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Old 04-03-2014, 12:49 PM   #1
kwh OP
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I dun made me a how to go round a corner video...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qaBtGqHiEyM


It's very long and boring. Although it does have some cool high speed crash analysis in near the end. But hey, it was a lot of work, so I feel duty bound to inflict it on people on the internet forae, because I want you all to feel my pain.
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Old 04-03-2014, 01:34 PM   #2
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Not boring and these guys really know how to turn left on a motorcycle. For those who actually watched the previous offering.
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Old 04-03-2014, 01:35 PM   #3
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I've really sold this, haven't I!
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Old 04-03-2014, 06:04 PM   #4
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I made it 3 minutes and then my internet connection dropped. I then noticed it was 53 minutes long. Does look like you put a bit of time into editing and filming. Was the winter that cold and snowing there as it was for much of the US.

Sorry couldn't do it. Did get me interested in the first book though.
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Old 04-03-2014, 07:52 PM   #5
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Originally Posted by jgiacobbe View Post
I made it 3 minutes and then my internet connection dropped. I then noticed it was 53 minutes long. Does look like you put a bit of time into editing and filming. Was the winter that cold and snowing there as it was for much of the US.

Sorry couldn't do it. Did get me interested in the first book though.
I would say this, but it's worth persevering a little past three minutes :-). There's on bike filming, Inception style graphical effects, and real time slow-motion side by side analysis of somebody being a suicidal lunatic, complete with the triple salco over a cliff at the end when they screw it up. And they couldn't even successfully kill themselves! Not a scratch...

OK, it's 53 minutes of your life you'll never get back, but you could be watching Mork & Mindy reruns so...
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Old 04-03-2014, 07:55 PM   #6
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I would say this, but it's worth persevering a little past three minutes :-). There's on bike filming, Inception style graphical effects, and real time slow-motion side by side analysis of somebody being a suicidal lunatic, complete with the triple salco over a cliff at the end when they screw it up. And they couldn't even successfully kill themselves! Not a scratch...

OK, it's 53 minutes of your life you'll never get back, but you could be watching Mork & Mindy reruns so...
Now that you sell it like that, I'll give it another try. The bit I watched was well done.
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Old 04-04-2014, 03:01 PM   #7
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Now that you sell it like that, I'll give it another try. The bit I watched was well done.

Thank you. You won't regret it.

Unless watching it means you miss that really funny episode in season three where Mork...
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Old 04-04-2014, 10:00 PM   #8
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Damn. Now I have to retract what I've said about the Internet being utterly useless. That was actually informative.
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Old 04-05-2014, 05:19 AM   #9
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Damn. Now I have to retract what I've said about the Internet being utterly useless. That was actually informative.
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Old 04-05-2014, 06:53 AM   #10
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I just finished watching it. Thanks very much for taking the time to make the video.

I also ride on the left side of the road, and had to "flipped left and right" when reading books like David Hough's books, so it's good to see this being talked about from the same point of view
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Old 04-05-2014, 07:26 AM   #11
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Wellp, ya dun good. I like't it a lot and am gown to pass it arun. Gud unya, mate. Jolly good show! And all like that...

This being the famed ADV forum, I feel that it is my duty to nitpick some thing. BUT. The nitpick must not be so infinitesimal as to be utterly worthless and be judged a mockery of the Rites defeating the whole fun purpose of this forum. Thus, I offer 2 items to be kicked around to further the discussion.

1- Body Steering, Code's and others' body steering, is not well understood by the motorcycling masses. Watching the various youtube stunta vids proves that some riders seem to have mastered riding hands-free much better than the rest of us. I ride hands-free on the street way more than most bikers whom I know. Just because Code cannot body steer very well does not preclude others doing a lot better. The difference might be likened to that between the Wright's wing-warping flying controls and Curtis' use of flaps and ailerons, jus' sayin'.

