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Old 07-29-2014, 04:35 PM   #136
dwoodward
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Originally Posted by 4TooMany View Post
Think about what you're saying... if it's really enough harder that some RC's couldn't pass it, what percentage of brand new students could?
Most of them... with coaching and practice.
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Do your fellow RCs know you're talking smack about them?
I am fairly constantly pleading for them to come to a demo practice or one of the cornering (on a Kart track, with REAL CORNERS) or braking & swerving (on a dragstrip, 70/60mph respectively) clinics put on for Instructors only. The last braking clinic we had room for 36 riders. 7 showed up.

BTW, Instructors, here; Oregon is a non-MSF state, and RiderCoachSM is a registered Service Mark of the MSF.
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Old 07-29-2014, 04:41 PM   #137
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Originally Posted by dwoodward View Post
BTW, Instructors, here; Oregon is a non-MSF state, and RiderCoachSM is a registered Service Mark of the MSF.
Interestingly, the CA MSP specifically prohibits the use of the "I" word when referring to RiderCoachesSM here.
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Old 07-29-2014, 04:59 PM   #138
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Oh come now, it's not that hard. If your average (or even below average) RC couldn't pass, virtually no students could pass.
Oh I agree... And, honestly, that's the thought that's keeping me from panicking about having to pass that riding test.
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Old 07-29-2014, 05:02 PM   #139
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Any rider coach that has spent time on the MSF Retsorg forum knows that nothing but smack is being said about them. I've never seen a group of people who could argue over the dumbest things. They even put JoMamma to shame.
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Old 07-29-2014, 07:14 PM   #140
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Do your fellow RCs know you're talking smack about them?[/QUOTE]

Just don' ask about a kickstart bike....
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Old 07-31-2014, 07:33 PM   #141
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[QUOTE=4TooMany;24726276]T
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Do your fellow Instructors know you're talking smack about them?
I have instructors I have had to drag behind a range shed and tell them to STOP TELLING STUDENTS that the exercises can't be done on "real" bikes, because they can't do them on their bikes.

I know one that has stopped telling students- but still insists otherwise- that ABS has caused him to drop his bike. (U-Turn, eyes down, grabbed a handful of brake, clunk. No skid, no ABS- he just chose to upset the chassis at a bad time.)

We have some that simply refuses to ride demos... because they're not sure they can. They can be coached up to it, but like any rider, any skill- if they don't practice, it goes away. Some people won't practice.

I'm sure these people are out there, in every organization. Eventually they either get better or go away; some on their own, some with encouragement. I prefer they get better, myself, and will happily assist in that. But they have to want to, I can't force it.

Speaking of the upcoming mandatory updates for MSF states: My understanding is there will also be a purge of RC's who simply don't want to learn Yet Another variation of the class. On the surface that may hurt (I've heard as much as 40% won't adapt in some places), but in the long run, it's for the best.
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Old 07-31-2014, 11:01 PM   #142
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Another thought on instructors passing v. students passing: The bar is higher (here) for Instructors. Keeping in mind our test is completely different: for students, after ten points in any section, the max is ten points. For instructors, more than 8 points in any section is an instant fail.

If I read the new MSF scoresheet right (from Vaara's link), the only section with a cap on points is the quick stop, at five points.
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Old 08-01-2014, 06:20 AM   #143
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It's my understanding that when the program changed to the BRC, there was a significant number of instructors who quit because they didn't want to have to learn a new program.

It's my guess that it'll happen again with the rollout of this new program.

Here in VA the bar is set fairly high to pass the riding test in RCP.
No more than 8 points per exercise allowed and no more than 8 points total. So completely screw one exercise and you're done. Also, we did not get any practice time. We jumped onto cold bikes (literally.. it was November, early in the morning, about 30 degrees) and did our riding test.


It drives me nuts that I can't always successfully demo the tighter box... so I practice... and practice... and practice. I even practice on my own bikes. Yes, I still struggle with the CBR1kRR, but that's because I don't want to drop my beautiful girl in a screw up. I know the bike can do it because my son does it, no problem. Show off.... On the FZ-09, I can nail the lefts but the rights are giving me fits because of the width of the bars... I'm having trouble modulating the clutch with a full lock right (I've mentioned I'm tiny, right?). I'm close on the Wee (son's bike) but the rights are a problem, again because of the width... but it's slightly easier on the Wee because the throttle's not as twitchy as it is on the FZ (1st and 2nd gear both)... Hmmmm... just popped into my head, maybe if I put it in B mode (less responsive throttle)....

But yeah, I've seem some RCs who don't want to practice at all and totally screw up demos (especially the box) all the time. Some folks say that they think it eases the pressure on the students because they no longer feel they have to perform perfectly... I personally think it does a disservice to the students because now they're going "Well, if the pro can't do it, how in the world am I supposed to even come close?"

Don't get me wrong, a mistake here/there is one thing (I ran over cones in the perimeter turn last weekend ) but to consistently be unable to successfully ride the demos?

I'm going solo again this weekend... so I have no choice in the matter. I have to ride each and every demo. And it's supposed to rain all weekend. Wheeee.....
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Old 08-01-2014, 06:53 AM   #144
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Scoot up on the seat -- it might give you better clutch control on the rights. . ..
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Old 08-01-2014, 07:08 AM   #145
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Originally Posted by dwoodward View Post
I'm sure these people are out there, in every organization.
Nope. I'm not saying all of our instructors are exactly the same, but every one of our instructors can do every demo and pass with zero points.

Either you're blowing this way out of proportion, or your program sucks at weeding out candidates BEFORE they become instructors.

Still sounds like a wee bit of internet bravado to me.
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Old 08-01-2014, 07:35 AM   #146
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Scoot up on the seat -- it might give you better clutch control on the rights. . ..
I know that trick... I'm almost sitting on the tank! I'm just short.

I'll have to see if I have room to rotate the bars back on the FZ... that'll help, too.
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Old 08-01-2014, 07:56 AM   #147
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[QUOTE=dwoodward;24746575]
Quote:
Originally Posted by 4TooMany View Post
II'm sure these people are out there, in every organization. Eventually they either get better or go away; some on their own, some with encouragement. I prefer they get better, myself, and will happily assist in that. But they have to want to, I can't force it.
Brother, there are none like that in our organization.
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Old 08-01-2014, 12:57 PM   #148
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Vaara.......You completed and passed the RCP...
Whats next??
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Old 08-01-2014, 01:41 PM   #149
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Vaara.......You completed and passed the RCP...
Whats next??
Teaching my first BRC (with extra support) the weekend after next, then another one the following weekend.

At some point there will be a meeting/training about the new classroom curriculum, too.
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Old 08-01-2014, 03:31 PM   #150
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there is the anual profesional developement workshop in october.


The CMSP Professional Development Workshop series registration is now open!

October 4 - Glendale
October 5 - Carlsbad
October 25 - San Jose
October 26 - Sacramento


you should have gotten the email this week.
we will find out what's going on at the meeting.
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