitting there long enough. Some times so bad that a hole can be seen buy just looking at the bottom of the motor where the case seem is. Although the European bikes were not known to get to the first corner first compared to the Japanese bikes today they are known for having a great power band for those of us at an advanced age. Café-Husky's Left Kicker is a wealth of info, and Husqvarna-Parts.com make parts buying easy.


==================

From Scootern29:

Thought I would check in on your build thread and lo and behold you bought a Hooskvarna. That is a really cool bike as I have one in my shed waiting to be finished. This example is a 78 CR with the larger forks from the later models which is a direct bolt on. The motor is a 1980 412cc. The Curnutts are set for my riding weight.




The CR's came with Girlings from my recollection, but you could upgrade to Ohlins for some xtra dollars if I remember correctly.


Curnutts came on the OR models as the marketing was for what the team Husky off road guys were using at the time. Some people liked them and some people didn't. The main problem was, and is, that the shocks that were put on the bikes the target weight of the average rider was 175lbs. Curnutts were designed to be set up for individual riders and this was a drastic step in my opinion of what Charles beliefs were.

They were tested extensively by the Husky guys for this model. I was fortunate enough to be able to go out and help test at the time. We had a test track by the shop that had a little bit of everything you could throw at the bikes to dial them in. Another little tid bit is that the shocks the factory guys were running were not brand new out of the box stuff. They were actually used parts as we knew they wouldn't fail. These shocks were also not the original floating valve design of the earlier models. These were the bypass (pin) shocks that could be tuned in many different way's internally. I still have a bunch of parts and rebuild them for quite a few of the vintage guys.

Scott
Curnutt Shocks 75-82
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Old 03-30-2014, 01:23 PM   #17
FJ_Kevin OP
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As this is my 1st time cracking the cases on a vintage Husky I thought I better take lots of photos from various angle for future reference. Especially as I found the transmission to be somewhat fiddly as compared to the YZ465/490's.


Keep in mind that all this is on the '78 390. This should be the same as the 250's of the same era but I am not at all sure about the 430 as I believe these received a fair amount of updates. With that said, lets move ahead!

So like the Yamahas, there is a countershaft and clutch shaft but in this case there are 6-speeds instead of the YZ465's 5-speed (or YZ490 4-speed). Shift forks appear to be steel as opposed to alloy on the yamaha's.



The shift drum "detent" mechanism is resides inside the gearbox. You can see the locating lever, lever spring and front fork all share the same shaft.Yamaha places the corresponding mechanism under the clutch basket and outside the gearbox.




Each shift fork has a pin that rides in the shift drum as is usualy the case. However the pins have steel collars on them. Keep an eye on these as you dont want to loose them as you pull the transmission assembly from the case.
(BTW, using a little grease worked fine in holding these little collars to the pins when re-assembling.)

Now, you cant see it in this photo but the other side of the shift drum has a gear on it.
The shift drum gear meshes with the gear shown at the bottom of photo. This same gear is rotated by the shift shaft mechanism (not shown yet). It only rotates when making a gear shift so is never really under stress and requires no bearing. It rides directly on the shift shaft that passes through it.

When reassembling, it is important to get this gear positioined correctly. This is done by observing the number of gear teeth that are "uncovered" by the shift drum. One tooth should be exposed at the bottom of the gear and two teeth should be exposed at the top.





When I split the cases, the shift shaft stayed in the right side case. The next photo shows what it looks like. That pawl is part of the mechanism and sits on that pin.



This next photo shows the shift shaft, the pawl and a detent pin that is pointed at one end. The other end of the detent pin has a hole for a spring.





To the left of the gear is a hole in the case that accepts the detent spring and the pin. The pawl goes on the shift shaft pin and the shaft, with the pawl, must be flipped over and inserted though the gear. The detent spring and pin must already be in the case before the shift shaft is inserted.

Here is another view with the pawl and shift shaft ready to go back in . Again, the detent pin & spring is already sitting in the case. Yes, it's all very fiddly, but it can be done!




Here is a nice photo found on the web showing the individual parts making up the shifting mechanism. In this view you can see the gear on the back of the shift drum as was discussed above. That drum gear is rotated by the gear in the upper right when making a shift. Also shown are the shift forks, the 3 pin collars, the pawl with detent pin and spring, the shift shaft, the drum locator lever with spring and the shift fork shaft.