2- Maria is indeed a very beautiful assistant. It would have been a delight to see more of her beauty. Post some more of her on this thread and give her my best wishes, please. She would have been a good example of how to make "target fixation" work for a biker. Being able to recognize the phenomenonmenom and tear one's focus off the death threat and put it on the more desirable 'path to safety' and getting one's body to make a move rather than remain paralysed in fear, might have been emphasized more/better? Lots of bikers do not realize that 'target fixation' is also linked to the 'freeze in place' reaction hoping that the saber-toothed cat doesn't notice one anymore or loses interest in one quickly.
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Old 04-05-2014, 08:06 AM   #12
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Originally Posted by ibafran View Post
Wellp, ya dun good. I like't it a lot and am gown to pass it arun. Gud unya, mate. Jolly good show! And all like that...

This being the famed ADV forum, I feel that it is my duty to nitpick some thing. BUT. The nitpick must not be so infinitesimal as to be utterly worthless and be judged a mockery of the Rites defeating the whole fun purpose of this forum. Thus, I offer 2 items to be kicked around to further the discussion.

1- Body Steering, Code's and others' body steering, is not well understood by the motorcycling masses. Watching the various youtube stunta vids proves that some riders seem to have mastered riding hands-free much better than the rest of us. I ride hands-free on the street way more than most bikers whom I know. Just because Code cannot body steer very well does not preclude others doing a lot better. The difference might be likened to that between the Wright's wing-warping flying controls and Curtis' use of flaps and ailerons, jus' sayin'.

2- Maria is indeed a very beautiful assistant. It would have been a delight to see more of her beauty. Post some more of her on this thread and give her my best wishes, please. She would have been a good example of how to make "target fixation" work for a biker. Being able to recognize the phenomenonmenom and tear one's focus off the death threat and put it on the more desirable 'path to safety' and getting one's body to make a move rather than remain paralysed in fear, might have been emphasized more/better? Lots of bikers do not realize that 'target fixation' is also linked to the 'freeze in place' reaction hoping that the saber-toothed cat doesn't notice one anymore or loses interest in one quickly.
Thank you.

Re. 1, This entire short Youtube video is solid gold & well worth watching (from the Twist of the Wrist 2 DVD, which is well worth buying), but I've linked to where it covers the specific point about handsfree riding...

http://youtu.be/8_5Z3jyO2pA?t=4m26s


Re. 2, I shall let her knowshe has a fan club :-).
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Old 04-05-2014, 03:39 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kwh View Post
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qaBtGqHiEyM


It's very long and boring. Although it does have some cool high speed crash analysis in near the end. But hey, it was a lot of work, so I feel duty bound to inflict it on people on the internet forae, because I want you all to feel my pain.
This is excellent. THANK you!! Very much appreciated, I've shared it with several of my friends.
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Old 04-05-2014, 05:40 PM   #14
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Originally Posted by kwh View Post
Thank you.

Re. 1, This entire short Youtube video is solid gold & well worth watching (from the Twist of the Wrist 2 DVD, which is well worth buying), but I've linked to where it covers the specific point about handsfree riding...

http://youtu.be/8_5Z3jyO2pA?t=4m26s


Re. 2, I shall let her knowshe has a fan club :-).
Yep, that is the Code video that I am familiar with. Code has a bike set up with rigid bars&controls separate from the one's attached to the forks. He calls this bike the "No BS Bike" as it proves to most riders brave enough to ride it that body steer is not the way to do things properly.
Code presents himself as an authority figure. And science history proves how long that lasts. Copernicus vs Tycho Brahe is my fav example. Tycho had collected all the data and still couldn't make it work. But, I give Code credit and lauds for doing the best that he can.
Various moto journo's have ridden Code's No BS Bike and reported how scary it was and that Code must be dead right about steering. I suggest that accomplished riders who are locked into doing things only one way are too scared to learn to ride such a bike. Back in the early 60's (mid-50's?), a guy made goggles that turned the view of the world upside down. He wore them long enough to adapt to them well enough to ride a motorcyle while wearing them. Thus, he proved to himself if no one else that people can adapt to near anything. He also noted that it took only a few hours to re-orient himself after removing the goggles at the end of the experiment.
Furthermore, a carney working the crowd at Sturgis/Hulet in 2001 had a bicycle with the handlebars geared to reverse the steering action. The patsy paid $5 for 3 attempts to ride the bicycle in a straight line for a a maximun of 100 feet. If the patsy got as far as 60 feet, he would win back his $5. And the winnings would increase with footage thereafter out to 100 feet where the patsy would win $50. The rule that made this so profitable was that the rider must have his hands on the bars at all times. Thus, the patsy could not bring himself to hold the bars so gently as to avoid hand steering inputs and essentially ride the bike hands-free using body steering largely for balance and steering. Naturally, the carney could demonstrate how easy it was to ride the bicycle. Of course, rider habituated to "push right, go right" would fail miserably in about 15 feet and the carney got rich.
In conclusion, Code is correct that for most riders body steering is a poor idea compared to using handlebars. Afterall, that is how we learned to ride bicycles in our youth and the skill transfers even though we, as a group, are largely unaware of how we do things. Why learn to do it well any other way? Trying Code's bike on Code's track with Code recording my results has been on my bucket list for a long time. And yes, I have heard all the 'bucket list' jokes about this several times over.

