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Old 11-16-2014, 09:35 AM   #1
105suz OP
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BLM land grab

Calling on all my ADV friends and inmates, As most of you know I have taken up riding in the desert in Las Vegas specifically Pahrump Valley. A recent action by the BLM Bureau of Land Management is threatening this area. The BLM is trying to seize 3 million acres for what they call RMP Resource Managment Plan and a EIS Environmental Impact Statement. This is nothing more than retaliation for the Clive Bundy ranch Fiasco from last year. This would cripple the town of Pahrump which is a two stop light town now, they are dependent on the traffic to the trails. If you all could please take a few moments to send an E-mail to the BLM expressing your concerns the city of Pahrump and I would appreciate it. SNDO_RMP_@blm.gov and the field office #702-515-5000
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Old 11-16-2014, 10:00 AM   #2
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This is not a "land grab" it is a revision to their 1998 Resource Management Plan. In case you are not aware, the BLM is required to manage the land. Updating plans periodically to address changes in needs is a good thing.

Read more about it:
http://www.blm.gov/nv/st/en/info/new...nevada__1.html

This is standard fare. The BLM proposes 4 alternatives ranging from close everything to leave everything the way it is. Alternative 3 is the BLM's preferred one in this RMP.
Check out the alternatives for motorized use here:
https://www.blm.gov/epl-front-office...cumentId=48656

Compare against the current map:
https://www.blm.gov/epl-front-office...signations.pdf

Or check out this summary map of the differences:
https://www.blm.gov/epl-front-office...signations.pdf

Public comment is taken, changes to the draft plan are made, a final plan is proposed, public comment is opened up again, and eventually a decision is made. Sometime the BLM gets sued by an environmental group for keeping things too open. The process is then slowed down and costs us all a bunch of money. The environmental group gets its legal fees paid via the Equal Access to Justice Act (EAJA), costing us all money again. At the end of the day, the BLM usually wants a balance of open access and environmental protection. Close everything is usually only a viable alternative in very small project areas for very specific reasons. Big areas like Vegas/Pahrump should be a balance. My comments would focus on any specific areas that may change and why that should or should not happen in my option. I would advocate for the insertion of language stating the priority for and the importance of desert racing and backcountry touring opportunities...keep them, as they are important to recreation and economy.

If you want to do something proactive, read the plan and submit meaningful comments. If you want to really do something good, pressure our law makers to change the EAJA so it protects the little guy who needs to sue the feds, but removes the cash cow the environmentalists keep milking.

verboten screwed with this post 11-16-2014 at 10:15 AM
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Old 11-16-2014, 10:09 AM   #3
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Welcome to the NANNY USA.. we tell you what to do and where AND WHEN...In the last 5 years we in the sierra national forest went from an open travel plan to NO TRAVEL unless on designated routes that went through the DEIS planning . No one fought it nor commented. Its a government land grab not just the BLM. No one fights them nor gets involved they do what they want. SAD DEAL...
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Old 11-16-2014, 10:48 AM   #4
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The BLM and forest service can call it what they want. But all these programs end up being "land grabs" by the environmentalists.

We have learned first hand that reading the rules, going to meetings, making substantive comments etc. do not work.

We had a network of maybe 300 miles of fantastic motorcycle single track in the Santa Fe National Forest. We lost 99.9% of it in the MVUM.

We had a large group that followed the correct procedures above including taking a class on how to make substantive comments.

Our comments were completely ignored in the final EIS, Record of Decision and the MVUM.
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Old 11-16-2014, 10:53 AM   #5
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So, you look at all the above and say, man that's a lot of reading.

What are the differences? Look at the comparison map and table in the middle of it.

#1 Changing the "limited to existing roads, trails and dry washes" use currently to "limited to designated routes". This is depicted on the Alternative 1 map as the deep blue areas. Additionally, you will note the shift in acres when comparing the first two lines of the table. See the 0s in Alts 2,3,& 4 and increased in limited to designated routes?

What does this mean? Well, you might lose access to a number of dry washes and tracks that are not or will not be designated. If you use this area, you might want to look deeper and see what routes are existing vs designated.

#2 A reduction in the "OPEN" use area by 10,682 acres.

Where does this happen? The Big Dune SMRA at the north west corner of the map. Is this important to you? You might want to take a closer look at the maps and see how this reduction in area effects recreation. I've never been there, but the original map shows a large rectangular area, the proposed change shows a more naturalistic shape, perhaps indicitive of the actual dune area? I don't know, never been there and don't like sand personally.

#3 An reduction of "Closed to All Motorized or Mechanized Vehicles" area by 137,791 from Alt 1 compared to Alt 3&5. or in other words, INCREASED access to a currently unavailable area.

Is this a good thing? I don't know, you would have to look at if that is just an expansion of mountain biking areas or if it includes motorized use. Visually it looks like the BLM is trying to make lands near transit and population available for recreation, which usually is a good thing. Not being from the area, I am not familiar with it.

Perhaps a knowledgeable local will weigh in on this thread and share some insight. I just developed these conclusions this morning after seeing this thread and looking at the maps. I have not looked a the detailed designated route maps, and that that may prove to be important if any of you use dry washes to get around. Please, take a real look at the maps and send in some meaningful comments. If there are key desert washes or existing routes not designated that connect to other trails you use, this is the time to emphasize the importance of them for connectivity.