So I've focused on the gearbox in this post but I also had plenty of issues with the cases and crank. I'll put those details in a future post.

More to come!






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Old 04-01-2014, 06:22 PM   #18
FJ_Kevin OP
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Oh no! Husky Case Rot!

As already mentioned, the crank case on this bike was filled with what looked like the remains of dried up fuel. I am guessing that this bike had been put into storage with the fuel still in the tank, and over time, that wound up overflowing the carb and filling the case.

It was really quite a mess. So much so that the semi hardened fuel kept the crank from turning over. It took several soakings with WD40 to loosen things up enough to turn the crank through a full 360 degrees.

This photo below shows the right side case. Aside from the expected crud, notice the double row crank bearing. The crank seal is on the other side behind the ignition. This right side seal is easily changed even with the motor assembled.



Although it wasn't pretty, I though all would clean up after a little work with a wire brush. And that was generally true for the right side case shown.

The left side case was another matter. It didn't take long to realize there was considerable corrosion to the magnesium. It was so bad I turned to a drill mounted wire wheel to work through it.

This next series of pictures of the left case tells the story...yes, a severe case of the dreaded Husky case rot... rats!

As you can see, there is a lot of corrosion at the bottom (6 o'clock) of the crank circle. And after picking away at the corrosion at 7 o'clock a hole opened up that goes right through to the gear box!




The screw driver shows the problem quit clearly! Notice that unlike the right side, the left case has the seal on the inside. Of course this means that the left side crank seal cannot be changed without splitting the cases.



And now that same hole but this time the view is from the gear box side.



I thought about trying to weld the hole and corroded areas but already know how tricky magnesium is to weld even when it is clean and in good shape. I just didn't have confidence that I could get a good repair given the extent of the corrosion I was seeing.

The only thing to do was to find a good set of replacement cases.


So I did .

More to come...



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Old 04-03-2014, 06:24 PM   #19
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Alright, so it's been a rather rough start on this old Husky. I mean a bad crank and now bad cases too... jeeze!

Regarding the crank, my 1st thought was to buy a rod kit and rebuild the one I have. But rods for these things aren't so readily available. When you do find one they're fricken expensive, upwards of $400!

So then I looked for a used crank. I bought one "excellent condition" crank off ebay that turned out to be a real piece of crap. Fortunately I was able to return it for a refund although I did have to eat the return shipping.

Eventually I found a really, really nice crank for $200 (ha, that would get you 3 or 4 yz465/490 cranks!).

The cases were a little easier to find. $75 got me a pretty nice set. Although they were pretty nice, the right side case still had a few areas of very light corrosion. I'm finding this to be a common problem with old neglected Huskys.

Anyway, I cleaned the cases thourougly and then filled the few remaining lightly pitted areas with JB weld epoxy. This was to seal the pits in order to prevent any further corrosion.

This JB skimmed area is shown at the 4-5 O'clock position in the following photo.



The next step was to install a new crank bearing, crank seal and cleaned up transmission assembly into the "new" left hand case.

Fortunately, the transmission itself was in near new condition. In fact, I don't think this bike has really seen that much abuse. I believe the case and crank damage was simply a result of sitting a very long time with old fuel (together with condensation) in the crank case.



And now the crank goes in. As in some of the Yamaha rebuilds, I drew the crank through the crank bearing by tightening the crank gear nut against a stack up of spacers and sockets. Here is the transmission assembly and crank fully assembled into the left hand case.




These Husky's also require a center gasket which went on next. I also used a light skim of blue permatex sealer on each gasket mating surface.

The crank must be drawn through the right hand main bearing as the right hand case is mated to the rest of the engine. Once again various combinations of spacers and sockets were stacked up to allow the crank to be pulled through the bearing as the (left hand theaded) flywheel nut was tightened. Care must be used to ensure the spacers/sockets donot impinge in the crank taper while drawing the two halfs together.

The counter shaft must also pass through it's corresponding bearing in the right hand case. This took nothing more than an occasional light tap with the rubber mallet.

Before closing up completely, it doesn't hurt to take a peek at that fiddly shift pawl mechanism to make sure everything is still in place. Here is a photo with the cases almost ready to close.



More to come...