I still think that you have done a masterful job. I especially appreciated the explanation of the 'vanishing point' and the reason why the police and other authorities get out in the opposing lane for a better look at the corner and not for maintaining a particularly high speed as closing speeds can be frightfully short and quick.

Again, kudos to Maria without whom the video would have appeared much duller but no less informative.
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Old 04-05-2014, 08:44 PM   #15
kwh OP
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ibafran View Post
Yep, that is the Code video that I am familiar with. Code has a bike set up with rigid bars&controls separate from the one's attached to the forks. He calls this bike the "No BS Bike" as it proves to most riders brave enough to ride it that body steer is not the way to do things properly.
Code presents himself as an authority figure. And science history proves how long that lasts. Copernicus vs Tycho Brahe is my fav example. Tycho had collected all the data and still couldn't make it work. But, I give Code credit and lauds for doing the best that he can.
Various moto journo's have ridden Code's No BS Bike and reported how scary it was and that Code must be dead right about steering. I suggest that accomplished riders who are locked into doing things only one way are too scared to learn to ride such a bike. Back in the early 60's (mid-50's?), a guy made goggles that turned the view of the world upside down. He wore them long enough to adapt to them well enough to ride a motorcyle while wearing them. Thus, he proved to himself if no one else that people can adapt to near anything. He also noted that it took only a few hours to re-orient himself after removing the goggles at the end of the experiment.
Furthermore, a carney working the crowd at Sturgis/Hulet in 2001 had a bicycle with the handlebars geared to reverse the steering action. The patsy paid $5 for 3 attempts to ride the bicycle in a straight line for a a maximun of 100 feet. If the patsy got as far as 60 feet, he would win back his $5. And the winnings would increase with footage thereafter out to 100 feet where the patsy would win $50. The rule that made this so profitable was that the rider must have his hands on the bars at all times. Thus, the patsy could not bring himself to hold the bars so gently as to avoid hand steering inputs and essentially ride the bike hands-free using body steering largely for balance and steering. Naturally, the carney could demonstrate how easy it was to ride the bicycle. Of course, rider habituated to "push right, go right" would fail miserably in about 15 feet and the carney got rich.
In conclusion, Code is correct that for most riders body steering is a poor idea compared to using handlebars. Afterall, that is how we learned to ride bicycles in our youth and the skill transfers even though we, as a group, are largely unaware of how we do things. Why learn to do it well any other way? Trying Code's bike on Code's track with Code recording my results has been on my bucket list for a long time. And yes, I have heard all the 'bucket list' jokes about this several times over.

I still think that you have done a masterful job. I especially appreciated the explanation of the 'vanishing point' and the reason why the police and other authorities get out in the opposing lane for a better look at the corner and not for maintaining a particularly high speed as closing speeds can be frightfully short and quick.

Again, kudos to Maria without whom the video would have appeared much duller but no less informative.
Funnily enough I've ridden the thing, or the UK version of it, and unsurprisingly it doesn't turn when you shift bodyweight. A better data point might be the two motorcycles I've owned for extended periods that featured electronic cruise control, and which were stable enough that you could take your hands off the bars for long stretches of the motorway and try to get the bike round the curves without putting them back on...
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