A comment like:
"Alternative 3 is pretty good, but it neglects to designate or include *insert names of routes and washes* in the plan. These routes are vital for connecting to *insert names of recreation/trail opportunites*, which are designated as "limited use" areas within the plan. Designating the routes and washes mentioned will promote responsible recreational use in these area, help the BLM achieve their mandate, and maintain access to beautiful natural areas I prefer to enjoy as a responsible motorcycle rider".

is way better than:
"Leave your dirty government paws off my trails"

Your comments need to be specific and actionable to have any impact. Share your thoughts with likeminded people who use these areas. If enough comments come in about specific issues and this is shared with our advocacy groups, the BLM will need to address them. If they do not address them or their action runs counter to an important issue discovered during this process, you have legal standing to challenge the decision.

That's how the environmental and industrial lobbies do it.

Hope this all helps!

verboten screwed with this post 11-16-2014 at 11:03 AM
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Old 11-16-2014, 10:59 AM   #6
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Nearly all of our RMPs in Utah from them last 10-15 years have worked to our favor as motorcycle / dirtbike enthusiasts. A few routes have closed but we are currently expansion of trails and terrain for the most part.

It is important to be part of the process and provide meaningful comments based on their scenarios, as noted above in post #2.

Our experience in Utah is that if you can get involved and be part of the process then you can keep things open.
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Old 11-16-2014, 10:59 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wbbnm View Post
Our comments were completely ignored in the final EIS, Record of Decision and the MVUM.
And that's when you take it to court...
http://nmohva.org/main/issues.php?id=89&archive=0

I met NMOHVA at a NOHVCC conference in 2013. They are frustrated going the legal route, but had to. I wish them success. It is good to have NMOHVA looking out for you in NM.

If you do not participate in the process or simply call it a bunch of crap, the results are worse.
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Old 11-16-2014, 03:04 PM   #8
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Originally Posted by verboten View Post
And that's when you take it to court...
http://nmohva.org/main/issues.php?id=89&archive=0

I met NMOHVA at a NOHVCC conference in 2013. They are frustrated going the legal route, but had to. I wish them success. It is good to have NMOHVA looking out for you in NM.

If you do not participate in the process or simply call it a bunch of crap, the results are worse.
It would indeed make the whole process much better for all if people would stop jumping to wrong conclusions and calling the whole thing a "land grab" or "gov't this that or the other".
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Old 11-17-2014, 06:37 PM   #9
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Originally Posted by sdmichael View Post
It would indeed make the whole process much better for all if people would stop jumping to wrong conclusions and calling the whole thing a "land grab" or "gov't this that or the other".
For those of us who have watched a majority of RODs have major impact on local land access, we realize that comments and emails make little difference when it comes to the MASTERMINDS agenda, beuracrat statist or enviro statist!


Amazing how LOV for BIG GOV slowed this thread down..................
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Old 11-17-2014, 08:20 PM   #10
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Amazing how many fucking retards have no idea how shit works. How else is government supposed to manage the roads it owns? If you can figure out why roads should actually stay open and then justify it with logic and reason (instead of just attacking the whole process all together) then maybe you could actually get something accomplished. The RMP is a feedback process designed to get INPUT FROM THE PUBLIC. They may not always listen, but this is their mechanism for getting this feedback. You have to play by their rules. This is often why the enviros win - because they can figure this out.

If you see the RPM plans they often talk about how they reached the decisions they did. For the campaigns we have run for RMPs we have often gone out of our way to do our best to make sure the input matches our desired outcomes. This is how we win against the enviros and their millions in funding versus us, as volunteers, usually with little or nothing.

You have to (learn to) play by the rules of the people who manage the land. In this case it is the federal government. But it is also often the case with state governments as well, and certainly better than corporations who just lock it off all together. Its amazing how in the days of severe underfunding of the BLM (citing "big government" ) that they can actually keep things open. Keep in mind that a single severe rainstorm can cause millions in damage to roads alone.

I'm not a lefty and definitely not defending big government, but this issue seems to drag the freaks and morons who cant understand that 2+2=4 out of the woodwork. 99.9% of people at the BLM are people just trying to do their job under severe underfunding, retarded government bureaucracy, and lack of employees to meet all of the demands they need to meet.

dieselcruiserhead screwed with this post 11-20-2014 at 03:35 PM
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Old 11-18-2014, 07:14 AM   #11
wbbnm
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This poor agency somehow manages to find money to create Wilderness Study Areas. What a crock, pure unadulterated land grabs.
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Old 11-18-2014, 07:30 AM   #12
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government agencies are nothing more than finger puppets for the powers that be.
Do you really think that we still live in a time when YOUR voice means something?
Do you really think that we still live in a free democracy?
lol
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Old 11-18-2014, 10:04 AM   #13
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Just look at what happen to Clear Creek. Managed by the BLM out of the Hollister California Field Office, by a guy named Rick Cooper. It was closed in 2008. The BLM went in and even took back roads that have belonged to the County of San Benito for many years. They gated the roads. So now to ride there you have to be an outlaw.

Land Grab, you bet ya. What else would you call it?
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Old 11-18-2014, 10:59 AM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by krazykayaker View Post
government agencies are nothing more than finger puppets for the powers that be.
Do you really think that we still live in a time when YOUR voice means something?
Do you really think that we still live in a free democracy?
lol
Might be time with this outlook to just get the hell out
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Old 11-18-2014, 11:13 AM   #15
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It's a lot easier for blm turds to manage wilderness than open lands.
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