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Old 04-23-2014, 10:42 AM   #20
FJ_Kevin OP
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OK, we last left off with assembly of the crank cases and all went pretty smoothly there once replacement cases and crank were found.

Next up is assembly of the left side of the motor, namely reassembly of the clutch basket and the crank gear.

Here is the 1st photo showing that operation,



It may be difficult to see but the end of the crank is tapered and not splined as seen in the yamaha's. There is a key that is not shown. With the key fitted, the crank gear is assembled onto the end of the shaft and a right hand threaded crank nut is used to hold it all together. The torque setting of the big nut is (will look this up). No washer is used between the gear and the nut.

Also shown is the clutch basket components. First on the clutch shaft is a large washer, then the needle bearing and then on go's the basket. The basket is held on by a snap ring rather than a clutch nut (as seen on the yz465's).



The needle bearing is a nice setup. The Yamaha's use a bronze bushing here. So I would score this one in favor of the Husky.

There are a couple of other things to notice from the photos.
- You can see the left side crank bearing runs in gear oil. So while it a pain to change the crank seal for this bearing (split the cases), the bearing is well lubricated and should last a long time.

- You and also see the shift shaft here (lower right). It is not splined for a shift lever. Instead, it has flats that intercept some additional shift mechanism located in the clutch cover.

- The transmission gear peeking through in the upper right side of the case intercepts the kick gear that is also located in the clutch cover. These (generally pre-1981) Huskys do not have primary kick. You have to put the transmission into neutral before kick starting them. You cannot simply pull in the clutch and kick them over like a yz465/490 or later Husky's. This is seen as a drawback if you should stall while racing because of the additional time it takes to put the bike in neutral. This would certainly be the case for 250's. But I often put my big bore yamahas into neutral before kicking anyway. Mostly to avoid even the lightest additional drag that could keep me from lighting up in a single kick. These days, energy conservation during a race is a big deal!

Anyway, it is interesting to see the different solutions used among manufactures and how they evolved over time.

More to come...







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Old 04-23-2014, 09:30 PM   #21
mikey413
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Thanks for the thread Kevin, I worked at Lakewood Honda Husqvarna in SoCal from 1980 to 1985 and raced Huskys in the desert. This sure brings back some great memories
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Old 04-24-2014, 02:50 AM   #22
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Dang Kevin that bike might actually run pretty soon!
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Old 04-24-2014, 03:49 AM   #23
cnybetass
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[/IMG]Kevin
Good reading on the husky projects.I just put my 79 cr250 together to sell at Unadilla rewind.Am a husky racer from the old days.
Just wondering when you put the crankcases together what gear did you have the tranny in? Keep up the good work.
JR

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Old 04-25-2014, 12:16 PM   #24
FJ_Kevin OP
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mikey413 View Post
Thanks for the thread Kevin, I worked at Lakewood Honda Husqvarna in SoCal from 1980 to 1985 and raced Huskys in the desert. This sure brings back some great memories

Great to have you join us. Please stay with us, there is a long way to go and we need all the Husky experts we can get on this!

Kevin
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Old 04-25-2014, 12:22 PM   #25
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Originally Posted by wfopete View Post
Dang Kevin that bike might actually run pretty soon!
Pete, I am sure you have guessed (spoiler alert) that it is running already . The documentation always lags actual work it seems. Let's keep this our secret for now!

Kevin
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Old 04-25-2014, 12:55 PM   #26
FJ_Kevin OP
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Originally Posted by cnybetass View Post
[/IMG]Kevin
Good reading on the husky projects.I just put my 79 cr250 together to sell at Unadilla rewind.Am a husky racer from the old days.
Just wondering when you put the crankcases together what gear did you have the tranny in? Keep up the good work.
JR
[IMG][/IMG]

Hi JR,

That's a fine looking Husky you have there!

And I am glad you asked that question as I realize now that I left out this important point in my earlier postings on the transmission assembly.

What I think JR is getting to is the fact that the transmission should be shifted into a particular gear before setting the selector gear position relative to the shift drum.

In my case, I put the transmission into 3rd gear as determined by the stopper location in the shift drum detent and then positioned the selector gear for the proper "tooth" exposure as discussed earlier. This procedure came from a Haynes workshop manual.



However, I found a copy of a Husky factory workshop manual that says the the transmission should be in 4th gear!

Did I do something wrong? I am not sure to be honest.

If I look into the future (haha because I can ride it already! ), I know that the transmission seems to be shifting fine and I am getting all six speeds. Am I OK over the long term? I don't know. Maybe both approaches are acceptable.

Perhaps JR can chime in here and give us his opinion.

This is one of the reasons I like to post up these projects rather than put everything into a notebook. It is great to get the feedback and expertise of folks who have been down this path before.

So thanks to JR for bringing this issue up! More to come...

Kevin





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Old 04-25-2014, 01:02 PM   #27
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BTW, here is a photo of the Haynes manual I have been using.

It includes info on the cr360 but not the cr390. Even so, they appear to be quite similar and the photos do seem to show the 6-speed transmission.

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Old 04-25-2014, 05:19 PM   #28
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Previous posts showed a view of the clutch side of the motor with the basket about to go on. I forgot to take a photo after that happened so will use this photo from another motor showing the basket with the pressure plate in place. Five 6mm screws hold the pressure plate as opposed to the 6 screws used on the Yamaha's. No wonder Huskys are so light .




Next is the clutch cover with the kick gear assembly (upper right) and the shift linkage assembly (upper left). The shift linkage assembly consists of two pivot shafts linked together with a connecting rod. The lower pivot shaft has flats that engage with the transmission shift shaft shown in previous photos. The other pivot shaft goes through the clutch cover to meet a splined shift lever. I guess the idea was to translate the pivot point to a better location in relation to the foot peg. It is kind of an odd setup, and maybe an after thought, but it seems to work well enough.



The photo below shows a closer view of the kick start assembly where I have removed the top gear. This is the one that meshes with it's mate in the transmission.

The remaining gear and kick return spring are held in place with a screwed on doodad. This is the doodad thingy that has the two Allen cap screws shown in the photo. There was no real reason to take this apart although I did just to see what was in there .




More to come...





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Old 04-25-2014, 06:05 PM   #29
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Top End

Fortunately this motor had a nice top end on it. The piston and bore were both fresh. I was pretty happy about this after shelling out for the crank ($200) and cases ($100).

However, I noticed that 1 of the 4 bolts that hold on the exhaust flange was missing. I pulled the flange off and found that the bolt was broken off in the cylinder, darn!

And whatever that bolt material was, it was hard. I tried to drill it for an easy out but wound up with dull or broken drill bits instead.

So then I decided I had no choice by to grind a slot out to remove the stud. This would then be followed by some TIG welding to fill the area so I could drill and tap a hole.

It is an ugly process but here are the steps.



I had to grind pretty deep to finally get the darn thing out!



And now a view after some filing and re-drilling of the hole, still a bit of work to do. It was kind of a pain but fortunately it worked out ok in the end .





For some reason my CR390 gasket kit came with the wrong base gasket so I made on out of gasket material I had around.

Then I assembled the new wrist pin and bearing into place.



Here is something else that was a little different. As this next picture shows, a spacer ring is required on each side of the wrist pin bearing. If these are lost or left out, the bearing will not remain centered in the connecting rod. One of the used cranks I had showed evidence of the bearing cage edges riding on the connecting rod. The marks it left ruined the crank. I am speculating that it was run without the proper spacers installed.



And now with the piston and cylinder in place.



This last photo is so I look back at this thread and see what piston size is installed .



More to come...





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Old 04-26-2014, 03:58 AM   #30
cnybetass
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Kevin,I am really enjoying all the old pics and stuff I have much husky memorbila in my man cave.

I have all the husky tools and some good shop manuals if you need any imfo let me no.

Yes the husky shop manual says bike should be in fourth gear but if yours is shifting right it must be ok.

Years ago we tore a motor down Saturday nite at a two day we forgot the gear thing and stayed up most of nite redoing motor.

I am sure I have a base gasket for that 390.

Also have the shop manual for the 430.On this bike it is a good idea to see if the primary kick gear has been upgraded.The early bikes cracked the case where the shaft and gear rode in case.

I have a pretty good memory of stuff so just ask if I can help.

My 430 cr is now in Spain being raced regurly.
JR

cnybetass screwed with this post 04-26-2014 at 04:03 AM Reason: How did you get my picture to show up i am not to computer savy? Thanks
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